MINI2

steeve · May 8th, 2007, 06:01 AM

Does any one else have a problem with driving at 30 in fourth?

My wifes new car seems to have an annoying flat spot around 1600 revs through to about 2000.
It makes driving in fourth at 30 very difficult, as you press the loud pedal to accelerate nothing happens, its just dead, press the pedal further and it start to go though not as responsive as the old cooper.
My new S will happily sit in fourth at 30.

KenL · May 8th, 2007, 06:23 AM

Mine doesn't do this.

Does the engine check show up "OK" in the computer?

I would take it to the dealer, you might need an ECU re-flash or something?

steeve · May 8th, 2007, 11:03 AM

KenL, thanks for the information, 'er indoors was going to call the Dealer today, I'll see what they say, but its good to know its not typical.

Martin L · May 8th, 2007, 12:11 PM

4th gear, 1600-2000rpm, 1.6l VVT engine with little torque.
What do you expect??? It's not a V8

SteveBrass · May 8th, 2007, 12:19 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by steeve (original)

Does any one else have a problem with driving at 30 in fourth?

My wifes new car seems to have an annoying flat spot around 1600 revs through to about 2000.
It makes driving in fourth at 30 very difficult, as you press the loud pedal to accelerate nothing happens, its just dead, press the pedal further and it start to go though not as responsive as the old cooper.
My new S will happily sit in fourth at 30.

I shall experiment going home tonight, although I reckon 1600rpm in fourth much below 30mph probably means gear change.

Otter Boy · May 8th, 2007, 12:29 PM

Not to sound bi.....y, but I would never run ANY car in 4th gear at 30. Lug, Lug, Lug

Maybe should have got an automatic!!

TonyM · May 8th, 2007, 01:28 PM

Ours does this but I assumed it was just a matter of getting used to the different gear ratios.

If you drop it down to 3rd gear it is at least as responsive as the old Cooper and still more economical.

laura f · May 8th, 2007, 04:48 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by Martin L (original)

4th gear, 1600-2000rpm, 1.6l VVT engine with little torque.
What do you expect??? It's not a V8

Fair point and it does improve the more you have it (whether thats the car or us people)

shavedsporty · May 8th, 2007, 06:21 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by steeve (original)

Does any one else have a problem with driving at 30 in fourth?

My wifes new car seems to have an annoying flat spot around 1600 revs through to about 2000.
It makes driving in fourth at 30 very difficult, as you press the loud pedal to accelerate nothing happens, its just dead, press the pedal further and it start to go though not as responsive as the old cooper.
My new S will happily sit in fourth at 30.

hi is this the bmw/psa 1.6 engine? if so my 207 gt with the same engine does exectly the same! It has been back to the dealer 3 times. It is ok for a week or then it comes back. Only happen between 1 - 2000 revs. I find it dangerous at roundabouts because unless you thrash it you dont know if it is going to pick up are just die like you said. I am thinking of rejecting mine with Peugeot! I would love to know more about this. Had loads of complaints at Peugeot about this engine!

KenL · May 8th, 2007, 06:49 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by Otter Boy (original)

Not to sound bi.....y, but I would never run ANY car in 4th gear at 30. Lug, Lug, Lug

Maybe should have got an automatic!!

Cheeky

4th is fine at 30 if you are pottering along. I would not floor the throttle from here but it will pull away smoothly without labouring.

steeve · May 9th, 2007, 05:53 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by Martin L (original)

4th gear, 1600-2000rpm, 1.6l VVT engine with little torque.
What do you expect??? It's not a V8

Well the previous mini cooper was fine, this is not just a lack of torque, its as if the accelerator pedal doesnt do anything for several degrees of movement.

steeve · May 9th, 2007, 05:56 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by Otter Boy (original)

Not to sound bi.....y, but I would never run ANY car in 4th gear at 30. Lug, Lug, Lug

Maybe should have got an automatic!!

It should accelerate smoothly and doesnt, the old cooper was fine, my new S is fine and will run happily at relatively low engine revs, so long as the engine doesnt lug it should be no problem.

Its really more noticeable leaving junctions (as shavedsporty mentions), its not just in the high gears but its more easily felt at low revs in fourth. I'm sure unlike some you dont all revs the nuts off your cars at junctions and roundabouts.

msh441 · May 9th, 2007, 06:04 AM

I've got a little stumble in mine. All gears between about 3000 and 3200 RPM. No vibration or noise, just a dip in power.

Since it's in all gears I'm assuming ECU programming relating to boost control. I hope that future ECU program updates will smoooth this out a bit.

Harpo · May 9th, 2007, 08:05 AM

In the old days, you would drive at 30 in top gear (at that time, 4th).

Modern engines, more gear ratios and traffic levels demand a different approach.

I would not attempt to drive 30 in fourth, always third for me, and that also has the benefit of being able to judge your speed by the sound of the engine.

I always adopt the principle of: 30 in third, 40 in fourth and 50 in 5th.

Harpo · May 9th, 2007, 08:38 AM

In the old days, you would drive at 30 in top gear (at that time, 4th).

Modern engines, more gear ratios and traffic levels demand a different approach.

I would not attempt to drive 30 in fourth, always third for me, and that also has the benefit of being able to judge your speed by the sound of the engine.

I always adopt the principle of: 30 in third, 40 in fourth and 50 in 5th.

steeve · May 9th, 2007, 11:22 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by Harpo (original)

In the old days, you would drive at 30 in top gear (at that time, 4th).

Modern engines, more gear ratios and traffic levels demand a different approach.

I would not attempt to drive 30 in fourth, always third for me, and that also has the benefit of being able to judge your speed by the sound of the engine.

I always adopt the principle of: 30 in third, 40 in fourth and 50 in 5th.

And I suppose you dont use 6th until youre doing 60? Hate to have to pay your fuel bills.
Modern cars should be considerably better than old ones, electronic engine management and more accurate fueling with fuel injection, along with far better overall engine balancing, stiffer FEA designed blocks, five bearing cranks (the list is endless) should make for a much smoother running engine, 30 in fourth shouldnt be any big deal. My S is fine, my old 3.2 A3 would pull away and run super smooth at 30 in fifth if I wanted, though it was a V6. I dont think we should be doing at least 2000 rpm before letting the clutch out either do you rev to 2 grand before starting off all the time?. This flat spot is in all gears just more noticeable in the higher gears. The new car should be an improvement over the old one and for driveability currently the new Cooper is not.

SteveBrass · May 10th, 2007, 06:05 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by SteveBrass (original)

I shall experiment going home tonight, although I reckon 1600rpm in fourth much below 30mph probably means gear change.

Experiment done.

Pulls from 25 mph at about 1500 in 4th.

Growled a bit of course but picked up alright - on a slight incline as well.

steeve · May 11th, 2007, 05:53 AM

Thanks for doing that steve, confirm once again that the Dealers "they all do that" is just a load of b*****ks

LizzyG · May 11th, 2007, 06:12 AM

Yep, mine is ok too, pulls well in fourth even below 30mph.

Yellow/Black OneD · May 11th, 2007, 11:42 AM

Is this the Petrol Cooper we are talking about? If so, why is it been driven at below 4,500rpm in the first place?

My Diesel MINI only really begins to 'pull' at 1700rpm

P.S. Harpo, sounds like a good theory to me, unless i'm 'going for it', then +20-30mph in each gear!!! Labouring an engine is as bad as thrashing it-I try not to do either

May 8th, 2007, 06:01 AM	#1
steeve Steeve My Classifieds Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Far Corfe Local Time: 05:03 PM Posts: 275 Offline	Cooper with a flat spot .... Does any one else have a problem with driving at 30 in fourth? My wifes new car seems to have an annoying flat spot around 1600 revs through to about 2000. It makes driving in fourth at 30 very difficult, as you press the loud pedal to accelerate nothing happens, its just dead, press the pedal further and it start to go though not as responsive as the old cooper. My new S will happily sit in fourth at 30.

May 8th, 2007, 06:23 AM	#2 (permalink)
KenL MINI2 Master Join Date: May 2002 Location: Edinburgh Local Time: 05:03 PM Posts: 5,210 Offline	Mine doesn't do this. Does the engine check show up "OK" in the computer? I would take it to the dealer, you might need an ECU re-flash or something? Red/Black R56 Cooper

May 8th, 2007, 12:11 PM	#4 (permalink)
Martin L MINI defector Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Harefield Local Time: 05:03 PM Posts: 13,597 Offline	4th gear, 1600-2000rpm, 1.6l VVT engine with little torque. What do you expect??? It's not a V8 MINI, RX8 and MX5 - Done those............. It's now TTime Unofficial MINI2.com bean counter

May 8th, 2007, 12:19 PM	#5 (permalink)
SteveBrass MINI2 Senior My Classifieds Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: staffordshire (not a Local Time: 05:03 PM Posts: 384 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by steeve (original) Does any one else have a problem with driving at 30 in fourth? My wifes new car seems to have an annoying flat spot around 1600 revs through to about 2000. It makes driving in fourth at 30 very difficult, as you press the loud pedal to accelerate nothing happens, its just dead, press the pedal further and it start to go though not as responsive as the old cooper. My new S will happily sit in fourth at 30. I shall experiment going home tonight, although I reckon 1600rpm in fourth much below 30mph probably means gear change. R56 AB Cooper

May 8th, 2007, 12:29 PM	#6 (permalink)
Otter Boy The Mini In ME Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Portland, Maine Local Time: 11:03 AM Posts: 128 Offline	30 In 4th Gear? Not to sound bi.....y, but I would never run ANY car in 4th gear at 30. Lug, Lug, Lug Maybe should have got an automatic!!

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May 8th, 2007, 11:03 AM	#3 (permalink)
steeve Steeve My Classifieds Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Far Corfe Local Time: 05:03 PM Posts: 275 Offline	KenL, thanks for the information, 'er indoors was going to call the Dealer today, I'll see what they say, but its good to know its not typical.

May 8th, 2007, 01:28 PM	#7 (permalink)
TonyM MINI2 Master Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Stonehouse, Glos Local Time: 05:03 PM Posts: 1,026 Offline	Ours does this but I assumed it was just a matter of getting used to the different gear ratios. If you drop it down to 3rd gear it is at least as responsive as the old Cooper and still more economical.

May 8th, 2007, 04:48 PM	#8 (permalink)
laura f lucky number 7? My Classifieds Join Date: May 2004 Location: Northern Mini Local Time: 05:03 PM Posts: 19,925 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by Martin L (original) 4th gear, 1600-2000rpm, 1.6l VVT engine with little torque. What do you expect??? It's not a V8 Fair point and it does improve the more you have it (whether thats the car or us people) \| My Gallery \| My Flickr \|

May 8th, 2007, 06:21 PM	#9 (permalink)
shavedsporty MINI2 Newbie Join Date: May 2007 Local Time: 05:03 PM Posts: 7 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by steeve (original) Does any one else have a problem with driving at 30 in fourth? My wifes new car seems to have an annoying flat spot around 1600 revs through to about 2000. It makes driving in fourth at 30 very difficult, as you press the loud pedal to accelerate nothing happens, its just dead, press the pedal further and it start to go though not as responsive as the old cooper. My new S will happily sit in fourth at 30. hi is this the bmw/psa 1.6 engine? if so my 207 gt with the same engine does exectly the same! It has been back to the dealer 3 times. It is ok for a week or then it comes back. Only happen between 1 - 2000 revs. I find it dangerous at roundabouts because unless you thrash it you dont know if it is going to pick up are just die like you said. I am thinking of rejecting mine with Peugeot! I would love to know more about this. Had loads of complaints at Peugeot about this engine!

May 8th, 2007, 06:49 PM	#10 (permalink)
KenL MINI2 Master Join Date: May 2002 Location: Edinburgh Local Time: 05:03 PM Posts: 5,210 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by Otter Boy (original) Not to sound bi.....y, but I would never run ANY car in 4th gear at 30. Lug, Lug, Lug Maybe should have got an automatic!! Cheeky 4th is fine at 30 if you are pottering along. I would not floor the throttle from here but it will pull away smoothly without labouring. Red/Black R56 Cooper

May 9th, 2007, 05:53 AM	#11 (permalink)
steeve Steeve My Classifieds Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Far Corfe Local Time: 05:03 PM Posts: 275 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by Martin L (original) 4th gear, 1600-2000rpm, 1.6l VVT engine with little torque. What do you expect??? It's not a V8 Well the previous mini cooper was fine, this is not just a lack of torque, its as if the accelerator pedal doesnt do anything for several degrees of movement.

May 9th, 2007, 05:56 AM	#12 (permalink)
steeve Steeve My Classifieds Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Far Corfe Local Time: 05:03 PM Posts: 275 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by Otter Boy (original) Not to sound bi.....y, but I would never run ANY car in 4th gear at 30. Lug, Lug, Lug Maybe should have got an automatic!! It should accelerate smoothly and doesnt, the old cooper was fine, my new S is fine and will run happily at relatively low engine revs, so long as the engine doesnt lug it should be no problem. Its really more noticeable leaving junctions (as shavedsporty mentions), its not just in the high gears but its more easily felt at low revs in fourth. I'm sure unlike some you dont all revs the nuts off your cars at junctions and roundabouts.

May 9th, 2007, 06:04 AM	#13 (permalink)
msh441 MINI2 Senior Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Pacific NW Local Time: 09:03 AM Posts: 439 Offline	I've got a little stumble in mine. All gears between about 3000 and 3200 RPM. No vibration or noise, just a dip in power. Since it's in all gears I'm assuming ECU programming relating to boost control. I hope that future ECU program updates will smoooth this out a bit. Founding member of R56 Anonymous: "Hello. My name is Mike. I'm a driving enthusiast... and I still like the R56"

May 9th, 2007, 08:05 AM	#14 (permalink)
Harpo Havin' fun... My Classifieds Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: ...on the run. Local Time: 05:03 PM Posts: 4,523 Offline	In the old days, you would drive at 30 in top gear (at that time, 4th). Modern engines, more gear ratios and traffic levels demand a different approach. I would not attempt to drive 30 in fourth, always third for me, and that also has the benefit of being able to judge your speed by the sound of the engine. I always adopt the principle of: 30 in third, 40 in fourth and 50 in 5th. The Return of The Ridgeway - Sunday May 25th 2008 The Arctic Circle Run - Summer 2008

May 9th, 2007, 08:38 AM	#15 (permalink)
Harpo Havin' fun... My Classifieds Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: ...on the run. Local Time: 05:03 PM Posts: 4,523 Offline	In the old days, you would drive at 30 in top gear (at that time, 4th). Modern engines, more gear ratios and traffic levels demand a different approach. I would not attempt to drive 30 in fourth, always third for me, and that also has the benefit of being able to judge your speed by the sound of the engine. I always adopt the principle of: 30 in third, 40 in fourth and 50 in 5th. The Return of The Ridgeway - Sunday May 25th 2008 The Arctic Circle Run - Summer 2008

May 9th, 2007, 11:22 AM	#16 (permalink)
steeve Steeve My Classifieds Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Far Corfe Local Time: 05:03 PM Posts: 275 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by Harpo (original) In the old days, you would drive at 30 in top gear (at that time, 4th). Modern engines, more gear ratios and traffic levels demand a different approach. I would not attempt to drive 30 in fourth, always third for me, and that also has the benefit of being able to judge your speed by the sound of the engine. I always adopt the principle of: 30 in third, 40 in fourth and 50 in 5th. And I suppose you dont use 6th until youre doing 60? Hate to have to pay your fuel bills. Modern cars should be considerably better than old ones, electronic engine management and more accurate fueling with fuel injection, along with far better overall engine balancing, stiffer FEA designed blocks, five bearing cranks (the list is endless) should make for a much smoother running engine, 30 in fourth shouldnt be any big deal. My S is fine, my old 3.2 A3 would pull away and run super smooth at 30 in fifth if I wanted, though it was a V6. I dont think we should be doing at least 2000 rpm before letting the clutch out either do you rev to 2 grand before starting off all the time?. This flat spot is in all gears just more noticeable in the higher gears. The new car should be an improvement over the old one and for driveability currently the new Cooper is not.

May 10th, 2007, 06:05 PM	#17 (permalink)
SteveBrass MINI2 Senior My Classifieds Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: staffordshire (not a Local Time: 05:03 PM Posts: 384 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by SteveBrass (original) I shall experiment going home tonight, although I reckon 1600rpm in fourth much below 30mph probably means gear change. Experiment done. Pulls from 25 mph at about 1500 in 4th. Growled a bit of course but picked up alright - on a slight incline as well. R56 AB Cooper

May 11th, 2007, 05:53 AM	#18 (permalink)
steeve Steeve My Classifieds Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Far Corfe Local Time: 05:03 PM Posts: 275 Offline	Thanks for doing that steve, confirm once again that the Dealers "they all do that" is just a load of b*****ks

May 11th, 2007, 06:12 AM	#19 (permalink)
LizzyG MINI2 Senior Join Date: Mar 2007 Local Time: 05:03 PM Posts: 383 Offline	Yep, mine is ok too, pulls well in fourth even below 30mph.

May 11th, 2007, 11:42 AM	#20 (permalink)
Yellow/Black OneD Clubman D Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Staffordshire Local Time: 05:03 PM Posts: 1,312 Offline	Is this the Petrol Cooper we are talking about? If so, why is it been driven at below 4,500rpm in the first place? My Diesel MINI only really begins to 'pull' at 1700rpm P.S. Harpo, sounds like a good theory to me, unless i'm 'going for it', then +20-30mph in each gear!!! Labouring an engine is as bad as thrashing it-I try not to do either

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