Hi Everyone,
I just completed a High Speed Motorsport course at Sandown on Saturday.
My MCS got up too about 180kph on the straight before the braking zone for the first corner. Fuel consumption got down too 26L/100 km. :eek:
I was lucky enough to have another Mini (CooperS JCW) there at the same course. So its wasn't so lonely fo my Mini. :) Most cars were HSV's, WRX 's, M3 and GTR's.
The two mini held its own. Considering the long straight at Sandown. Our lap times were as good if not better then some more powerful cars.
In the end the JCWS got down to 1.41 a lap. I ended with 1.38. (Not bad considering I am 27kw short on the JCWS :p ). (Laps were done on run flats of 17's on both. Without them I am sure we would have been faster)

I have also spoken to the Motorsport course people and they are happy to get a special for just mini drivers if we can band togather about 16 or more (withnot the need to have completed a driver safety course 1st. or motorsport experence. In general, normally this is required). They are welling to design a course just of us.

Anyone interested?

ShermanM

Hi Everyone,
I just completed a High Speed Motorsport course at Sandown on Saturday.
My MCS got up too about 180kph on the straight before the braking zone for the first corner. Fuel consumption got down too 26L/100 km. :eek:
I was lucky enough to have another Mini (CooperS JCW) there at the same course. So its wasn't so lonely fo my Mini. :) Most cars were HSV's, WRX 's, M3 and GTR's.
The two mini held its own. Considering the long straight at Sandown. Our lap times were as good if not better then some more powerful cars.
In the end the JCWS got down to 1.41 a lap. I ended with 1.38. (Not bad considering I am 27kw short on the JCWS :p ). (Laps were done on run flats of 17's on both. Without them I am sure we would have been faster)

I have also spoken to the Motorsport course people and they are happy to get a special for just mini drivers if we can band togather about 16 or more (withnot the need to have completed a driver safety course 1st. or motorsport experence. In general, normally this is required). They are welling to design a course just of us.

Anyone interested?

ShermanM

Hi,

Great to see more minis getting track experience and holding their own against other cars :D

Also congratulations on winning the "mini" battle, and beating the JCW car. 3 seconds a lap does not sound like much, but on the track it is a lot. Just goes to show that spending money on mods does not necessarily make you faster ;) As I have said before, driver training is the most cost effective bang for your buck thing you can do :D

I hopefully will be coming down to sandown for a day in April :D

Cheers

Robbo

Sherman,
I'd be interested if I actually OWNED a MINI.......

Hi Everyone,
I just completed a High Speed Motorsport course at Sandown on Saturday.
My MCS got up too about 180kph on the straight before the braking zone for the first corner. Fuel consumption got down too 26L/100 km. :eek:
I was lucky enough to have another Mini (CooperS JCW) there at the same course. So its wasn't so lonely fo my Mini. :) Most cars were HSV's, WRX 's, M3 and GTR's.
The two mini held its own. Considering the long straight at Sandown. Our lap times were as good if not better then some more powerful cars.
In the end the JCWS got down to 1.41 a lap. I ended with 1.38. (Not bad considering I am 27kw short on the JCWS :p ). (Laps were done on run flats of 17's on both. Without them I am sure we would have been faster)

I have also spoken to the Motorsport course people and they are happy to get a special for just mini drivers if we can band togather about 16 or more (withnot the need to have completed a driver safety course 1st. or motorsport experence. In general, normally this is required). They are welling to design a course just of us.

Anyone interested?

ShermanM

Sherman,
On our recent Eastern Creek track day the Minis were getting up to 180-190kph down the main straight and I thought i saw an average of 46 litres per 100 on my trip computer, others who were more focussed on their fuel economy (or lack of it) may post their figures for comparison.

Mini clubs is negotiating with a Professional Track day organisation in relation to Track Days for MINI's based around Driver Training for our members. This we hope will be supported by BMW MINI and we are in the process of getting quotes for Melbourne, Sydney and Brisbane, so stay tuned.

How were the run flats after Sandown, mine were looking rather off after Eastern Creek?

Vic

I thought i saw an average of 46 litres per 100 on my trip computer, others who were more focussed on their fuel economy (or lack of it) may post their figures for comparison.


I think you need to get some new glasses Vic ;) Maybe 26 but 46!!! What was your top speed down the straight again, 450km/hr :D :D :D

I think you need to get some new glasses Vic ;) Maybe 26 but 46!!! What was your top speed down the straight again, 450km/hr :D :D :D

I thought turn one came up very quick

The run flats tyres are not good. The grip level was really low. Its heavy as well.
Let's put it this way, I am currently looking for new tyres as the run flats look very tired after the sandown. With lighter rims and tyres I think there is a good 1 to 2 sec. or more to gain a lap.
Robbo hope to see you in April. Let me know early, I will try and orginse myself to be there at there. Plus, I can show you some great drives in Melbourne.
One more thing, the 17's I think is not as good as the 16's for track work as well.

Sherman,
On our recent Eastern Creek track day the Minis were getting up to 180-190kph down the main straight and I thought i saw an average of 46 litres per 100 on my trip computer ...
Vic
Hi Vic,

Trelo and I were hitting 198 and occasional 200k before lifting off to take turn one at EC. Speed varied a bit depending on how good a run you got out of the corner leading onto the straight. Our best was 205k, however the way Trelo was getting out of that corner, I'm sure he did a couple runs even better than that. :D :D

All,

Can we stick to the topic of organising a Sandown event later in the year? If not I'm happy to split the thread and move it to racing MINI's. :)

All,

Can we stick to the topic of organising a Sandown event later in the year? If not I'm happy to split the thread and move it to racing MINI's. :)

Hi,

Good idea ;)

Luke O'Neill from Events O'Neill / Burrows drive day is trying to organise a Melbourne drive day.

His events are usually excellent, with great driver training and awesome cars. Hopefully drivers from Sydney will be coming down for the first Melbourne drive day. If it works out I will definitely try to come, and I am sure others will do the same.

I don't think there are any definite dates yet. However, if anyone is interested in registering their interest they should email luke through the events o'neill website. Events O'Neill (http://www.eventsoneill.com) Luke will be able to keep you posted via email. The events are "by invitation" so tell Luke that Robbo recommended you ;)

As far as the subject of speeds through corners on the racetrack. My 2c worth, if you have time to check out your speed just before entering a corner at close to 200km/hr, you are either not pushing it hard enough or are crazy (which incidentally translates to "trelo" in Greek).. When I go through turn one at eastern creek everything is completely on the edge, and I definitely do not have the ability to look at the speedo and hold it all together. Consider that at 200km/hr you are moving at 50m + per second. It would take at least a second to look at the speedo. If you really want to get a measure on how fast you are going, measure your lap times, which can be electronic and require no input from the driver ;) In the end, there are no prizes for the top speed, only for lap times. Many cars can outrun the mini on the straight, but it takes a good car to beat it in lap times.

Cheers

Robbo

PS : I saw 235km/hr on the the M3 speedo at Phillip island :D :D However, things got ugly very soon after that :( After that experience I decided to concentrate on actually making it around the corner, rather than watching the speedo ;)

I agree with the looking at the speedo thing. Mine was recorded on radar on the straight.
I glance at it in one of the training laps and I was almost in the kittey litter.
I will try and get in contact with Luke.
Sandow chews up brakes as well. It seems its takes up twice the brake pad matrial for the Sandow 500 as compared to Bathurst 1000. So make sure the Mini's have lots of brake pads before any run there.
See you all
ShermanM

All,

Can we stick to the topic of organising a Sandown event later in the year? If not I'm happy to split the thread and move it to racing MINI's. :)

Seems like everyone ignores half of what i've got to say on this forum anyway, i did mention that we are getting a quotation for an all MINI driver training day at various tracks including Melbourne hopefully with sponsorship from BMW as part of a MINI drive programme, but if you blokes want to go off on your own tangent and organise things so be it.

Seems like everyone ignores half of what i've got to say on this forum anyway, i did mention that we are getting a quotation for an all MINI driver training day at various tracks including Melbourne hopefully with sponsorship from BMW as part of a MINI drive programme, but if you blokes want to go off on your own tangent and organise things so be it.
I'm sorry, I was just trying to help :confused: The first post in this thread was trying to organise a track day at Sandown, and I think you in post 5 said that Mini Clubs was organising one at Eastern Creek. Both would be great events. I was just trying to help you to organise it by trying to keep the thread on topic without it going off onto performance tuning. :) If we can keep the event organising threads short and on topic people have a chance of working out what is going on :)

Seems like everyone ignores half of what i've got to say on this forum anyway, i did mention that we are getting a quotation for an all MINI driver training day at various tracks including Melbourne hopefully with sponsorship from BMW as part of a MINI drive programme, but if you blokes want to go off on your own tangent and organise things so be it.

Sorry :o

I will be first to sign up for any mini driver training days :D By mentioning the Events O'Neill day in Melbourne I wasn't trying to promote it as a better alternative to the possible future mini event. I was just being enthusiastic because the event is probably going to be in the near future, I am coming down to Melbourne to drive at Sandown in the event, and I thought it might be of interest for other Victorians.

Personally I love doing as many track things as possible. I do Events ONeill days, NSW BMW driver club days, BMW driver training plus a few other events. If there are any Mini events I will definitely participate. If there are any other track days (eg the moto-concepts one recently on Australia day) I am would love to get involved in those as well :)

Thanks for the all the work trying to organise the mini track days, I appreciate it :)

Robbo

Hi,

Good idea ;)

Luke O'Neill from Events O'Neill / Burrows drive day is trying to organise a Melbourne drive day.

His events are usually excellent, with great driver training and awesome cars. Hopefully drivers from Sydney will be coming down for the first Melbourne drive day. If it works out I will definitely try to come, and I am sure others will do the same.
Vic is working on having the Clubs Driver Training Programme in place by the 2nd quarter this year. However, as part time tracky's you can't do enough driver training and practice. The benefits of participating in as many of these days (like Burrows Days) that one can afford both financially and timewise cannot be underestimated.

As far as the subject of speeds through corners on the racetrack. My 2c worth, if you have time to check out your speed just before entering a corner at close to 200km/hr, you are either not pushing it hard enough or are crazy (which incidentally translates to "trelo" in Greek).. When I go through turn one at eastern creek everything is completely on the edge, and I definitely do not have the ability to look at the speedo and hold it all together. Consider that at 200km/hr you are moving at 50m + per second. It would take at least a second to look at the speedo. If you really want to get a measure on how fast you are going, measure your lap times, which can be electronic and require no input from the driver ;) In the end, there are no prizes for the top speed, only for lap times. Many cars can outrun the mini on the straight, but it takes a good car to beat it in lap times.

Cheers

Robbo

PS : I saw 235km/hr on the the M3 speedo at Phillip island :D :D However, things got ugly very soon after that :( After that experience I decided to concentrate on actually making it around the corner, rather than watching the speedo ;)
Without labouring the point or remaining off topic ... 'all drivers' should be totally relaxed observant and confident at whatever speed or situation they encounter both on the track or road. Easier said than done however this is exactly what driver training and consistant practice is aimed at achieving.

To improve entry and exit speeds in cornering or reaction to a situation requires information and confidence to deal with that information. A cursory glance at the speedo, tacho, (or other gauges) rear and side mirrors whilst keeping all that is going on in front of you in your peripheral vision or vice versa is a required skill if you wish to improve your driving ability.

If a driver is white knuckling the steering wheel and not relaxed enough to observe all that is going on around them then they are beyond their comfort zone and should slow down to the point where they are again relaxed and confident. A look at the V8 Supercar Driver's when being interviewed on television, whilst hitting the braking area in door handle to door handle racing at speeds well above what we are ever going to achieve, illustrates exactly what is required. Not easy, however achievable if we stay within our particular comfort levels and constantly look to improve our skills within those levels.

Observation is key in all circumstances; driving in traffic, watching for that pram to suddenly appear from between two vehicles parked on the side of the road, or checking your mirrors to see where the faster vehicle is on your approach to a 200+k corner at Eastern Creek, should be as matter of fact as starting your car to go to work in the morning. If it's not then your speed is inappropriate for the conditions and there is a high probabilty of not handling a given situation confidently or correctly.

My 2 cents worth ;) ;)

Regards

Brad

To improve entry and exit speeds in cornering or reaction to a situation requires information and confidence to deal with that information. A cursory glance at the speedo, tacho, (or other gauges) rear and side mirrors whilst keeping all that is going on in front of you in your peripheral vision or vice versa is a required skill if you wish to improve your driving ability.

If a driver is white knuckling the steering wheel and not relaxed enough to observe all that is going on around them then they are beyond their comfort zone and should slow down to the point where they are again relaxed and confident. A look at the V8 Supercar Driver's when being interviewed on television, whilst hitting the braking area in door handle to door handle racing at speeds well above what we are ever going to achieve, illustrates exactly what is required. Not easy, however achievable if we stay within our particular comfort levels and constantly look to improve our skills within those levels.

Observation is key in all circumstances; driving in traffic, watching for that pram to suddenly appear from between two vehicles parked on the side of the road, or checking your mirrors to see where the faster vehicle is on your approach to a 200+k corner at Eastern Creek, should be as matter of fact as starting your car to go to work in the morning. If it's not then your speed is inappropriate for the conditions and there is a high probabilty of not handling a given situation confidently or correctly.

My 2 cents worth ;) ;)

Regards

Brad

Hi,

Some good commonsense there. I was actually being a bit tongue in cheek when I said I was on the limit around turn 1. In fact I am quite relaxed.

Personally I try to get all the peripheral things, eg checking oil and coolant temps, activating the intercooler sprayer etc out of the way on the straight bits as much as possible. Obviously you have to be aware in the turns as well, checking your mirrors and the road ahead and behind, but you are better off adjusting something or checking guages in the straight parts.

The point I was trying to make is that it is not a good idea to try and check your speed at the last minute, so as to get the highest speed. You can get a bunch of inexperienced drivers, all losing attention at the highest speed point on the track. What can happen is things can get out of hand.That is exactly what happened to me at Phillip Island. I was doing a BMW driver training day, and it all got a bit competative and macho. Everyone started comparing speeds at the end of the straight. Some guy said he did 232, so I was determined to go faster, and was more interested in looking at the speedo at the crucial time, rather than concentrating on the braking point, downshift, turn in etc. BIG mistake :o :( At the end of the straight you should be concentrating on the corner ahead, braking point, looking for the apex etc

Robbo

Hi,

Some good commonsense there. I was actually being a bit tongue in cheek when I said I was on the limit around turn 1. In fact I am quite relaxed.

Personally I try to get all the peripheral things, eg checking oil and coolant temps, activating the intercooler sprayer etc out of the way on the straight bits as much as possible. Obviously you have to be aware in the turns as well, checking your mirrors and the road ahead and behind, but you are better off adjusting something or checking guages in the straight parts.

The point I was trying to make is that it is not a good idea to try and check your speed at the last minute, so as to get the highest speed. You can get a bunch of inexperienced drivers, all losing attention at the highest speed point on the track. What can happen is things can get out of hand.That is exactly what happened to me at Phillip Island. I was doing a BMW driver training day, and it all got a bit competative and macho. Everyone started comparing speeds at the end of the straight. Some guy said he did 232, so I was determined to go faster, and was more interested in looking at the speedo at the crucial time, rather than concentrating on the braking point, downshift, turn in etc. BIG mistake :o At the end of the straight you should be concentrating on the corner ahead, braking point, looking for the apex etc

Robbo
Right as always Robbo ... having things soughted before taking a corner or performing an overtaking manouvre is best done on the quiet bits, usually the straights, however we should also be comfortable under pressure and constantly observing what is going on around us cause you just never know when someone will appear out of nowhere as happened to some of us at EC recently.... :rolleyes:

On the warm down lap, after the chequered flag had been displayed, on which, we had all been instructed; SLOW DOWN, NO OVERTAKING, MAKE YOUR WAY TO THE PITS ..... a clown in a Silver Turbo Porsche passed several of us at speed unexpectedley on corners and other precarious positions on the way to the pits almost causing several accidents. :eek: :eek: His explanation .."My Slowdown Lap is faster than you guys" :o :o Our retort; "please do it again, it's going to cost you a whole heap more cash than me after they scrape you off the wall I will gladly put you into next time I see you in my mirrors". :mad: :mad: Fortunately the message got through after one of the marshals had a chat to him. In this case if we and others had not been observant there would have been an accident. :eek:

In another case, a Commodore decked out in full racing livery decided to pull up to a dead stop, on the crest of a hill, into a fast corner, in front of vehicles travelling at speed, .. with absolutely no warning. :eek: :eek: In his case, after a marshal rightly pointed out his stupidity and following the drivers explanation; "f :bad::bad::bad: off" he was told there would be no more tracking for him or his car that day. ;) ;)

Good observation and some luck got a whole heap of us out of trouble that time as well. :)

Seems like everyone ignores half of what i've got to say on this forum anyway, i did mention that we are getting a quotation for an all MINI driver training day at various tracks including Melbourne hopefully with sponsorship from BMW as part of a MINI drive programme, but if you blokes want to go off on your own tangent and organise things so be it.

I'm hearing you, :) I'm very interested in completing some driver training before I start flogging my beloved MINI around a race track, so I'll keep my eyes open for posts on said subject :D

Seems like everyone ignores half of what i've got to say on this forum anyway, i did mention that we are getting a quotation for an all MINI driver training day at various tracks including Melbourne hopefully with sponsorship from BMW as part of a MINI drive programme, but if you blokes want to go off on your own tangent and organise things so be it.

I am pretty sure that most of us who attend track meetings regularly do so because they are organised and available, we don't actually organise them ourselves. If you are planning a track day, I am in fully :D:D