Don't forget the front wheel drive factor either.
The extra horsepower will be more use when you are moving rather than from a standing start. I would be more interested in the 1/4 mile times...

Originally posted by dinger
BMW now want to launch the
Cooper S Works Worldwide on 1st Jan 2003 and have removed the cars from John
Coopers so no test drive will be available. :(

I would just like to note that BMW have not removed our cars, we just are not at liberty to allow test drives until the development, testing and approval has been completed.

Please also note that the performance figures quoted are only an estimate at this stage as development has not been completed. We will publish official figures shortly before the launch.

We know you are all very keen for more information, but please be patient as we don't want to give out information until it is confirmed.

Paul

It is great to see you guys monitor the list and we appreciate the information.

Here's hoping that you feed what's published on these forums back into your development and marketing teams as gratis market research...

I spoke to my dealer's service manager and he seems to be up on the aftermarket wrt the MCS.

He tells me that the MCS Works will be launched in March in Canada if/when it passes all rigorous BMW testing. I'm guessing all climates etc.

His thoughts are that the kit will be available as a dealer installed item that will be warrantied by BMW/MINI if unaltered and installed by the dealer. He also seems to think that there will be some badging etc. that will be a part of the "Works" kit.

Just thought I'd share that...

Will there be a package you could ship to the US and we can install here ???

Our aim is to supply all MINI dealers worldwide with both the Cooper and Cooper S conversions. We are still making arrangements for this but hope for everything to be ready for the Cooper S Works launch in January 2003.

exciting aint it??

Do you have anything at all available now to make the new 'S' faster ?

Roll on January.

I shall be waiting outside JCW at promptly 9am on Wednesday January 1st to collect my car ;)

I'm afraid not. Beleive me, if we did you would know about it by now !!

As soon as I have any more information I will put a message on the forum.

Originally posted by John Cooper Works
As soon as I have any more information I will put a message on the forum.
Is the price still going to be in the region of £3,500?:(

If so try and get them to knock it down bit, £2999 sounds better.:D

Originally posted by LMB

Is the price still going to be in the region of £3,500?:(

If so try and get them to knock it down bit, £2999 sounds better.:D
I have set myself a $7k (Aussie dollars) limit. Guess I am out of the picture then...

I'm out, too. :(

Originally posted by John Cooper Works
Our aim is to supply all MINI dealers worldwide with both the Cooper and Cooper S conversions. We are still making arrangements for this but hope for everything to be ready for the Cooper S Works launch in January 2003.

Already on the waiting list for the kit and i can't wait :D :cool: :D

i been swaying back and forth on wether or not to get the works kit, but just like my sig sez, i had a clubman and always wanted a cooper S
and i think this time it'll b a case of having a cooper S and always wanting a john cooper works..

so.. i've decided to put my name down with my dealer (assuming he is taking orders) no matter what the cost.. its not a "real" cooper otherwise is it ? :)

john cooper works - i've never really read too much into it, but care to explain how it came to pass that BMW get to call thier cars cooper's? when it isnt really ? :)

Originally posted by FLiPSiDE
so.. i've decided to put my name down with my dealer (assuming he is taking orders) no matter what the cost.. its not a "real" cooper otherwise is it ? :)

john cooper works - i've never really read too much into it, but care to explain how it came to pass that BMW get to call thier cars cooper's? when it isnt really ? :)

Ah, the essence of the whole matter...it needs to be breathed on by that famous garage in East Preston...to be a true Cooper... :D :D ;) ;) :p :p

(bbb runs away quickly with flames coming out his bum)

it needs to be breathed on by that famous garage in East Preston...to be a true Cooper...

This is true... my point is actually more about the idea of bolting all sorts of after market enhancements onto a car eg: Chipped etc etc and then comparing that to a works Cooper S in terms of on paper figures... this will not be a valid comparision.

Whilst the JCW MCS conversion is expensive (but first law of pricing is to price to within a cent of what you can get away with)... it is also a highly developed, tested and a well thought out cohesive upgrade.

I remember the reports of the Works Cooper, stating that despite power only appearing to be a few percent up - the way the car behaved was remarkably different - ie: The Throttle response was a world away from the "sluggish" nature of the original....

We pay the price becuase they are experts - putting a big exhasut and a K&N air filter on your Nova/Escort/Golf does not necessarily make it faster...

For proof - ask Norton how difficult it was to exhaust the ****le rotary engine they used on the racing bikes..!!??

Having followed this thread and others re the S upgrades I have to say the JCW upgrade is just too expensive.

I don't know a single S owner who wouldn't love to go for the JCW upgrade but I think there are many who just won't on the back of a £3500 cost. It is absolutely ridiculous.

Yes if you put all sorts of odds and ends on the car and don't set it up properly then you won't get gains. But walk into a reputable car tuner and give then £2500 and see what they come up with for you. More and more these days people are into tuning street cars. I track raced against a 230 Bhp CTR yesterday that the owner was a 50 year old nice run of the mill sort of guy who had spent £1500 on the CTR to get the spec up by 30+ Bhp.

Things I think the S needs are
Better brakes
More HP and torque

Obviously the latter means air kit, exhaust, pulley and ECU.

Surely though this doesn't have to cost £3500 !!

Come on JCW set the price for this to get the volume of business that is potentially there.


Finally can anyone comment on something I heard.

A friend of mine runs an Elise that he has modded. His view is that ECU upgrades come about due to the ECU being set to cope with low grade fuel.

If it is mapped properly for decent gade fuel, as in the UK, then the engine produces more HP and gives better economy !!

Any views

I think the problem is that enough people are already willing to buy his kit at this price........

the cost for the works kit, i'd never deny that.. but are my nikes worth 200bucks (AU mind u ) ? are my oakleys worth $340?
the fact is any brand of any note isnt worth anywhere near what they charge.

if i was happy to possibly void my warranty in the process of making my car go a little faster with a cheap, unwarrantied, and largely untested add on, then i'd be all for it.. however i plan on keeping this car a while, i'd rather buy in the piece of mind

a) its been made and tested by people who know a hell of alot more about it than any mechanic or "tuner" in australia

b) my car will be a REAL cooper
and

c) its all under warranty and also will most probably be insurable.. no point spending half as much on other mods only to have the insurance company say "oh that wasnt covered on your policy im afraid, and now we know that.. well look here your insurance is void.. have a nice day"

Originally posted by minime s
I think the problem is that enough people are already willing to buy his kit at this price........


And there are also lots who would like to but are not going to pay that much. £1000+ (40%) more than the Cooper upgrade.

50 people x £3500 = £175,000
75 people x £2500 = £187.500

Originally posted by mark



And there are also lots who would like to but are not going to pay that much. £1000+ (40%) more than the Cooper upgrade.

50 people x £3500 = £175,000
75 people x £2500 = £187.500

Seems to me the Cooper upgrade isn't anywhere near as good value as the Cooper S upgrade...afterall for just £1K more you can get the Cooper S over the JCW Cooper...hmmm wonder which one I'd choose. :rolleyes:

Having followed another thread re the German tuners offering I think that is likely to be our choice at £770 v's £3500.

Given it is also covered with a warranty then you do seem to get at least some protection.

Another option of course will be the Superchips upgrade, if/when it comes out for the S. Beauty here is the ability to reprogram back to standard.

I also have it on good authority that BMW diags do NOT pick up on Superchips mods. BMW 530D upgrade is testimony to that.

So it really is up to JCW to go public with all details and justify the price.

Re the number of people the market for JCW is in the thousands so a more attractive price might just swing the more insecure of us to go for it. :cool: