Sherman, my MINI, and I celebrated his 1-month anniversary here in California yesterday. The day started with a spirited drive to work under warm, partly cloudy skies. Monday at work dragged, but I was out at 5:30 with two hours of sunshine left for Motoring beneath. An hour later Sherman was being offloaded from a flatbed to the local MINI service center, severely crippled.

Sitting in the leftmost turn pocket (double left), I waited patiently for the green arrow. The lowered sun was almost directly behind the indicator overhead, but here in California we have a second set of signal heads low and to the left of the intersection. It popped green, I depressed the clutch and dropped into first, and began through the intersection alongside a Jeep doing the same.

Across the intersection a Dodge Caravan (mini-van) was barreling towards me, unaware his light had gone red. Having the inside lane of the two left turns, I was directly in the mini-van’s way. With the sun behind him, neither the Jeep nor I had time to react. The dodge minivan missed the front of the Jeep by inches and hit Sherman right between the passenger door and the rear right wheel.

The smell of airbag explosive and a view of what had previously been behind me awaited. I’d been spun 180 degrees and the van, crumpled and smoking, came to a rest 20 feet beyond our intersection. This is California, unfortunately, so my first thought as I exited the car was to gather a witness. This being a two-phase intersection, it would be too easy for the van to claim I had run the light instead (though it wouldn’t explain his speed). The Jeep at my side did a ‘lookie-loo’ and continued by, despite my signaling her to stop. However, another gentlemen who had stopped at the red came to my aid.

We exchanged names, the witness and I, and pushed the MINI out of the road. Sherman started right up, but would stall out when I dropped the clutch out. In retrospect it may have been my nerves. The driver of the minivan was unhurt as well, except for long bloody burns up the inside of each arm from the airbag in his steering wheel. His van was immobile; coolant and engine pieces were dropping from his crumpled front end. Bodywork had wedged in the collapsed wheel wells.

The MINI is a tank (Sherman?). The passenger side door and rear panel had a long indentation, paint scraped free and perhaps four inches deep. The rear wheel seemed flush still, however the alloy had several scrapes in it, which leads me to believe it suffered contact as well. The passenger window was down, so I couldn’t tell if it was shattered, but I assume so. The side mirror, for some reason, was rotated skyward, although it appeared to be far enough forward to avoid contact. From the ceiling the curtain airbags hung on the passenger side only. Another airbag had deployed from the side of the sports seat, exposing the layers of padding within (leatherette ripped clean off the entire side). Neither the front airbags nor my driver-side bags had released. I could be wrong, but I believe the hazard lights came on automatically. The windshield suffered a stress crack as well; low on the passenger side, similar to those I’ve read about here on the boards.

I feel a bit like I’ve been run over by a linebacker, but otherwise I’m fine. I had my seatbelt on as usual, and upon impact it kept me within my seat. The right lip of the sports seat helped as well. When the car came to an abrupt stop, however, I hit the door with some force. Nothing a few ibuprofen isn’t knocking out.

It’s my stomache that really hurts. I could puke, I swear. Sherman was positively, absolutely problem free. In line since last January, ordered in April, made in July, and delivered in August. I had put three thousand incredible miles on him and was completely floored with his performance so far. And now I’m driving my parents fifteen-year old SUV.

I’ve reported the claim to my insurance company and am expecting an adjuster to call sometime today. The MINI is at Crevier MINI, although they outsource their bodywork to a specialty shop across the street. I have no idea what to expect. How will they make the car new again? I’ll accept nothing less. This is a performance car, one-month-old, it should be returned to me as such. And if they can’t or won’t, what then? The waiting list is well over six months locally, if they were to replace in kind. What if, instead, they simply opt to write me a check for what ‘they’ deem it’s worth? I just paid MSRP of $23750, $1600 for LoJack and ClearCoat, $200 for registration, $450 for insurance, and $2000 in sales tax. What would they offer me?

None of these options looks agreeable at all. All I did was drive home, turn left on a green, yet I’m going to be out something substantial regardless... why?

I’m heading to the bodyshop at lunch with my digital camera; I’ll have pictures posted here tonight. Of the entire experience the only positive I’ve gathered is an increased feeling of safety in a MINI. Sherman performed brilliantly in my opinion. I’d imagine his van was between double and triple Sherman’s weight, and doing 40mph through the intersection and I stepped out the moment we came to rest, just a few aches and pains.

I thought I’d share the story for all of your knowledge in general. Gather yourselves what you can from it. As well I’d ask a favor. This is my first accident in 11 years of driving and if you’d have any input on how I can go about handling this correctly, it would be greatly appreciated. This is going to be a complicated inconvenience I know, but I hope to lose nothing more than some time with my MINI (as opposed to $).

Thanks and be safe.

sixfoot6

I'm really sorry to hear about Sherman. What you've described is my nightmare as well. At least it sounds like no one was hurt, and yet another testament to the strength of the MINI!

I've been fortunate enough to never have had an accident, so I don't have a lot of advice. One thing I would suggest though is to make sure they examine the suspension very thoroughly, especially the rear one if that is where the alloy got damaged. I'm sure it isn't designed to absorb a direct lateral impact to one of the wheels.

It sounds like you were able to deal civilly and rationally in the situation. Good for you. Best of luck in getting this all resolved.

My heart is broken, and I don't even know you! :(

Poor Sherman. But he did his job, didn't he? Sad to read of such a terrible incident but happy you are unharmed.

On a side note, I'm sure MINI themselves would be interested to hear your story, as not many airbag accidents have occurred so far in the U.S. Yours is the first I've read that the curtain/roof bag was deployed...

Best wishes for Sherman's speeedy recovery. :)

Cathy

I'm really sorry to hear this. I had this exact same thing happen to me on a different car 1 month after purchase. The guy ran the red light. What your going to find in traffic law is that turning left always leaves you "without" the right of way....at least thats what I found. Fortunately, in my accident, I told the police office the guy ran the red light and the cop asked the guy, "Did you run the read light"... After a long pause, the guy admitted he ran the light.... Even then, the insurance companies settled because left turning is hard to defend. Apparently, even if you have a green light, it is your duty to check the intersection before entering, and if a guy appears to be running the red light, you have to not enter.

:(

Taking a left turn in a Mini is always going to be an inherent disadvantage because other cars will hinder your view of on-coming traffic......

mini-is-4-me:

This is a pretty busy intersection with 3 lanes of oncoming 'thru' traffic. The two left turn lanes are 'protected' greens. However, I understand your take on this. In fact, I've heard of an infraction called something like 'entering an intersection before it has cleared'.

I think in this case I should be found not at fault, however, because he has admitted blowing right through the light and a witness and physical facts show that he entered the intersection *after* I had... so much so that he didn't just 'run' a yellow to red, but moreso entered an intersection well within another 'phase'.

I'm still waiting on the insurance adjuster, but I've decided to begin some research of local lawyers. The bodyshop called and is beginning their estimate this morning, but assures me they've already seen two Coopers in the shop and have ten years of experience working for Crevier BMW. He says it'll probably be expensive, but promises Sherman will be like new.

I hope so.

sixfoot6

sixfoot6,

I am so sorry to hear about your accident. Here's what I know about accidents that may help to you.

-- First of all, get yourself checked out thoroughly by a doctor. Sometimes, the shock of the accident pumps up the adrenaline and hides any symptoms you may have as a result. Insurance should cover all the treatments you need.

-- Glancing side collisions fortunately are less likely to damage your chassis than a head on or rear end impact so you're lucky there, I hope.

-- It seems that your Mini is not what the insurance company would call a "total loss" where the cost of fixing it would be equal to or more than the preent value. Therefore, it will be very important for you to get the maximum amount of payment from your ins. co. to make the car right.

-- Get a proper estimate to fix EVERYTHING on your mini. The insurance adjuster will make an estimate as well and usually for less than what it really winds up costing.

-- I'd recommend getting the work done through your dealer and making sure that the new vehicle warranty will remain in efect afterwards.

-- I'm sure that you have an accident report from the police showing that it was the other guy's fault. If not, get a statement from your witness becasue you may need it, just in case. I hope the other guy had a valid insurance.

-- Consider consulting a lawyer (you DO live in California, USA) not to make fake claims but just to protect your rights to compensation. Sometimes the other guy's insurance company will call to try to make a settlement.

I hope this helps.

I am very sorry to hear about your accident. Although your MINI has sustained what appears to be pretty severe damage, I am very glad to hear that you made it out basically unharmed and in one piece (Praise the Lord!) and that the car's safety systems performed as promised by MINI.

In 1996 I had a very similar accident experience (Also making a left turn here in Miami on a clear morning that I had decided to show up at work 1 1/2 hours earlier...go figure!) when a '96 Ford F-150 pickup truck ran a red light and hit my then 10 month old 1995 Acura Integra sedan on the right front side of the car. No airbags but the car sustained severe damage in the front end, however, the airbags did not deploy as my car was going at a very low speed (Started to make the left turn onto the expressway entrance ramp). The repairs came out to a whooping $9,700 and the insurance company refused to total the car (Had the front airbags deployed, that would have been enough to total the car as each airbag was quoted at $2,000 a piece per my Acura dealer)and had to live for the next year or so with a poorly repaired car (In despite of all genuine Acura parts replaced), premature rust in the engine bay, flaking paint job and worst of all FRAME DAMAGE.

I hate to break this out to you, but "Sherman" will never be the same. Once a car gets into an accident, no body shop and no level of aftermarket repair skill will ever be able to completely remove the scars left by the collision. An accident repaired vehicle will forever be hunted by numerous problems originating from the repairs itself and the low resale value an accident car commands in the used car market. Any well trained used car appraiser will be able to detect accident repair damage on the spot, thus depreciating your car by several thousand dollars. Believe me, I went thru this nonsense for several months trying to unload the car as I was getting annoyed by the poor quality repairs. I had to endure a loss that was not my fault to begin with.

In the end I dumped the car in a trade in and got another Acura (1997 2.5TL this time) but I lost several thousand dollars in the transaction. I had no choice. A car with frame damage is consider ed to be pretty much a savaged vehicle as this info must be disclosed to prospect buyers at least here in Florida.

At the time I was not aware that there is a law (Insurance companies in FL does not want you to know about it) that allows you to sue and collect for "Vehicle Diminished Value" provided that you were not the party responsible for causing the accident. I am not sure if California would have something similar, but here you can seek relief under this provision. Say your car has lost $5K market value worth due to the accident, you can file a claim (I guess thru your insurance company) against the responsible party's auto insurance company to recover market value losses incurred by the accident.

I think this is an option worth looking into. I would also suggest to get immediately a hold of professional legal counsel. You should not be liable for an accident you did not cause. All you were doing was obeying traffic laws and driving home after a long day at work. Make the Jerk(s) that caused the accident pay for their lack of regard and attention on the road.

Best of luck. If I were you I would seriously let go of "Sherman". See what the insurance company tells you first.

Just a note to say I really am gutted to read your post and hope everything turns out okay.

push for an insurance write off if you can.

I hope your bad luck turns around, at least you walked away to enjoy MINI sometime in the (hopefully) not too distant future.

Keep the faith !!

I dont know anything about US insurance procedures, but Im very glad that you are OK, and were able to walk away from the accident.....

Sorry about the damage to Sherman too, hope hes fixable, or that you get a satisfactory settlement from the insurers.....

Best wishes 6

sixfoot6 -

Man, what a shame . . . my stomach became clenched and acidic just trying to imagine the situation.

I don't have any similar experience to relate, so the only piece of advice I can offer is to gather as much information from as many different sources as possible before signing or agreeing to any course of remedial action: there may well be options available that aren't known immediately.

Best wishes for a quick and full recovery -

catalyst

Best wishes for a quick and full recovery....Sherman ROCKS!!

sixfoot6

Sorry to hear the horrible news. Glad you're ok!

I agree with cooper4us. A car is never quite the same after it's been hit. My wife has a civic that was beautifully repaired after being t-boned on the drivers side. The seams aligned and there was no orange peel. The paint job was phenomenal! The average joe wouldn't know it was hit. After a year and a half, it was obvious--the child saftey lock turns itself on, the trim pops off, it holds its alignment for only 6 months, and the paint looks awful.

I hate to also be a bearer of bad news in such a horrible time, but my brother told us this when the civic was hit. We should have listened to him. I wish we could have sold the civic! I would fix it, sell it, and take a loss rather than have these problems. it's just not worth it if you really love the MINI. You sould drive a car that puts a smile on your face.

I would have a hard time selling my MINI...but if it meant being happy for the next 80,000 miles, I would. I bought a MINI to enjoy driving.

Get yourself looked over and let insurance sort it out. Then you may have to make some decisions. In the meantime, life goes on.

Sorry :(. Keep us posted on how things go.

My car was repaired and I drove it for another 7 years and only the very best of trained experts could have been able to tell...a few painted pieces and the slighest of overspray. I think I was lucky and the AutoBody shop was the best I've ever seen....I have seen no other body shop ever come close. But, typically, unfortunately, as in 95% of the time, you will be able to tell and your car will never be the same if the damage exceeds the quarter panels or body of the car.

My paint held up for the whole 7 years, matched well, had no noticeable effect on the handling. Did have a few extra rattles that were not there before...but those might have gotten there by pure age as well.

I have been in several (not at fault) accidents. My advice:

Heed NYCGuy's advice. I still suffer back problems from an accident, and I did not file a suit. Should have. I'll be living with them in perpetuity...

I do not agree with Cooper4us.. Our Saab was involved in quite a bad accident (over $12k) last winter, and after a LENGTHY repair process it actually drives like new again. No ill effects, other than my windhsield washer on the passenger side is still broken (gotta take that one in). IMO not *all* cars can be repaired well, but if you choose someone with lots of experience SOME CAN. My old Jeep, OTOH, never was the same after her accident...

Some advice from person experience: this will be a painful, long process. KEEP ALL DOCUMENTATION of every penny you will spend. And spend you will. Hope you have excellent ($1500+) rental coverage, as the other co. will find a way to screw you somehow. DOCUMENT ALL ACHES AND PAINS. GET A LAWYER NOW (hopefully you know some that will help).

I hate to say it, but being in an accident, your fault or not, is like bending over and taking it in the rear. As a result of my Saab incident (I was at a dead stop, at a stop sign, when some bonehead t-boned me after falling asleep at the wheel!), we went out of pocket for over $1000 in costs that weren't recovered until much later, I personally burned 1 week of vacation taking care of various things, and had all sorts of stress from the other guy's insurance co (GEICO) which absolutely sucked.

I am sorry to hear about your situation, I hope everything works out OK.

Originally posted by sixfoot6
mini-is-4-me:

This is a pretty busy intersection with 3 lanes of oncoming 'thru' traffic. The two left turn lanes are 'protected' greens. However, I understand your take on this. In fact, I've heard of an infraction called something like 'entering an intersection before it has cleared'.

I think in this case I should be found not at fault, however, because he has admitted blowing right through the light and a witness and physical facts show that he entered the intersection *after* I had... so much so that he didn't just 'run' a yellow to red, but moreso entered an intersection well within another 'phase'.

I'm still waiting on the insurance adjuster, but I've decided to begin some research of local lawyers. The bodyshop called and is beginning their estimate this morning, but assures me they've already seen two Coopers in the shop and have ten years of experience working for Crevier BMW. He says it'll probably be expensive, but promises Sherman will be like new.

I hope so.

sixfoot6
BTW, your describing the situation I was in exactly. In my situation, I saw my light turn green, I saw his car approaching the intersection but then go behind cars waiting to turn on the protected green and then I assumed that he was stopping for his red light because I could not see his car...In fact, I would had to go into the middle of the intersection to see beyond the cars in the intersection and probably still would have been hit just to look... My guy not only ran the red light on my protected green but other cars where going on the full straight green as well.

The key is the witnesses and someone else to show that he ran the red light....otherwise it gets to be a he said/she said.

Ouch! Good ol' Sherman. Ask the questions in writing and get the answers in writing. And maybe you can return the favour to the Jeep driver one day.

Six Foot

What a bummer...
I really hope it all works out well in the end

eBrit

Sorry to hear your news, sixfoot6.

(got a lump in my throat reading your news)

Here's to a speedy and satisfactory resolution...

Oh, man! I'm sorry to hear that.

Like others have said, I think you'll want a lawyer (being that you're in California & all). Luckily, they'll be calling you starting tomorrow, and sending you FedEx envelopes, etc. You just have to choose one from the clamoring horde.

Claiming reduced value is a good idea. If I were in your shoes, after the body shop finishes working on your car, I'd sell it and buy another. The reduced value money will come in handy to pay off your current loan (if you have one), and/or putting a deposit down on another one.

As good as the modern repair shops are, the car will never be the same.

Chip H.

Originally posted by cooper4us
At the time I was not aware that there is a law (Insurance companies in FL does not want you to know about it) that allows you to sue and collect for "Vehicle Diminished Value" provided that you were not the party responsible for causing the accident. I am not sure if California would have something similar, but here you can seek relief under this provision. Say your car has lost $5K market value worth due to the accident, you can file a claim (I guess thru your insurance company) against the responsible party's auto insurance company to recover market value losses incurred by the accident.

I have to whole-heartedly agree with the "never-the-same" camp. My wife was involved in a 5-car rear-end accident while stopped on an on-ramp (a minivan rear-ended a stopped car hard enough to push it into the car in front and so on). My wife's Honda 1-year old Civic was the second car to be hit, but sustained the most damage (car behind was a Lexus sedan and car in front was a 7-series BMW - neither one had anything more than paint chips from body-colored bumpers).

The insurance company authorized the body shop to use knock-off parts despite my request (not in writing, unfortunately) to use genuine Honda parts. The car was repaired and looked new, but we decided to dump it anyway. The Honda dealership was the one to inform us that the car had not been repaired with genuine parts and, as such, lost about USD$3000 in a split second.

It was at this point that I started going head-to-head with the insurance company to try to get them to fix their mistake. The appraised value of the car was now less than the amount of the check they wrote to the body shop, so I tried to get them to acknowledge that they should have declared it a total loss and that they screwed me by using knock-off parts. Unfortunately, Illinois does not allow diminished value claims, which the representative was only too happy to explain how that meant that I had no legs to stand on.

Find out if you are eligible for a diminished value claim as soon as possible and document everything!!!!

Unfortunately, as I have found out from this experience and one other occasion, your insurance company is liable to restore your car to an equivalent, driveable consition. That is all - they will in no way be held responsible for monetary losses (like if the value of the car is now less than you owe on it) and good luck trying to attribute later problems / reliability to the accident at a later date. I can only hope that the Dodge Caravan that hit you was brand-new and heavily financed so that he experiences the same anguish that he is causing you!

I feel your pain - good luck to you.

Scott

Sixfoot6, like the other members who have posted, I'm very sorry to learn of your accident, but encouraged hearing that you, personally, have come out of it relatively uninjured. Having recently been in an accident in my MINI, I too am very impressed with how well built and safe the car has been constructed.

I hope your MINI's repair process is swift and to your satisfaction and all the inherent hassles kept to a minimum.

Well. I visited Sherman at lunch. He's not doing well at all. Personally, I find it hard to believe they can bring him back to life. New body panels don't make a new car. Sherman got thumped hard, his entire frame is twisted away from the rear right. The hatch is crooked, the sunroof doesn't close. A significant blow was felt to the rear wheel and one can only surmise the damage to the suspension and axle within. However the body shop assures me that despite a very high cost and long turn around, he'll be 'good as new'. This is a performance car. This car boasts technologically advanced ____ all over the freakin place, and a mini-van just socked it at 40mph.

The customer service rep is going to keep in touch and I certainly plan on it. After some calls to the factory for part prices he'll be coming up with an estimate and schedule, I'll give you all an idea of what he thinks. He did make me aware that while the MINI will be 'good as new', California has some wording regarding 'depreciated value' as it relates to 'non-fault' accidents. Unfortunately he said it *always* requires a lawyer.

I greatly appreciate everyone's input and well wishes. The MINI did great and I'm relatively unhurt. I *did* go see a doctor about my wrist and back, both are quite sore. She is/was worried about the wrist and I'll be getting xrays tomorrow morning.

My insurance company, Mercury, has been moderatly helpful so far. The fellow that hit me has Triple A insurance, so they'll be key here. I'll find out tomorrow if they've claimed responsibility. Estimators should be out to the MINI tomorrow or Thursday as well.

At this point I don't know what to think. I suppose I hope that it'll be totalled and that they'll just pay for a New DS MCS. Pipe dream, I'm sure. Plus I'd be waiting another 6 months for it. But at this point, it's the 'best' option, right?

I think I'll make MINIUSA aware of all this, perhaps it poses some interest to them in some way or another. The car could be of value to them, or the story, or something.

Anyhow, I still have the MINI bug, this is just a major inconvenience to my MINI adventures. I appreciate all your well wishes and I'll keep you updated, please keep the suggestions coming...

Pictures in a moment...

sixfoot6

6-6, that's devastating!

Glad you're OK. Not much advice I can offer that hasn't already been said

Best wishes... Good car! :)

Links to Follow:

Click Pictures In Links For Full Size:

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Passenger Side (http://www.minicooperonline.com/modules.php?set_albumName=album04&id=axs&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_photo.php)

Wheel Damage (http://www.minicooperonline.com/modules.php?set_albumName=album04&id=axt&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_photo.php)

Rear Quarter Panel (http://www.minicooperonline.com/modules.php?set_albumName=album04&id=axu&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_photo.php)

Passenger Airbags (http://www.minicooperonline.com/modules.php?set_albumName=album04&id=axv&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_photo.php)

Hatch Is Uneven - Note Seams (http://www.minicooperonline.com/modules.php?set_albumName=album04&id=axw&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_photo.php)

I too offer my wishes for you feeling better.

Hopefully, you'll get a fair insurance amount without a huge amount of hassle. To make you feel a bit better, I think its now possible to get another S in less than 6 months, especially if you get it from a dealer in certain areas of the country. MINIJewel said the Milwaukee dealer had some sitting on their lot, and I know Towne in Buffalo did as well. Probably you can order and get in much less then 6 months too, if you can't find one someone else decided they didn't want.

Hope that's a small ray of sunshine in a generally mediocre experience.

-Alan

Originally posted by sixfoot6
Links to Follow:

Click Pictures In Links For Full Size:

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Passenger Side (http://www.minicooperonline.com/modules.php?set_albumName=album04&id=axs&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_photo.php)

Wheel Damage (http://www.minicooperonline.com/modules.php?set_albumName=album04&id=axt&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_photo.php)

Rear Quarter Panel (http://www.minicooperonline.com/modules.php?set_albumName=album04&id=axu&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_photo.php)

Passenger Airbags (http://www.minicooperonline.com/modules.php?set_albumName=album04&id=axv&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_photo.php)

Hatch Is Uneven - Note Seams (http://www.minicooperonline.com/modules.php?set_albumName=album04&id=axw&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_photo.php)

Sad MINI.... but it is hard to believe that's all the damage there is from a 40 mph impact! More proof that these cars are very well engineered and quite robust.

6"6,

Really sorry about that, mate. I see why you call him Sherman.

I can't believe there is that little damage. It looks as if a passenger would have probably got out unscathed. Unbelieveable.

The sad news is that from looking at the photos I really can't see them writing it off. I agree that would be best case, though.

Good Luck,

Thats all from a 40 MPH crash?

Think the VW Polo advert should apply to the Mini too!
(For those not in the UK, it's all about how the Polo is a solid little car)

I can't see that as a write off at all. Mind you, we can only see the body panels, don't know about the chassis or suspension at all.

Hope it all works out and that your feeling a bit less bruised.

Sympathies, 6'6. Hope you don't have to actually sue to get what is fair for you.

If the frame is bent, I imagine it would take a machine suitable for tractor-trailer rigs to apply enough force to straighten it out. I too am skeptical about the possibility of returning Sherman to as-new condition. I wonder if the salvage value of the parts is enough to make it worthwhile to scrap the vehicle.

Best of luck