Over the past few days on a road (30mph) near where I work there has been a Police officer with a speed gun. He doesn't park his car in view, it's just him in his yellow jacket that you can see. He has habit of standing just around a gentle bend so anyone who was doing over 30mph would be caught in the instant they saw him.

I've passed him a few times (always doing 30mph or less, I hasten to add) and about 20-30% of drivers flash their lights and give the 'thumbs down' sign to warn of the trap in this case.

Living in North Wales, we are subject to 'Arrive Alive' vans which are supposedly positioned at accident black spots, and there is a much higher proportion of drivers who flash to warn of those, ~60%.

I'm not sure of the legal implications of flashing your headlights to warn other drivers of a speed trap. The Highway Code states only to flash your lights to warn other drivers that you are there. And I imagine if the Police were going to be anal about it, they may be able to have you prosecuted for obstruction (I read in another post of an old man prosecuted for actually making a sign).

But to my logic, warning another driver does a public service by slowing them down. Surely that is the point?

What do you think? Do you flash your lights to warn other drivers of speed traps?

of course and would expect in return

I no longer do this and dont condon or want other drivers to do it for me.

Last year the police tried unsuccessfully to prosecute a lorry driver for doing this on the view that he was 'interferring with a policeman from carrying out his dutires' or some such. It was proved however that there was no evidence that the drivers that he 'warned' were actually speeding at the time, therefore he couldnt be guilty of such an offence.

So why do I no longer warn other drivers of the presence of such a 'trap'....? Well, put it this way. Somone on 9 points that continually speeds everywhere gets your warning, and, just for that stretch of road where the police are monitoring, slows down to a 'sensible' speed. He doesnt get stopped, fined, banned, but instead, carries on driving like a fool, doing 45 on a 30 zone etc. Then he runs over and kills an innocent child. Do you still think it was clever to warn him about the speed trap? Are you not than implicit in this action?

As someone who now lives on a road that has regular police speed enforcement, due to the fact that the road users continually think they can do twice the limit on the stretch. Despite what people might think, the police actively enforce the limits on roads with known speeding problems, and on stretches that have a record of casualties.

When you flash someone thats coming the other way, you're their best friend for about 10 seconds, then your 'good deed' is forgotton. Is it really worth it? Perhaps some people deserve a fine and a ban, and perhaps the deterant or punishment actually saves lives.

I live in a 30 zone. It really should be a 20 zone. My daugthers little dog was run over outside our house by someone that was speeding, and didnt stop. My wife was nearly killed whilst trying to recover the dog from the road by the next idiot that came around the corner.

Interestingly, and on a side subject, I have noticed an increased number of women drivers speeding in the area recently. This worries me as I have always respected female drivers as better and safer.

I'm with Mr T3 on this.

I live on the main A325 (Farnborough Road) in Farnborough. It's a 30mph dual carriageway - and 30mph for a reason. There are several pedestrain crossings, residential buildings, shops etc along the road, hence its 30 limit.

Far too many people speed along this road, the police included. On sunday afternoon one patrol car went past with his lights on, must have been doing 70 odd. I'd like to know what he was on his way to that justified his use of speed when he'd prosecute you or I (quite rightly) for doing 35 down there.

Anyway, going back on topic, the road is policed frequently by camera vans, and no I don't warn other drivers. Tony is right IMO.

Well said Tonyt3.

Drivers who flash other motorists when a Police Office is actually at the side of the road please look a little deeper than the usual 'us versus them' syndrome.

I regurlarly stand at the side of the road with a hand held laser which is capable of detecting your vehicle at speed some 300 metres away from my location. I stand out in the open with a reflective jacket on (as per my Force policy and for my own safety.)

We generally locate ourselves where there are complaints of speeding made by members of the public (though not always as I shall go on to explain)

We set ourselves a threshold on when to start issuing tickets and when to report for summons (and I think you would be shocked at how high the threshold sometimes is (depending on time of day, location etc.....)

Motorists are under this illusion that when we stand at the side of the road carrying out speed enforcement that speed is all we are looking for. Wrong!!

Criminals drive cars and criminals break the speed limits and that's what we are equally, if not more interested in.

If a disqualified driver or drink driver a wanted burglar or druggie is breaking the speed limit, we catch them, it's as simple as that. The excuse for stopping them for speeding is just a way into the car to look deeper.

Of course we catch 'ordinary' members of the public speeding but we also deal with a whole lot more just by standing there and watching the traffic.

So next time you want to flash (which you can do if that is what you want to do) think who that person your flashing might be. For all you know, as Tonyt3 has just said, it could be a drink driver who would have been caught if you hadn't flashed.

Oh and generally in the evening or at night we put ourselves on roads we know are quick so that we can stop people and sniff their breath...

Far too many people speed along this road, the police included. On sunday afternoon one patrol car went past with his lights on, must have been doing 70 odd. I'd like to know what he was on his way to that justified his use of speed when he'd prosecute you or I (quite rightly) for doing 35 down there.

.

If he had his blue llights then I guess he was going to something urgent!!

If he had his blue llights then I guess he was going to something urgent!!Like shift change during an overtime ban? :p

I no longer do this and dont condon or want other drivers to do it for me.

Last year the police tried unsuccessfully to prosecute a lorry driver for doing this on the view that he was 'interferring with a policeman from carrying out his dutires' or some such. It was proved however that there was no evidence that the drivers that he 'warned' were actually speeding at the time, therefore he couldnt be guilty of such an offence.

So why do I no longer warn other drivers of the presence of such a 'trap'....? Well, put it this way. Somone on 9 points that continually speeds everywhere gets your warning, and, just for that stretch of road where the police are monitoring, slows down to a 'sensible' speed. He doesnt get stopped, fined, banned, but instead, carries on driving like a fool, doing 45 on a 30 zone etc. Then he runs over and kills an innocent child. Do you still think it was clever to warn him about the speed trap? Are you not than implicit in this action?

As someone who now lives on a road that has regular police speed enforcement, due to the fact that the road users continually think they can do twice the limit on the stretch. Despite what people might think, the police actively enforce the limits on roads with known speeding problems, and on stretches that have a record of casualties.

When you flash someone thats coming the other way, you're their best friend for about 10 seconds, then your 'good deed' is forgotton. Is it really worth it? Perhaps some people deserve a fine and a ban, and perhaps the deterant or punishment actually saves lives.

I live in a 30 zone. It really should be a 20 zone. My daugthers little dog was run over outside our house by someone that was speeding, and didnt stop. My wife was nearly killed whilst trying to recover the dog from the road by the next idiot that came around the corner.

Interestingly, and on a side subject, I have noticed an increased number of women drivers speeding in the area recently. This worries me as I have always respected female drivers as better and safer.

I have flashed cars for several different reasons. One particular occasion that springs to mind was a few months ago, where there had been a tree which had fallen over one lane of a 60mph road. I was on the other side and passed it no problem but further up there were a few bends so cars coming the other way would not see this tree until late, and at 60mph could hit it. So as I continued to a safe place to stop to call the plod and warn them about it, I was flashing any cars that were coming in the opposite direction to me to warn them.

The way I figured it was, what do I think when I see someone flash?

a) they know me
b) there is a speed trap ahead/something to be aware of (ie a bloody great tree in the road)
c) if by a junction, they are conceding right of way to me (very rare)
d) I have full beam on accidently/something wrong with my car.

So with me flashing them on a road with no junctions the other drivers would probably first opt for a), until they realise they don't know me, and then think either b) or d). Either way they are likely to slow down.

With regard to slowing a driver down who could go on to speed anyway and kill someone, I don't agree. Stopping somebody from commiting an offence now, does not make you responsible for their actions if they commit an offence later. Also, that would apply only to the driver being stopped. If they were caught by a camera van they would not receive a NIP for a few days and would not be taken off the road (assuming they had 9 points) in the meantime and could then go on to kill the hypothetical child. And there are a lot of people who drive like fools on the road who have no points!

Also, whether or not the driver was speeding was not something I considered in posing the question. As I said in my original post I've passed this one copper a few times, obeying the speed limit and I have been flashed as a warning. So these drivers weren't trying to slow me down, they were just informing me that there was something ahead, in this case a speed trap.

To be honest, I am all for the Police to enforce 30mph limits through their presence. The sad fact is that a lot of people travel at ~40mph through 30mph zones. But if drivers on each side of the area where the speed limit changes to 30mph warned oncoming drivers, everyone would pass through the area at 30mph, thus making that stretch safer. Rather than someone coming through the area at 40mph and only slowing down once they had been caught. They could run over a child before they even get to the speed trap.

With regard to more women speeder's, this is something I have noticed too. What I have found aswell is a lot more drivers seem to be comfortable driving very close behind me when travelling ~70mph. It's not like they have wanted to overtake me as I have been on the inside lane. It is very annoying. :mad:

And I'm sorry to hear about your daughter's dog, and then your wife almost being hit :(

A lot of residents on my housing estate were complaing about speeding around the curved road that links all the houses together. some people really drive at insane speeds around it. Turned out most of the people were residents in the road, and a large proportion of the speeding was done during the school drop off, pickup hours. Mothers with the kids!

I would love to see some small speed humps along the road, and similar roads. Small enough that I can get over them. The thing around here are speed humps are getting so large many normal, standard cars like my mums Focus has to mount the pavementto get over some of them!

I dont flash at people speeding. If they arent aware enough to spot the Police officer, or van, or to use reasonable caution on that stretch of road, then they can have a few points.

I had 3 points 6 years ago for speeding. I'm accident free for the last 13 out of 13 years driving, and I do speed sometimes. I often get people on my bumper through villages trying to get as close as possible to push me along. Where do they think they will get in rush hour traffic even if they do 10 or 20 mph more than me in a 30 zone? They only get caught again at the lights.

I'm won of those annoying people who when hassled driving at 30 tend to start going a little slower in the "you want to go faster, over take then" manner. Not many overtake, which is good.

I never flash anybody - for any reason.

Why? Because I simply do not want to be mis-interpreted.

As long as people can see me, that's all I'm interested in.

being a truck drive i flash other lorry drivers to warn them and thay do it in return to warn me its just one of them things that happens between lorry drivers

mainly on A roads where the speed limit is 60 mph but 40 mph for a lorry !!!

so yes i do flash :)

i flash all the time, why..
well i drive about 40k+ a year, have a clean licence! no detectors, radar avoidance etc..
oh and no insurance claims for over 20+yrs of driving at 30k + per year is that all luck?
have a good set of eyes and the ability to read the road and anticipate other drivers
very carefull in built up areas.. etc
last 4 flashes...
1] flash for lorry drivers, who often need to change lane late as relative speeds can dramatically
change with loads and inclines [ always thanked]
2] hazard avoidance .. last flash to stop mini driving into big pond a few weeks back
[they carried on...]
3] over took tractor on b road, noted Que of cars following me, flashed at on coming traffic after
bend, to warn of possible cars on wrong side of road.. no idea if was req or assisted anyone
4] sometimes at junctions after roundabouts to reaffirm my intentions, no bugger indicates in the UK, and when they do the self cancel can stick

oh and the only 3 speed related ones i can remember are

1] M40/A40 to man-u fans " following my blue mini into london on cup final day [ arm slow flap not flash] not speeding, but they looked like they wanted to pass me as they met the first london camera
2] lotus that gunned past me on finmere bypass [flap again, might not have been speeding, but would have been soon at the rate he shot past me [hidden van]
3] xkr jag into wales near toll 2 miles away...[white van on bridge] another dual carriage way at 50mph i guess at 60+
all not paying full attention to road, mostly gurning as they past but not dangerous to me or others... now if i had a number to call for all the idiots i do see on an almost daily basis .... need i go on....

So long as it's clearly marked as a 30 zone I wouldn't flash.

So long as it's clearly marked as a 30 zone I wouldn't flash.

i agree........ but a guy i knew was booked overtaking cop car doing 38mph, road was a 30 at the time...[bicester nr airfield road]
reclassified as 50mph 4 months later, no change in layout etc just the signs:(
go figure...
there again its not always safe to do 15mph never mind 30

I think that there are some very interesting points made here and some that I had not really given much thought.

I feel that the problem is that police seem to target the wrong things. I do flash and have been in the past. But I am not sure I will in the future. I don't generally speed but I do drive at the speed limit, and I admit sometimes I will go over by 5km. But when there are fixed speed cameras on Freeways and patrol cars on them aswell, I do wonder. Over here the majority of freeways limits are 100k which isn't even 70mph, and we still have cameras everywhere. It seems that speed is the root of all evil.

Speed cameras don't stop the bad driving which in my opinion is far more dangerous. Here in Victoria the police are obsessed with speed cameras and have no sympathy what so ever. I see speed cameras on 60k dual lane main roads at 6am. I also see them on freeways around the same time where the traffic flow is almost none existant.

I have never seen a traffic cop around a school, where the limit is reduce to 40k during school hours and no one obeys it eveyone drives at 60k and over!! And when you do 40 they drive up your ****!

Speed cameras don't stop the tailgating at 100k, or the weaving in and out to get somewhere 5 secs earlier!

I hate the speed camera, not because of what it does, but how they are used. They don't allow for the fact that you need to sometimes accelerate past the speed limit to get out of a dangerous situation, they don't allow for traffic conditions.

I won't flash for a speed camera, as there are too many bad drivers on the road and I agree that it is up to every individual driver to be held responsable for his/her actions.

I drive my car hard, but as I said i try not to speed, but that does not make me a good driver.

Driver education is more important than anything, but that costs and does not bring in easy money!

If every driver had to see for themselves what happens when you tailgate and then have to stop in 5-10 meter at 70mph, i think people may not be in such a hurry to get everywhere!

Why do the police carry out speed checks during rush hour periods on busy main roads, the majority of motorists are caught between 34 and 36 mph at these times. I do not condone speeding but my wife was caught at 33mph a couple of years ago and she was overtaking a stationary refuse wagon. This would catch all the hapless motorists who are are normally law abiding. I do agree with the comment earlier regarding the increase in woman speeding

On the other hand the same camera operating the same road between 19:00 and 00:00 hrs would catch the low life in cars and on motorbikes who continually speed at 50/60/70 mph these are more likely to kill, maim others and themselves but this will not create enough revenue for the police

The reason the police now work 9 to 5 and would require overtime to set up speed traps later in the day and of course the early morning motorist is a easy target (although moving) for revenue collection.

I would flash every time

as a member of the "occaisional" proflash lobby i suggest we are all making our own value judgements to the traffic and road situation as we see it..... not on the driving history of the people we flash, can't think of a time i have flashed in a thirty or a built up area, to be honest but i might somtime in the future...
if speed kills why is the M6 TOLL road the safest motorway in the country, with the highest average speed...:puzzled:
ps not dk dastardly here, just checked my trip and i average about 39 mph, for the last 20 k
and most of my miles are motorway......not sure if that tells you more about me, or our motorways:hmph:

So those who speed at rush hour, in traffic (which is probably their main journey of the day) don't speed at other times? To be honest, if you're speeding in a line of cars at rush hour, I doubt very much you don't speed if and when you drive at other, quieter times.

if speed kills why is the M6 TOLL road the safest motorway in the country, with the highest average speed...:puzzled:

That's a silly argument and well overused too. Just because you think it's safe to speed on a fairly long, straight motorway, the same rules don't apply on other roads, 30 zones etc.

Of course "speed kills", the survival rates for people hit by speeding cars V non speeding spells out that fact, and anyone who denies an 80mph impact is more likely to cause serious injury or death than an identical 50 mph accident are living in a dream.

Speed isn't the only factor, buy you can't tell me that the kid who races around in his souped up Corsa wouldn't be less likely to have an accident if he cruised at 25 all the time rather than 45 in a 30 and 90 on a 60.

There seems to be some divergence from the original question on this thread. Its about flashing other motorists when therea a police officer with a radar gun, not flashing for any other reason.


As far as I know, no one lives on the M6 motorway, and children are unlikely to run out suddenly into the road.

The worst accident I've personally witnessed is a young child that ran out of his drive way on a quite country road chasing a ball - hey, this happens, kids dont see the issue. Anyway, the childs father arrived home 2 minutes after the accident. The child was struck by a speeding motorbike. The bike was coming down a hill at around 70mph entering a 30mph zone (not the bikers fault as the law doesnt apply to bikers dont forget :rolleyes: ). Anyway, the childs father pulled into his driveway an went into the house, and told his wife that there seemed to have been an accident down the road. thats becasue the child had been thrown 250yards by the bike. :(

Speed in itself doesnt cause accidents, but what happens is an exponential multiplication of the effects and damage caused. If you enter a 30mph zone at 45mph, even with good reactions, you are going to hit someone with a high impact speed. If you enter the MAX SPEED 30mph at 28-29mph, your reactions will mean your impact speed in the case of an accident is much reduced - perhaps even enough to avoid the accident.

Now, flashing at a car because there is a police officer might slow him down that ONCE. But it wont have a long term effect. But if the police officer stops the driver, they may, may just alter their driveing habits. Even just a warning could stop someone from persistantly speeding.

As to the arguement that the police should concentrate on the scallies in corsas instead of those doing '36' in a '30' - I couldnt disagree more. Its the people that consistantly brake the law on journeys that they do every day at the same time that cause the most carnage - because they are blaise about their speed, the journey itself. They think that just because they have done 40moh down the same stretch of road over and over for months and months that their speed is safe. They couldnt be more wrong. Their reactions are dulled because they are not in their mind 'speeding'. the repetitive nature of their daily commute turns them off to the unexpected.

you brake the law by 10mph in a 30 zone, and if something unexpected happens you are so much more likely to have an accident, and the accident is so much more likely to be highly damaging.

So if the police can stop the daily law braker, the chap or chapess that is continually just a little bit late for work/school run, that continulously brakes the law - I say, let the police do their job and mind your own business.

I always flash drivers, since speed traps here are:

a) Spradically and unevenly enforced
b) Revenue generators rather than safety generators
c) Subject to far too much discretionary leeway on the part of the officer
d) Subject to "bargaining" down in court

Personal cases in point:

a) I routinely pass by a well known local speed trap manned at least twice a week, exceeding the limit by 20-25% (60-63 in a 50 zone) and not once have I ever been stopped. This is a well known and silly game played out all the time. In effect, the message is "don't exceed 65 in this area and we won't pull you over".

b) I've had on the spot reductions (being told at the time by the cop, "You were doing 27 over, but I'll mark you down for 14 over so that you don't get any points.... just don't fight the ticket in court") that clearly pointed to the ticket as a quota-filling revenue game rather than an exercise in safety.

c) When I did go to a hearing, a JP summarily knocked down the speed I was travelling at with only my say-so to go on.

Is it any wonder I'm cynical and why I always flash? Let the police go after tailgaters, people who don't signal, those whose cars wouldn't pass inspection, etc.

Yep I flash and warn other drivers, especially if they are van/truck drivers (professional) I do this as the places where they are trying to nick the drivers tend tobe in relatively safe places as in 'Money Hotspots'
If it was outside a school, college or other more suitable site where a speed camera is located I would not flash.

For info i'm from near North Wales, curious which road it is...!

I try and religiously stick to the speed limit but it is very easy to make a mistake when in an unfamiliar area or worse on a familiar route and the speed limit has been recently reduced.

I think the real problem is that we should not need to flash others. Instead it would be nice if we returned to the days when the police checked speed (rather than an automatic camera) and they made a judgement on that person once stopped e.g. giving a caution if warranted instead of an immediate fine / points.

My worst problem at the moment is a dual carriageway that is temporarily at 30 instead of 70. I take my life into my own hands every day trying to get into the right hand lane to turn right while everyone else is speeding past. Then while in the right everyone nearly rams me or undertakes me. I feel sorry for the workmen in the road!!

i flash other drivers on a motorway occasionally if there is a Scamera van parked in a dodgy place. They aren't doing it for road safety just money making. I have a 55 mile commute on the M6 in Cumbria and they have a habit of mounting tripods with a van hiding further down the road etc.

I wouldnt never flash anyone in a residential area etc though.

I always flash drivers, since speed traps here are:

a) Spradically and unevenly enforced
b) Revenue generators rather than safety generators
c) Subject to far too much discretionary leeway on the part of the officer
d) Subject to "bargaining" down in court

Personal cases in point:

a) I routinely pass by a well known local speed trap manned at least twice a week, exceeding the limit by 20-25% (60-63 in a 50 zone) and not once have I ever been stopped. This is a well known and silly game played out all the time. In effect, the message is "don't exceed 65 in this area and we won't pull you over".

b) I've had on the spot reductions (being told at the time by the cop, "You were doing 27 over, but I'll mark you down for 14 over so that you don't get any points.... just don't fight the ticket in court") that clearly pointed to the ticket as a quota-filling revenue game rather than an exercise in safety.

c) When I did go to a hearing, a JP summarily knocked down the speed I was travelling at with only my say-so to go on.

Is it any wonder I'm cynical and why I always flash? Let the police go after tailgaters, people who don't signal, those whose cars wouldn't pass inspection, etc.


You make no sense to me. If a police officer 'drops' the recorded speed for you so that you dont get points/banned you then accuse them of 'quota filling'....????? Would you prefer a ban? A copper makes a judgement call that saves your license and you rebuke him? So would you rather that there werent any poilce on the roads and the cameras just handed out bans?

I myself, a few years ago, was stopped by a large white volvo with blue lights. I knew I had been flying, as the Cooper S wa snew and the road was open, wide and empty. However, in talking to the officer I was completely resigned to losing my license. I was well in excess of an immidiate ban. Well over the 'straight to court' limit. He however, seeing my complete understanding of how stupid I had been, significantly reduced the recorded speed to just 90mph, and thus I got a fine and 3 points but I could still live my life.

Its the traffic officers job to offenders, and many of them do just that - they stop people for speeding and then nick them when they find the lack of insurance or other offenders. That people get rediculously low fines, no prison etc for these crimes isnt their fault, its the systems fault.

As the police make no money from hand held radar traps, how can they possibly be accused of being 'revenue generating'? It costs way more to station a policeman on a road than it he could possibly make in fines. he's a deterant and a reminder to those driving in a day dream over the limit.

I do not condone speeding but my wife was caught at 33mph a couple of years ago and she was overtaking a stationary refuse wagon.

33mph? Nowhere in this land of ours would a 30 mph limit be enforced so low!

I read through some valid points on this thread nad some absolute **** as well.

I was thinking of the "Valid Road Safety Schemes" and was reminded of Oldhams own "Killer Road" Now this road has had its fair share of accidents in recent years some fatal most serious. I drive down this road at 45mph at the most it is a National Speed limit road it has bends is uphill and does not have the best of surfaces.
Recent scaremongering has lead many people to believe this stretch of road is one of the "Ten Worst Roads" in the UK. This is nonsense and is a cover up for poor driving standards.
The stretch of this road that is statisticly most dangerous is fifteen miles away in Yorkshire but hey it has the same number so what the heck.
The local council and other self appointed bods are banging on about speed cameras and 40 limts for once a 40 limit would make sense but its the camera argument that gets me.
I choose to drive at 45 because it is safe if some muppet loses it a 1 in the morning in his punto giving it large to his mates its his fault if he kills someone else its his fault not the council not the car manufacturer not society or peer pressure or any other nonsense.
Changing the limit to 40 and posting a speed camera halfway along wont save poeple like him but will punish hundreds of other motorists his type will just crash somewere else

Last week a young lad died in Oldham he was crossing the road and was knocked down.
This road has had and rightly so does have Police Speed traps nearby but they didnt help here.
I am not against the apropriate use of speed cameras but dont think they work the problem is more one of a moral and social decline the thing is this ASBO state of mind transfers to the road so well its uncanny.


Personnaly I would warn of a speed camera the line about warning someone who would then go on and killl someone made me sick and quite angry enough to post a reply when I really should ignore and walk away.

I .

c) When I did go to a hearing, a JP summarily knocked down the speed I was travelling at with only my say-so to go on.

.

i proved in court to JP the police lied about my speed. JP gave me 3points and no fine.

farce, absolute farce...the police how stopped me s******d at me