MINI2

Lohen · Mar 16th, 2007, 04:17 PM

Hi everyone,

We have just completed our initial testing on the R56 Cooper S in preparation for future tuning modifications. We tested the car on three separate rolling roads over the past two weeks. The same fuel was used in each case. Just thought we would share the results we've found:

1) 204.8bhp - 195.9lbf.ft
2) 196.0bhp - 178.6lbf.ft
3) 195.4bhp - 197.1lbf.ft

Looks as though it's producing more than 175bhp!

Nick
Lohen

popey · Mar 16th, 2007, 04:21 PM

WOW, great to see, so 198.7 Average BHP.

Paul · Mar 16th, 2007, 04:22 PM

Interesting. EVERY test so far seems to be around 200 HP.

KenL · Mar 16th, 2007, 05:05 PM

Good figures.

The variation in the rolling road tests are interesting. 10bhp looks like a big spread but when you think +/-2.5% error they are not too bad.

AMT · Mar 16th, 2007, 05:25 PM

If these engines are producing 190+ bhp, why on earth do MINI quote them as 175? Can't be good business!??

Restyle · Mar 16th, 2007, 05:38 PM

I find it hard to believe that a manufacturer such as BMW would publish figures that are not fully reliable.
After all, it would certainly do them no harm whatsoever to state the base Cooper S achieves over 190bhp with the new engine.
I would tend to go with the BMWs official figures rather than an independants rolling road figure, as they would have tested it on some of the best equipment in the World, although your figures do throw up some interesting points.
Like :- How often do the independants Rolling Roads have to be calibrated, & who does it ?

Do the manufacturers official bhp figures come from an independant testing authority like the ones who do the official mpg tests in each country ?
Surely the insurance companies rely on exact bhp figures for their risk assessments ?

{My Lohen conversion still going great Nick}

wo53 rks · Mar 16th, 2007, 05:46 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by AMT (original)

If these engines are producing 190+ bhp, why on earth do MINI quote them as 175? Can't be good business!??

Maybe so when they bring out the JCW they can charge a fortune for a 220 conversion and do very little at all????????

CC07ERS · Mar 16th, 2007, 05:47 PM

So what do you have to offer us then Lohen in the way of modding our r56 then . We awit with baited breath.

ru81 · Mar 16th, 2007, 05:48 PM

I have to say my R56 MCS seems more than 5 bhp quicker than my previous R53 MCS. Whether this is solely due to the increase in torque I'm not sure. I would definately say the R56 seems like it has closer to 200 bhp, but like others say, I can't believe BMW would get this wrong.

popey · Mar 16th, 2007, 05:49 PM

3 rolling roads all faulty by the same same difference five or take 2.5%, what are the chances.

Its a conclusive test by professionals with a respected and proven background in this area.

popey · Mar 16th, 2007, 05:50 PM

So much for the JCW 195 conversion

Paul · Mar 16th, 2007, 05:52 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by Restyle (original)

I find it hard to believe that a manufacturer such as BMW would publish figures that are not fully reliable.
After all, it would certainly do them no harm whatsoever to state the base Cooper S achieves over 190bhp with the new engine.

Regularly the first generation Cooper would read about 123 bhp as standard. Although the S always seemed more accurate. It does happen. But I agree that 20 or so HP is a fair bit out!

wo53 rks · Mar 16th, 2007, 05:56 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by popey (original)

So much for the JCW 195 conversion

Kit includes rear tail pip trims
Front and Rear JCW badges
Yours for £2000 + Vat

anissut · Mar 16th, 2007, 06:01 PM

Put it this way I know people who have E60 M5s. At least 4 different cars all tested well over the quoted 507bhp and nearer to 530bhp. I don't think it's that strange. Manufacturers regularly under quote performance figures, ie: 0-60 figures as well and noone questions that. As people have mentioned in the motoring press and those who have driven them the Cooper S is quicker than the quoted 7.1 secs to 62 mph.

AMT · Mar 16th, 2007, 06:04 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by wo53 rks (original)

Maybe so when they bring out the JCW they can charge a fortune for a 220 conversion and do very little at all????????

I think you may be right. All about marketing & sales

*Vikki* · Mar 16th, 2007, 06:08 PM

I was told the same as anissut re the manufacturers regulary under quoting figures

Sir Johnaraz · Mar 16th, 2007, 06:18 PM

Thanks for the useful info !!

Manufacturers under quoting bhp figures, on the other hand over quoting £££

Olly. · Mar 16th, 2007, 07:08 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by Restyle (original)

I find it hard to believe that a manufacturer such as BMW would publish figures that are not fully reliable.
After all, it would certainly do them no harm whatsoever to state the base Cooper S achieves over 190bhp with the new engine.
I would tend to go with the BMWs official figures rather than an independants rolling road figure, as they would have tested it on some of the best equipment in the World, although your figures do throw up some interesting points.
Like :- How often do the independants Rolling Roads have to be calibrated, & who does it ?

Do the manufacturers official bhp figures come from an independant testing authority like the ones who do the official mpg tests in each country ?
Surely the insurance companies rely on exact bhp figures for their risk assessments ?

{My Lohen conversion still going great Nick}

Wouldn't it mean the car recieved a lower insurance rating though? This maybe motivation to underquote so that buyers can afford to insure the car.

msh441 · Mar 16th, 2007, 07:11 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by Lohen (original)

Hi everyone,

We have just completed our initial testing on the R56 Cooper S in preparation for future tuning modifications. We tested the car on three separate rolling roads over the past two weeks. The same fuel was used in each case. Just thought we would share the results we've found:

1) 204.8bhp - 195.9lbf.ft
2) 196.0bhp - 178.6lbf.ft
3) 195.4bhp - 197.1lbf.ft

Looks as though it's producing more than 175bhp!

Nick
Lohen

Very similar to the numbers posted by Randy Webb (of Webb Motorsports) over on NAM: MINI COOPER :: North American Motoring - Webb Motorsports R56 testing starts!

Grassroots Motorsports has posted some 0-60 (MPH) numbers in the 5.7 range, too:
Grassroots Motorsports » 2007 MINI Cooper S

Sounds like the new car is a screamer.

Fanis · Mar 16th, 2007, 07:14 PM

I have heard a few times about the new engine producing more than the stated 175 BHP. Two cars tested in Greece (by differents mags) were producing 174 and 176 BHP on the Wheel which is around 190BHP on the Flywheel.

Mar 16th, 2007, 04:17 PM	#1
Lohen New Mini Specialists Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Staffordshire, UK Local Time: 05:46 AM Posts: 862 Offline	Benchmark of R56 Cooper S Hi everyone, We have just completed our initial testing on the R56 Cooper S in preparation for future tuning modifications. We tested the car on three separate rolling roads over the past two weeks. The same fuel was used in each case. Just thought we would share the results we've found: 1) 204.8bhp - 195.9lbf.ft 2) 196.0bhp - 178.6lbf.ft 3) 195.4bhp - 197.1lbf.ft Looks as though it's producing more than 175bhp! Nick Lohen New MINI Specialists www.lohen.co.uk

Mar 16th, 2007, 04:22 PM	#3 (permalink)
Paul Trained Monkey My Classifieds Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Big grey box Local Time: 05:46 AM Posts: 40,514 Offline	Interesting. EVERY test so far seems to be around 200 HP. Trained Monkeys

Mar 16th, 2007, 05:05 PM	#4 (permalink)
KenL MINI2 Master Join Date: May 2002 Location: Edinburgh Local Time: 05:46 AM Posts: 5,105 Offline	Good figures. The variation in the rolling road tests are interesting. 10bhp looks like a big spread but when you think +/-2.5% error they are not too bad. Red/Black R56 Cooper

Mar 16th, 2007, 05:38 PM	#6 (permalink)
Restyle Damned My Classifieds Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Shropshire Local Time: 05:46 AM Posts: 4,269 Offline	I find it hard to believe that a manufacturer such as BMW would publish figures that are not fully reliable. After all, it would certainly do them no harm whatsoever to state the base Cooper S achieves over 190bhp with the new engine. I would tend to go with the BMWs official figures rather than an independants rolling road figure, as they would have tested it on some of the best equipment in the World, although your figures do throw up some interesting points. Like :- How often do the independants Rolling Roads have to be calibrated, & who does it ? Do the manufacturers official bhp figures come from an independant testing authority like the ones who do the official mpg tests in each country ? Surely the insurance companies rely on exact bhp figures for their risk assessments ? {My Lohen conversion still going great Nick} In da Wud

Mar 16th, 2007, 05:46 PM	#7 (permalink)
wo53 rks MINIMAD My Classifieds Join Date: May 2006 Location: south wales Local Time: 05:46 AM Posts: 216 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by AMT (original) If these engines are producing 190+ bhp, why on earth do MINI quote them as 175? Can't be good business!?? Maybe so when they bring out the JCW they can charge a fortune for a 220 conversion and do very little at all???????? Taking care of business

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Mar 16th, 2007, 04:21 PM	#2 (permalink)
popey Wanted an Audi My Classifieds Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Blackpool Local Time: 05:46 AM Posts: 1,788 Offline	WOW, great to see, so 198.7 Average BHP.

Mar 16th, 2007, 05:25 PM	#5 (permalink)
AMT MINI2 Senior Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Edinburgh Local Time: 05:46 AM Posts: 449 Offline	If these engines are producing 190+ bhp, why on earth do MINI quote them as 175? Can't be good business!??

Mar 16th, 2007, 05:47 PM	#8 (permalink)
CC07ERS TYPE R GT VTEC POWERED My Classifieds Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Type R GT Local Time: 05:46 AM Posts: 2,718 Offline	So what do you have to offer us then Lohen in the way of modding our r56 then . We awit with baited breath.

Mar 16th, 2007, 05:48 PM	#9 (permalink)
ru81 MINI2 Regular Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Oxfordshire Local Time: 05:46 AM Posts: 271 Offline	I have to say my R56 MCS seems more than 5 bhp quicker than my previous R53 MCS. Whether this is solely due to the increase in torque I'm not sure. I would definately say the R56 seems like it has closer to 200 bhp, but like others say, I can't believe BMW would get this wrong.

Mar 16th, 2007, 05:49 PM	#10 (permalink)
popey Wanted an Audi My Classifieds Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Blackpool Local Time: 05:46 AM Posts: 1,788 Offline	3 rolling roads all faulty by the same same difference five or take 2.5%, what are the chances. Its a conclusive test by professionals with a respected and proven background in this area.

Mar 16th, 2007, 05:50 PM	#11 (permalink)
popey Wanted an Audi My Classifieds Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Blackpool Local Time: 05:46 AM Posts: 1,788 Offline	So much for the JCW 195 conversion

Mar 16th, 2007, 05:52 PM	#12 (permalink)
Paul Trained Monkey My Classifieds Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Big grey box Local Time: 05:46 AM Posts: 40,514 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by Restyle (original) I find it hard to believe that a manufacturer such as BMW would publish figures that are not fully reliable. After all, it would certainly do them no harm whatsoever to state the base Cooper S achieves over 190bhp with the new engine. Regularly the first generation Cooper would read about 123 bhp as standard. Although the S always seemed more accurate. It does happen. But I agree that 20 or so HP is a fair bit out! Trained Monkeys

Mar 16th, 2007, 05:56 PM	#13 (permalink)
wo53 rks MINIMAD My Classifieds Join Date: May 2006 Location: south wales Local Time: 05:46 AM Posts: 216 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by popey (original) So much for the JCW 195 conversion Kit includes rear tail pip trims Front and Rear JCW badges Yours for £2000 + Vat Taking care of business

Mar 16th, 2007, 06:01 PM	#14 (permalink)
anissut MINI2 Regular My Classifieds Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: London Local Time: 06:46 AM Posts: 85 Offline	Put it this way I know people who have E60 M5s. At least 4 different cars all tested well over the quoted 507bhp and nearer to 530bhp. I don't think it's that strange. Manufacturers regularly under quote performance figures, ie: 0-60 figures as well and noone questions that. As people have mentioned in the motoring press and those who have driven them the Cooper S is quicker than the quoted 7.1 secs to 62 mph.

Mar 16th, 2007, 06:04 PM	#15 (permalink)
AMT MINI2 Senior Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Edinburgh Local Time: 05:46 AM Posts: 449 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by wo53 rks (original) Maybe so when they bring out the JCW they can charge a fortune for a 220 conversion and do very little at all???????? I think you may be right. All about marketing & sales

Mar 16th, 2007, 06:08 PM	#16 (permalink)
Vikki Winner MM best MINI ONE! My Classifieds Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: St Leonards-on-Sea Local Time: 05:46 AM Posts: 2,179 Offline	I was told the same as anissut re the manufacturers regulary under quoting figures

Mar 16th, 2007, 06:18 PM	#17 (permalink)
Sir Johnaraz Greek Mini My Classifieds Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: London Local Time: 06:46 AM Posts: 188 Offline	Thanks for the useful info !! Manufacturers under quoting bhp figures, on the other hand over quoting £££

Mar 16th, 2007, 07:08 PM	#18 (permalink)
Olly. Overboosting..... Join Date: Sep 2003 Local Time: 06:46 AM Posts: 3,458 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by Restyle (original) I find it hard to believe that a manufacturer such as BMW would publish figures that are not fully reliable. After all, it would certainly do them no harm whatsoever to state the base Cooper S achieves over 190bhp with the new engine. I would tend to go with the BMWs official figures rather than an independants rolling road figure, as they would have tested it on some of the best equipment in the World, although your figures do throw up some interesting points. Like :- How often do the independants Rolling Roads have to be calibrated, & who does it ? Do the manufacturers official bhp figures come from an independant testing authority like the ones who do the official mpg tests in each country ? Surely the insurance companies rely on exact bhp figures for their risk assessments ? {My Lohen conversion still going great Nick} Wouldn't it mean the car recieved a lower insurance rating though? This maybe motivation to underquote so that buyers can afford to insure the car.

Mar 16th, 2007, 07:11 PM	#19 (permalink)
msh441 MINI2 Senior Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Pacific NW Local Time: 10:46 PM Posts: 439 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by Lohen (original) Hi everyone, We have just completed our initial testing on the R56 Cooper S in preparation for future tuning modifications. We tested the car on three separate rolling roads over the past two weeks. The same fuel was used in each case. Just thought we would share the results we've found: 1) 204.8bhp - 195.9lbf.ft 2) 196.0bhp - 178.6lbf.ft 3) 195.4bhp - 197.1lbf.ft Looks as though it's producing more than 175bhp! Nick Lohen Very similar to the numbers posted by Randy Webb (of Webb Motorsports) over on NAM: MINI COOPER :: North American Motoring - Webb Motorsports R56 testing starts! Grassroots Motorsports has posted some 0-60 (MPH) numbers in the 5.7 range, too: Grassroots Motorsports » 2007 MINI Cooper S Sounds like the new car is a screamer. Founding member of R56 Anonymous: "Hello. My name is Mike. I'm a driving enthusiast... and I still like the R56"

Mar 16th, 2007, 07:14 PM	#20 (permalink)
Fanis MINI2 Regular Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Athens, Greece Local Time: 07:46 AM Posts: 154 Offline	I have heard a few times about the new engine producing more than the stated 175 BHP. Two cars tested in Greece (by differents mags) were producing 174 and 176 BHP on the Wheel which is around 190BHP on the Flywheel. Caedite eos. Novit enim Dominus qui sunt eius.

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