[pubert]

Hi All,

I need a bit of advice about rejecting my R56 S. For ages now I've had the gearbox problem
that others have had, the grinding noise when changing from 3rd to 2nd gear.

Last Wednesday our car had a new clutch and flywheel installed, even though the technical
bloke at mini said that this would not fix the problem. Well, he was right, driving the car today
the noise happened again 3 times in short drive to town, the first time it was fairly quiet but
the second and third time it got worse and louder.

I'm really cheesed off with this now, on top of other problems we've had with the car, I've had
enough of it.

I've decided to reject the car, which is really sad because my partner and I really love it, but we're
both fed up with wondering what's going to go wrong with it next. We want to go back to a
R53 S because we dont want to risk getting another R56 and it having the same problem
again.

I've never had to reject a car before, so I suppose my question is, How do you go about doing
it? I've read that I need to send a letter to my dealer and mini, does anybody know what the
address is for mini, that I need to send the letter to. Also what do I need to put in the letter, do
I need to go all consumer act on them or will just a simple letter stating I want to reject and the
reason why do.

Many thanks for any help or advice you can offer.

pubert

[JG.26]

Quote: Originally Posted by pubert (original)

Hi All,

I need a bit of advice about rejecting my R56 S. For ages now I've had the gearbox problem
that others have had, the grinding noise when changing from 3rd to 2nd gear.

Last Wednesday our car had a new clutch and flywheel installed, even though the technical
bloke at mini said that this would not fix the problem. Well, he was right, driving the car today
the noise happened again 3 times in short drive to town, the first time it was fairly quiet but
the second and third time it got worse and louder.

I'm really cheesed off with this now, on top of other problems we've had with the car, I've had
enough of it.

I've decided to reject the car, which is really sad because my partner and I really love it, but we're
both fed up with wondering what's going to go wrong with it next. We want to go back to a
R53 S because we dont want to risk getting another R56 and it having the same problem
again.

I've never had to reject a car before, so I suppose my question is, How do you go about doing
it? I've read that I need to send a letter to my dealer and mini, does anybody know what the
address is for mini, that I need to send the letter to. Also what do I need to put in the letter, do
I need to go all consumer act on them or will just a simple letter stating I want to reject and the
reason why do.

Many thanks for any help or advice you can offer.

pubert

Sorry to hear of your problems How many attempts at fixes has your dealer had? I think if it's more than 3 attempts for the same problem then you should be in a better position for rejecting your car. I'm sure there are one MINI2 members who could advise especially as some have had the same gearbox problem and followed the rejection route. Why on earth did your dealer fit a new flywheel and clutch if they said it wouldn't solve the problem I would have thought a new gearbox would have been better. I know a member on here (KenL I think) indicated what you should put in your letter of rejection, basically stating the problems, number of fixes etc and that you feel the vehicle is not fit for it's purpose. I would guess keep it simple and polite. I always think with garages it's better to be polite but firm rather than going in with all guns blazing.

Best of luck, it's very downheartening having lots of probs on a new car, one day I will return to a MINI but not until the niggles are sorted.

[pubert]

Hi JG, cheers for the advice, yep, your right, I meant to say gear box and not clutch, I dont
understand why they did the repair either, the tech guy did say it was a known problem,
that there was a puma out on it and that the fix mini suggested, replace gearbox etc, did
not actually fix the problem.

I believe it was a couple of days later that they phoned up and told us to bring the car down to
do the the very repair they said did'nt work.

Actually while I was writing my original post, my partner went to the shop in the car and the
grinding has got even worse, thats a 200 yard drive.

This is the first attempt on fixing the gearbox, but it's not just this problem, we've had around
8 or so other problems, ranging from the wing mirror dropping off when I was cleaning the car
to the boot door not unlocking, cruise control not working, the drivers window making very loud
banging noises when it is closed, doors not locking, trim on the front of the car coming off,
aircon not working.

I know these are fairly minor issues and are easily fixed, but it's the cumulative effect, and the
wondering all the time, what's going to go wrong next.

It's a shame, this is our 3rd mini, and we really really love this car, but it just seems to be one
thing after another with it.

pubert

[Martin F]

There is a lot of advice about this on other threads.

But a few points.

Firstly your contract is with your dealer. You can copy MINI if you wish but there is no legal need to do so. However, if the car is purchased on finance, the finance company may be jointly liable with the dealer for the problems, so they should be copied with any letters you send.

Secondly, you can only reject goods under the relevant law ( S35 of the Sale of Goods Act 1979 as amended ) within a "reasonable time". As you seem to have had your car for around 6 months, you may have left it too long to enforce rejection by law. However, your dealer may nevertheless be prepared to exchange the car. I think you may not have a strong legal case and agree with JG.26's advice that you keep it simple and polite.

In your letter you should say pretty much what you said in your post above about the problems and your frustration/disappointment and say you are rejecting the car and then see if you can negotiate a satisfactory settlement. Once you have said you are rejecting it you should not use it and should ask the dealer to collect it, or deliver it to the dealer with the keys etc and walk away.

You may feel it is better to try to reach an amicable settlement rather than attempt rejection. That is your decision.

[popey]

I rejected my first S. I would first talk to the dealer. I never had to write one letter when rejecting my car. I think having the dealers on your side is a huge help. Also Scrogg gave me some great advice as did so many other members of MINI2.

[pubert]

Thanks for the replies guys, I was wondering if I had left it too long, we've had the car 5
months now. We did report the gringing noise to the dealer the first time we heard it, about
2 month ago, but like others, they take the car in to diagnose it and they cant get the noise
to happen.

Fortunately we have a good relationship with our dealer, one of them even joked we'd end
up with a new car, so we'd like to keep all this as friendly as possible, I dont like going in all
guns blazing and getting all legal, that would only break the good communication down, that
we have.

We've decided to go in on Monday and talk to the rep that sold us the car, to look at our options
and see if we can resolve the issue. We're willing to give them another chance to fix it, but we
want them to agree that if that fails we can exchange the car for another, either a R53 S
or failing that, another R56 S.

I'll keep you informed as to what happens.

pubert

[popey]

The gridding noise made is caused by two incompatible textures coming into contact when you let the clutch up. You can get rid of the noise be driving the car up to mid/high RPMs (forgot exact figure) and then dropping down into 2nd and letting the clutch out. This I’m told creates enough friction to smooth the two surfaces. However the down side of this is it will reduce the life expectancy of the clutch.
I for one am waiting for the fix, I think it will be at least a new flywheel but more than likely a new clutch as well.

[Mr Gary]

Quote: Originally Posted by popey (original)

The gridding noise made is caused by two incompatible textures coming into contact when you let the clutch up. You can get rid of the noise be driving the car up to mid/high RPMs (forgot exact figure) and then dropping down into 2nd and letting the clutch out. This I’m told creates enough friction to smooth the two surfaces. However the down side of this is it will reduce the life expectancy of the clutch.
I for one am waiting for the fix, I think it will be at least a new flywheel but more than likely a new clutch as well.

IMPORTANT (don't quote these figures and get the garage to do it)
Mine has been in and had a Puma measure carried out which consisted of them driving on a flat surface at approx 50mph in 4th, then depressing the clutch and putting it in high revs, then releasing the clutch. Carried this out three times I think. They are confident this will resolve the problem. They have however asked that I listen carefully for the noise and let them know if it returns.
So fare so good. I have driven it hard and dropped it into 2nd on a few spirited occasions and there is NO NOISE. Could there be light at the end of the tunnel?

[pubert]

This is interesting advice, I did this yesterday morning, although I drove the car up to 60mph,
then when approaching my favourate roundabout put the car in to second gear and got it to
rev nicely, dont know what revs it was at, I was watching the road, but it sounded as though
it was up in the 6000rpm area.

Well, on the way to the dealers for my talk with them, I could not make the noise return, I took
a bit of a diversion and drove around sheffield airport, plenty of roundabouts etc, and could not
got that noise to re-appear.

So visit to dealer cancelled, and I'll just do what Mr Gary is doing and keep my ears open to
see if the noise does eventually return.

fingers crossed.
pubert

[Mr Gary]

Popey has a valid point re additional wear though and this is something I have mentioned to my dealer on a number of occasions.
Once all my problems are resolved... and there are a few more (New master brake cylinder etc), I will be demanding at least a new clutch. My reasons are simple and I think fair...
1) The fault discussed in this thread. Although it may be resolved... those noises and the subsiquent fix are just not normal. There must have been additional wear.
2) The Ratle at low revs (had a new alternator to fix that). Although the problem had now gone, I was riding my clutch in traffic and when pulling away for the first 10K to stop the rattle until they replaced the alternator.
I also had my boot chipped when it was in for one of the warranty issues. All in all a bloody nightmare.

[OttoMannS]

Amazing. The customer has to literally burn his/her clutch to machine finish contact surfaces that the factory failed to do in the first place. Carry on chaps. Here in my neck of the woods I know of a few R56 that have had their gearboxes replaced only to have the same noise return.