[Impulsive]

Can you specify which method (springs or coilovers or whatever), approximate cost, AND what you did about camber (keeping tires from excessive wear), if anything?

I'm thinking of, say, H&R springs but haven't done enough research into camber plates or anything to help.

[guppy]

when you lower the car, are spings all thats nescessary? or will u need new shocks?

[Impulsive]

No clue but since I wouldn't be racing/tracking the car and since I've read of others (not just MINIs) who have only used springs as it's the cheapest route, I'd think, rather hope, that springs alone are fine?

Anyone (especially experts and those with experience) want to opine?

[newyorkaddict]

Quote: Originally Posted by Impulsive (original)

Can you specify which method (springs or coilovers or whatever), approximate cost, AND what you did about camber (keeping tires from excessive wear), if anything?

I'm thinking of, say, H&R springs but haven't done enough research into camber plates or anything to help.

When i lowered my Civic Type R, i used only springs. But had to get it realigned, and had a Fast Road Setup done at the same time. Think it is not much different for Mini's, as the suspension tends to go slighlty out of line, you just need to get it dialed in really. Usually takes a coupleof hours by a good garage.

[msh441]

I went with MINI's Sport Suspension and added a set of H&R Sport Lowering springs. Just under $500 USD installed.

I've seen a few coilover sets come up so far. The cheapest seems to be about $1500 for the set itself. Installating should add about $200-300, unless you do it yourself... then just add the costs of a re-alignment ($50-60).

I did NOT go with adjustable end links in the rear (as some have suggested) as the slight bit of negative camber on the car is not only less than either of my dad's BMW's... it actually seems to be keeping the rear planted nicely (mine would wag it's tail a little under hard braking, just before cornering - controllable, but still...). Just watch for wear on that inside rear tire edge.

Overall, it depends what you want to do with the car and how much you want to spend.

[Impulsive]

I can't imagine that an alignment alone could fix the camber issue front and back ... I want only to lower the car (will never race or track it) and want it aligned both back and front into spec. To use the H&R springs msh441 has mentioned, can the wheels be brought back to spec (I don't want negative camber wearing my tires) or do I need to worry about other avenues like camber plates?

[mister.t]

Is this of any use? http://www.mini2.com/forum/2nd-gen-w...its-lower.html

[msh441]

Quote: Originally Posted by Impulsive (original)

I can't imagine that an alignment alone could fix the camber issue front and back ... I want only to lower the car (will never race or track it) and want it aligned both back and front into spec. To use the H&R springs msh441 has mentioned, can the wheels be brought back to spec (I don't want negative camber wearing my tires) or do I need to worry about other avenues like camber plates?

The front will be fine. For the rear, if you want zero negative camber (or at least as close to stock as you can get)... you'll need to fork out an additional $300 or so to get a set of adjustable end links whether you go for coilovers or springs alone.

[guppy]

yay i finally got my r56 today haha well anyways with those h and r springs, how much camber wear is there? when i installed coilovers on my gsr my car was pretty bounctastic, is it the same deal with minis? will the stock shocks blow after a while? how hard is it to install the springs? im not a car expert but after watching poeple install springs on honda, i figured it out myself, samd with minis? im not really sure about the mc peterson struts or wat the heck that is. haha

[Impulsive]

Ollie, it was only useful in reinforcing the fact that it NEEDS to be lowered as that car looked good, but there was nothing mentioned about keeping camber in spec, front or back.

msh441, are you absolutely sure that the fronts can be adjusted to within spec? If the rears need new adj. end links, for sure, then so be it. I only want to do it once and do it right for as little as possible.

Lastly, as guppy asked, will there be any issue with factory shocks/struts after lowering 1"-2"?

[Impulsive]

One more reason why I'm pressing the camber issue ... Off the NAM site, someone posted "I saw three of the R56 MINI's in a garage preview for our club at our local dealer this afternoon. The mechanic told us that both the front and rear toe in and camber are adjustabe."

If he believes, assuming this applies to the 'S', both front and rear are adjustable, is there any way to confirm dropping the car 1"-2" can be done without hurting stock camber settings?

[msh441]

Quote: Originally Posted by Impulsive (original)

msh441, are you absolutely sure that the fronts can be adjusted to within spec? If the rears need new adj. end links, for sure, then so be it. I only want to do it once and do it right for as little as possible.

Lastly, as guppy asked, will there be any issue with factory shocks/struts after lowering 1"-2"?

Well, when I had my re-allignment done, the figures showed everything on the front end was back within recommended specs. But I unfortunately don't have a "before and after" figures to compare what, if anything, exactly changed... so I can't say it's exactly the same. I will say that there is no visible camber angle on the front (positive, or negative).

With the stock shock bodies (sport or standard), that decreased amount of travel due to lowering will allow the shocks/struts to bottom under the hardest hits (just as most lowererd MINI's have done in the past, too). I believe the different valving from the Sport Suspension might help this a little as they compress at a slower rate and appear stiffer... but it can still happen if you don't watch for the potholes. So take it easy on the rough stuff.

You can avoid bottoming by going with a strut with a short shock body... but then you run the risk of the tires rubbing the fender wall if bottomed and not properly set up/adjusted (ie. if youre allowing for more travel with a smaller shock, the wheel and tire still need to go somwhere under compression, right? You may not bottom, but the tire may rub. So which is worse?).

Quote: Originally Posted by Impulsive (original)

One more reason why I'm pressing the camber issue ... Off the NAM site, someone posted "I saw three of the R56 MINI's in a garage preview for our club at our local dealer this afternoon. The mechanic told us that both the front and rear toe in and camber are adjustabe."

If he believes, assuming this applies to the 'S', both front and rear are adjustable, is there any way to confirm dropping the car 1"-2" can be done without hurting stock camber settings?

For clarification, there is a hex-head pin in the top of the strut tower that once removed, allows for a small amount of adjustment in camper op top (as reported by Grassroots Motorsports-as they intentionally added some negative camber for their autocross setup). That said, I left mine in, and again, according to the alignment machine (and the feel of the front end) it's spot on.

I don't believe the rears are adjustable without an end link replacement (I'm 99.9% sure on this one). Again, there is some visible negative camber present after lowering. It's no worse than any other spring-lowered MINI I've seen (or stock BMW, for that matter - they ALLWAYS have a good deal of negative camber in the rear). Overall, it's not a bad thing and greatly improved the handling on my car. If it bugs you, go for the springs and just get the adjustable links to dial it in the way you want. I just didn't think it was necessary, myself.

If you can get Ryephile to answer some of these questions here, or over at NAM, he may be able to give you some better numbers than I can (just search over at NAM and see where I asked a lot of these questions myself before lowering). I also posted the actual alignment measurements over there of my car once it was lowered (if you're able to interprit them-'cause it's kind of greek-to-me).

Hope this helps a little.

[guppy]

does anyone have a comparison between springs or which they perfer?

[guppy]

hey does anyone know the difference between the sports suspension and the regular? i have the sports so i was wondering if it would be a waste of money if i upgraded the shocks? where do you guys buy your suspension from if your located in USA? the website im at seems to only sell koni and a few other brands(minimania.com). another site i see sells eibach pro kit that lowers 20mm. it says for 02+ so will it work for a r56? 20mm isnt that much huh? since i have the sports suspension, will it less than 20mm?

[Impulsive]

Thanks, msh441 ... re: the shortened strut/shock bodies, no way. I want to spend as little as I have to which hopefully amounts to only getting a set of H&R springs and rear end links. My concern then turns to the life of the SS struts, shocks and towers if I'm basically riding on the bump stops constantly. I don't want to have to replace anything in, say, 5 years. All I want is to lower the car as cheaply as possible to within spec so I'm not wearing the tires quicker than I would without lowering the car. I probably will see if I can get ryephile to try and help too. But you've been great.

guppy, I don't know if any other manufacturer has springs out yet for the R56.

[msh441]

Quote: Originally Posted by Impulsive (original)

... My concern then turns to the life of the SS struts, shocks and towers if I'm basically riding on the bump stops constantly. I don't want to have to replace anything in, say, 5 years. All I want is to lower the car as cheaply as possible to within spec so I'm not wearing the tires quicker than I would without lowering the car.

The main issue with bottoming is where the energy is being transferred. On the previous generation cars the strut towers turned out to be a week link, and a good deal of owners mushroomed the metal around the strut towers.

For a little extra insurance, I would recommend the M7 Stut Tower re-inforcement plates (once availible for the R56), or some type of strut tower brace where the mounting points cover the entire strut tower and firm up that area a litte. It's being said that the R56 has been beefed up in that area, but I'm going for a set. $100+/- for some peace of mind when encountering that unseen pothole.

[Impulsive]

Damn, more money. I can understand the energy absorption up top but, more importantly, how will the springs and shocks hold up 5 years later having to work 1"-2" shorter than they normally would?