[minichara]

Hi all,
I noticed that many members have installed the JCW kit.
But I also noticed that almost nobody has dyno-run his car to see the actuall gain.
I open this topic in order to attach dyno runs for this kit in order for the members that want to install it to have a clear idea if it is really worth it or not.
I hope that you will participate....

[msh441]

180 hp at the wheels. 204 lbft of torque.



***I would also suggest that if anyone else posts up... please be clear wheter your figuers are wheel, brake or crank horsepower... and if its not at the wheels, what correction factor was used to determine driveline loss.

[mason storm]

Quote: Originally Posted by msh441 (original)

180 hp at the wheels. 204 lbft of torque.



***I would also suggest that if anyone else posts up... please be clear wheter your figuers are wheel, brake or crank horsepower... and if its not at the wheels, what correction factor was used to determine driveline loss.

Those look like good figures at the wheel, I wonder what that works out at the crank?

[msh441]

Quote: Originally Posted by mason storm (original)

Those look like good figures at the wheel, I wonder what that works out at the crank?

All depends on what correction factor you subscribe to... 1% here or there is 1-2hp.

I tend to think the Getrag tranny through a FWD car is going to be pretty efficient, so 12-14% which would come to a conservative 201-205.

Many have suggested 15% is the "proven" figure for the gen 1 MINI's (though I have yet to see where or how this was determined), so 207.

The 3 or 4 European dynos iI've seen are using 22%, which would come to 219.

So you can see how the horsepower at the wheels, or at least stating the correction factor, becomes very important. 201 vs. 219 hp is a BIG difference, right!?! Particularly when we know we're talking about the same car making the same power at the wheels.

[lortos_diam]

hi,
since minichara appears to be Greek, I have a question for Greek owners of Coopser Ss

I ave ordered a Cooper S with a Chili Package and although it is supposed to include the Sport Suspension, I was told that I specifically have to mention it in the order list. Otherwise, it will not be on the car.

Does anyone have any relevant information?
thanx


by the way I have ordered the JCW Kit to be installed by the dealer as well.

[mason storm]

Quote: Originally Posted by msh441 (original)

All depends on what correction factor you subscribe to... 1% here or there is 1-2hp.

I tend to think the Getrag tranny through a FWD car is going to be pretty efficient, so 12-14% which would come to a conservative 201-205.

Many have suggested 15% is the "proven" figure for the gen 1 MINI's (though I have yet to see where or how this was determined), so 207.

The 3 or 4 European dynos iI've seen are using 22%, which would come to 219.

So you can see how the horsepower at the wheels, or at least stating the correction factor, becomes very important. 201 vs. 219 hp is a BIG difference, right!?! Particularly when we know we're talking about the same car making the same power at the wheels.

True, but even the conservative figures suggest more bhp in this case than the 189bhp that mini quote for the kit which is good news.

[minichara]

Quote: Originally Posted by lortos_diam (original)

hi,
since minichara appears to be Greek, I have a question for Greek owners of Coopser Ss

I ave ordered a Cooper S with a Chili Package and although it is supposed to include the Sport Suspension, I was told that I specifically have to mention it in the order list. Otherwise, it will not be on the car.

Does anyone have any relevant information?
thanx


by the way I have ordered the JCW Kit to be installed by the dealer as well.

Hi bro,
my mini has the chilli packet and the sport suspension was included in the kit.
Check it with your dealer again.
You can contact also Clubmini

[lortos_diam]

did you specifically mention it in the order list, separately from the chili pack?

thanx

[campfreddie]

Sports suspension is a no cost option in conjunction with the chilli pack. you must specify that you want it.

[lortos_diam]

I think this is the deal in most of the countries in Europe. In Greece, I was told by my dealer that there is a special agreement with BMW-Greece to include it in all chilis regardless of whether the customer has mentioned it or not.....

I hope my dealer is right..........

[minichara]

I thing that it is pretty weird that there are so many members that have installed the JCW kit, but almost nobody has dyno his car in order to notice the actuall gain...

[msh441]

Quote: Originally Posted by minichara (original)

I thing that it is pretty weird that there are so many members that have installed the JCW kit, but almost nobody has dyno his car in order to notice the actuall gain...

I kinda think this thread went waaaaayyyyy off topic early on and has yet to come back... but here's a pair of theads with f few charts in each:

MINI COOPER :: North American Motoring - R56 S JCW Dyno results

...and the MINI2 thread that pretty much covered it:

http://www.mini2.com/forum/2nd-gen-j...orks-dyno.html

As far as the gains... I think it been pretty well established that the kit puts out at least an 20whp gain over stock. Most owners seem satisfied. What more are you looking for?

[minichara]

It is one dyno of one car in the States.
What I am looking for is EU car numbers of owners in order to make a comparison, see the actual gains, and also see differences between cars that have installed these packages.
Thanks

[msh441]

Quote: Originally Posted by minichara (original)

It is one dyno of one car in the States.

Look again. The NAM link has at least three separate JCW dynos. One Euro car and 3 or 4 US cars.

Once the driveline loss is factored in, US an Euro cars seem to make the same max power (+/- 3-4 hp, which could easily be due to dyno conditions). So you're looking for the same car with a before and after?

[gasss]

MCS R56 Stock and R56 JCW figures, both at inertial Maha dyno, 5 gear used, sp98 shell v-power, show hp engine with DIN correction used, environmental conditions similar at two graphs (more or less, no relevant or important differences)

MCS Stock
-207cv at 5900rpm
-295nm at 3300rpm

MCS JCW
-214cv at 5400 and 5800rpm
-301nm at 3300rpm

i love jcw curve and the new sensations at the wheel, the torque figure up to 260nm from 1900rpm to 5800rpm, it is amazing drive the car on the road, really happy and
satisfied with the jcw kit, to finish, the new sound is really pretty, much better than stock, and fuel consumption is a bit lower than stock.

regards from Madrid

[Tara&Paul]

Quote: Originally Posted by gasss (original)

MCS R56 Stock and R56 JCW figures, both at inertial Maha dyno, 5 gear used, sp98 shell v-power, show hp engine with DIN correction used, environmental conditions similar at two graphs (more or less, no relevant or important differences)

MCS Stock
-207cv at 5900rpm
-295nm at 3300rpm

MCS JCW
-214cv at 5400 and 5800rpm
-301nm at 3300rpm

i love jcw curve and the new sensations at the wheel, the torque figure up to 260nm from 1900rpm to 5800rpm, it is amazing drive the car on the road, really happy and
satisfied with the jcw kit, to finish, the new sound is really pretty, much better than stock, and fuel consumption is a bit lower than stock.

regards from Madrid

How much is that in BHP?

[MINIAC]

Quote: Originally Posted by Tara&Paul (original)

How much is that in BHP?

cv (cheval vapeur) is the same thing ... metric horsepower.

[gasss]

cv and bhp is the same unit, but i think it isnt important, maximum or differents numbers about cv/bhp or nm/lb torque depend dyno type, factor correction used, loss quantity, fuel class used, etc i´ve run the car on a MAHA inertial dyno that show power engine just applies DIN correction; at this dyno it´s no possible to know wheel engine like msh441 graph, because this dyno have car wheel loss and the own dyno roller loss.

I think the really and most important is compare the way of the curves, torque and power curves, watch like the jcw torque keep in up almost 2000rpm more than stock, driving the car on the road, it is the most notorious and really amazing

regards from Madrid

[Tara&Paul]

Quote: Originally Posted by MINIAC (original)

cv (cheval vapeur) is the same thing ... metric horsepower.

Thanks. I'm not as dumb as I look, really I'm not....I couldn't be really, could I?

[minigolf]

We had a dyno day in Sydney last Friday night. It was a bit odd as the stock cars (R53 mainly) all gave pretty good numbers, but the modded R53s were all down on expectations. The fan setup was not ideal so I wonder if the ECU on the modded cars was throwing in more fuel to keep things safe??? Anyway, that's all by the by, there were two R56s in attendance, one a stock auto, the other a Stage I JCW manual.

These are the results, with some R53 figures thrown in for comparison:

2007 R56 stock = 116kW
2007 R56 JCW = 129kW
2006 R53 Checkmate stock = 116kW
My 2004 R53 modded = 127kW (15%, ALTA CAI, Milltek cat-back, MTH Tuner file)*

*Interestingly a 2002 JCW MCS only pulled 102kW, and an 05 MCS with the same mods as me pulled 120kW, so as with most dyno days we all came away scratching our heads.