I like the new Mini, after owning around twenty of the old ones, but now I choose...A Skoda Fabia!

Watching top gears report confirmed what I already know, that Skoda's are probably one of the best cars you can buy, even ignoring price!

There are people who buy things on looks alone, and on this the sweet looking Mini deserves genuine praise, but some of us look a little deeper when we lash out over £10,000, and this is where the Fabia wins hands down.

Quality, overall design, Driver appeal (Try one, and tell me you weren't impressed) and YES!!!! Resale value!
I have had a few now, and they get great part exchange prices, from non-arrogant dealers too!

The Skoda is better kitted, more spacious, more practical, more comfy and made by VW with VW parts.

It's a case of Style vs. Everything else, but I can still see the appeal of a Mini, but refuse to lower my standards to the bottom quarter of the JD Power survey results!

John

I like the new Mini, after owning around twenty of the old ones, but now I choose...A Skoda Fabia!

Hi and welcome to the board!


Quality, overall design, Driver appeal (Try one, and tell me you weren't impressed) and YES!!!! Resale value!
I have had a few now, and they get great part exchange prices, from non-arrogant dealers too!

Driver appeal? The MINI is by far the best handling car in it's segment (and even beyond). Even Tiff said the Cooper handled better. The Cooper was on 175/65R15 while the Skoda was on 205's. MINI does quite well in resale as well and there are some really nice BMW/MINI dealers around, as well as horrible Skoda dealers.


The Skoda is better kitted, more spacious, more practical, more comfy and made by VW with VW parts.

Hmm, does the Skoda come with heated wind screen? Anyway, the Fabia is better in the space and practicality department. Other than that, made by BMW with BMW parts.

Your point? Yes, the Fabia is a more sensible buy. A Suzuki Alto is maybe an even better buy as it has been stated the cheapest car to run for years.

I like the new Mini, after owning around twenty of the old ones, but now I choose...A Skoda Fabia!

Watching top gears report confirmed what I already know, that Skoda's are probably one of the best cars you can buy, even ignoring price!

There are people who buy things on looks alone, and on this the sweet looking Mini deserves genuine praise, but some of us look a little deeper when we lash out over £10,000, and this is where the Fabia wins hands down.

Quality, overall design, Driver appeal (Try one, and tell me you weren't impressed) and YES!!!! Resale value!
I have had a few now, and they get great part exchange prices, from non-arrogant dealers too!

The Skoda is better kitted, more spacious, more practical, more comfy and made by VW with VW parts.

It's a case of Style vs. Everything else, but I can still see the appeal of a Mini, but refuse to lower my standards to the bottom quarter of the JD Power survey results!

John
Your fairly balanced points are appreciated and quite valid in my opinion. See you on http://www.briskoda.net no doubt.

Thanks,

I was parked next to a fabia vrs the other day and I do like them - performance diesel vw build quality - ive just got to get this snobbish oh no not a Skoda thing out of my head, I wonder what the 1.9 130bhp engine would be like in the Mini?
How do any VRs owners find there car in comparisson to MCS MC etc?
Do you suprise a few people ith the power of the car?

Hi Guys!

Hi Spookyfish too!

There is more to driver appeal than handling, such as driving position, Feel of brakes, clutch, steering and ride, as well as ergonomics. Don't listen to anybody but drive a Fabia and form your own conclusions!

The other interesting thing about handling is that REAL roads unlike race tracks, come in many different qualities, and firmly sprung cars tend to hop about on bad surfaces, while more compliant ones soak up the bumps better, tend not to be as badly affected as firm ones and reduce driver fatigue too!
I ride large motorbikes, and some of the less sporty ones are better overall for this reason! Modern cars generally handle well, so it is easy to take most bends at a speed which you can't see round them within a safe stopping difference, so the ultimate handling will rarely be seen anyway (Try a track day to see how unbelievably fast a bend can be taken once the lamp posts and kerbs, not to mention other cars are taken out of the equation!)

This would make a Mini great for shorter trips, but try a Skoda on a longer journey and it makes sense, with effortless power, light, well balanced controls, and minimal noise (no pun intended!) You also don't have to rev the nads off it to get places fast...

The fuel economy is also leagues ahead, and most drivers like the appeal of an easy 50+mpg when it comes round to the cost of fuel!

I am sure that a fitter more youthful driver is going to have a great time in a Mini for sure, but after 500 miles in a day I feel great in the Skoda! (No heated screen, but heated seats, aircon, traction control, ABS, 4 airbags, and all the usual electric rubbish)

In fairness, the comparison is a strange one, as the Mini is a modern lifestyle purchase which oozes style, while the Skoda is definitely more of a thinking mans car, and maybe more of a long term purchase with the everlasting VW underpinnings and Diesel engine.
I think top gear did this as a stunt really, as the underlying appeal is so very different.

An intersting thing to note is that you really get respect from people who know and understand cars when you own a late Skoda Fabia or Octavia, whereas we all know the image problems associated with owning a Mini is the same as a BMW, Suzuki Vitara, Merc A class etc is a double edged sword (Stylish no doubt, but possibly a little poseurish too) which seems to be a British disease sadly.

The 130bhp Diesel engine would be interesting in a Mini, as it would in any smallish car, and my reckoning is that we will see a whole host of sporty Diesels appearing soon, as fuel costs increase and Diesel engines get better and better! The sheer torque of a good sub two-litre turbo diesel rivals many 3.0 litre V6's, and provides a huge grin when it kicks in! The Mondeo TDCi is apparantly quite wayward on a wet road under boost...

Regards, John

Diesel engines have definately come a long way in the last 5 years or so but they are very different to a petrol engine, especially a supercharged engine like the MCS. They both have advantages and disadvantages. A higher performance diesel engine will give you great torque and more impressively IMO great fuel consumption. Still, although the torque is impressive that is no doubt where nearly all the power is. For example my dads 320D BMW does actually pickup better at very low revs than my MCS but where my MCS really starts to get going his diesel has run out of the powerpand and requires a gear change, and IMO misses out some of the fun of revving a car. Also another downside for diesels is that the engines don't sound very nice either when idle or revved, but hopefully as technology improves so will the sound. It is definatley down to personal preference though and realistically if I done loads of miles, diesels would certainly be an option I would look into.

As for image problems with the MINI, I couldn't disagree more. All I have had (with no exception) is interest and compliments about my car. People I hardly know in my street have come over to talk about and even have a ride in my MINI. I often get flashed by fellow MINI owners, something which not only brings a smile to my face but to my passengers aswell, and I have also had conversations with complete strangers in petrol stations about my car. This level of interest, enthusiasm, friendlyness and respect is something that you won't get with most cars, and (as nice as the Fabia might be) certainly not a fabia. Yea the fabia might be a car people don't dislike but it won't be a car that people love either.

Nooooooo!

Fabia owners wave and flash too! It's surprising how many people approach you in a car park with comments like 'Really nice cars these new Skodas ' or 'Iv'e got one too, and I love it to bits' or more ominously 'I used to have a Skoda but it wasn't like this' at which point you floor the throttle and avoid the inevitable drivel from the 'Ex Skoda 110 LSE owner....lol

I suppose you get that with Mini's too though :D

I have (being in the motor trade since 1980) owned many Mercs, BMW's, Toyotas, a Lexus LS400 (best so far...) and other fancy bits of kit, but i have never been as satisfied with a car in overall terms as the Fabia! Maybe it's because one does not expect quite as much from a Skoda as a Toyota or something!?

If I had no kids, and the Mini was more reliable, I would love to have one, it's a cute thing to have parked in the driveway, and a friendly face in the morning too.(Does that make sense to you?) Feelgood factor looks like a standard fitment...

You never know, VW may add Mini to it's stable yet :D

Regards, John

I was parked next to a fabia vrs the other day and I do like them - performance diesel vw build quality - ive just got to get this snobbish oh no not a Skoda thing out of my head, I wonder what the 1.9 130bhp engine would be like in the Mini?
How do any VRs owners find there car in comparisson to MCS MC etc?
Do you suprise a few people ith the power of the car?
I would imagine that if the MINI were to have been built with the vRS's engine, it would be such a strong product.

In comparisons, it's such a subjective thing to express to others. I think all on this forum have valuable points for comparsion of the two vehicles. Personally speaking, when I bought my first MCS, the vRS didn't exist so I had effectively no choice then. It was the MCS or nowt really. Now after problem after problem with my two MCS's, I eventually had a change of mind and decided to use my brain instead of using my heart to choose a car... and that's where the vRS came in. End of story on that one I am afraid.

Power bands are beyond comparison as they are opposite. The diesel is all down low (1500rpm-4000rpm) whilst the petrol kicks off at about 4000rpm if memory served me correctly. That said, I never really noticed any surge of power from my MINI's and was disappointed by it's very "dry" and lazy response, but that's my opinion. I grew tired of driving like that on motorways to overtake, which is where I spend must of my life! In my opinion the diesel vRS is an absolute monster on the motorway. I cruises at sub-2000rpm and 70mph in sixth and honestly pulls like a train well past 120mph (alledgely). Which really does make a difference to my working day. I just engage any gear and confidently know that I have acres and acres of power there for emergency moves and overtaking (if required).

The fundamental thing to me is now driver comfort, composure and confidence. The Fabia vRS has that in spades, and then some. Unfortunately for me, very little of that was true and I lost total confidence in the product itself. A real shame, but I had to admit defeat.

And I have not looked back for one second.

:)

I have abandoned my Cooper in favour of a Fabia and there is definitely no going back.

If you have any pre-conceived ideas, throw them away and give the vRS a test drive. Obviously, it's not a Mini but it is an exceptional car in its own right.

On your test drive, choose 2nd gear with about 2000rpm and put your foot down (don't forget to check for clear road ahead as you will be catapaulted forward). It has more torque than a 530i

If you're a real speed freak, you can chip the engine to 180bhp and 300lb ft (yes lb ft not Nm). And, the suspension is easily modded.

Skoda have sold twice their predicted volume of this car so it must be doing something right

One more thing - fully kitted out it costs £12k before haggling and you can haggle off another £500. Throw in 55mpg and cheaper road tax and we're talking a real bargain.

Think Seat are using a simular motor with more power than the 130, you'll be the torque of the town with one of these :)

I have abandoned my Cooper in favour of a Fabia and there is definitely no going back.

If you have any pre-conceived ideas, throw them away and give the vRS a test drive. Obviously, it's not a Mini but it is an exceptional car in its own right.

On your test drive, choose 2nd gear with about 2000rpm and put your foot down (don't forget to check for clear road ahead as you will be catapaulted forward). It has more torque than a 530i

If you're a real speed freak, you can chip the engine to 180bhp and 300lb ft (yes lb ft not Nm). And, the suspension is easily modded.

Skoda have sold twice their predicted volume of this car so it must be doing something right

One more thing - fully kitted out it costs £12k before haggling and you can haggle off another £500. Throw in 55mpg and cheaper road tax and we're talking a real bargain.
Absolutely agreed. Mines Fabia-ulous too! See you on http://www.briskoda.net (http://www.briskoda.net/) then matey. I am waynef (http://www.briskoda.net/forums/member.php?u=1277) on there too.

...and here's an interesting bit for you all to read...
http://www.mini2.com/gallery/personal/waynef/35892.gif

Adios fellow Sooty fan!

Hi waynef,

I've read some of your posts on briskoda too.

The Seat that is basically the same car is the FR diesel version. The Cupra diesel is not yet available but will be more powerful.

Anyway, I prefer the chunkiness of the Fabia over the roundness of the Seat.

Just checked on the mini.co.uk site:

Cost of Mini Cooper to vRS standard spec £14930 (but includes part-leather seats in Chili pack)
Cost of Fabia vRS after haggling £11500

Difference £3430. Now that's a lot of money.

Now run it through the "what car" depreciometer and look at the ownership costs over 3 years, and add in the servicing cost of not having a TLC.

According to whatcar pence per mile:

Mini Cooper 33.7 (note this is standard car witout options)
Fabia vRS 33.0

Options depreciate faster than the car overall therefore pushing up the pence per mile figure. Besides, it's only the lack of supply driving the Mini 2nd hand price. If the Mini factory could produce faster and meet demand then 2nd hand prices will fall in line with sinilar cars (about 56% after 3 years). The VW factory has already produced over one million Fabias for shipment worldwide and a standard factory order is 10 weeks.

Besides, when you add in the JD Power results, the Mini doesn't look like a good long-term or second-hand buy. I remember JD Power in whatcar saying somethin like this: "If the survey what conducted just on mechanical reliability, the mini wouold have come last in its sector"

Now run it through the "what car" depreciometer and look at the ownership costs over 3 years, and add in the servicing cost of not having a TLC.

I reasonable point, but on balance and like MiniB says, MINI reliabilty (long-term) is shocking. Certainly that's been comfirmed by my two MCS's and their history that everyone on here is well aware of - I'll not mention it again - it's just too upsetting, really it is :(

Fact is you pay's your monies and you take's your choice where cars are concerned. I refuse to buy a car on the basis that it's resale value is strong, as that is a flawed argument:

a). it's only worth what someone is prepared to pay for it

b). resale values change radically throughout the term of ownership, so a strong perfomer like a MINI may look great on paper when you buy it, but by the time you come to sell, potential 2nd hand buyers maybe in a stronger position to haggle when things like "over-supply" occurs and cars become very popular - just like the MINI is becoming...

c). buying a car with only a view to selling it is frankly, a little strange. I know people do do it, but not everyone can envisage a day that that will occur, least of all me. I ain't made of money and I really wanted to keep my MINI until the day I died. Selling it was never an issue because I wasn't going to! No sir, never!


IMHO, the Fabia vRS offers way better performance than any MINI Cooper in a straight line, it struggles around corners where the MINI is frankly 2nd to none for the price, although your expensive, heavy, hard to find, hard to fit, hard run-flats would easily cancel that out eventually IMHO as the vRS is unbeatably comfortable on long journey's - whicj just about sums-up my driving 'profile' entirely.

It's a shame to say it, but in my eye's now, I see nothing more than a "toy" when I think of my MINI's. They certainly weren't up to the job I expected of them. They were [insert 4-letter word HERE].

Hang the resale. Not the DJ.

I thought this thread had died a death....we know that you have bought/ invested ? in a skoda. We know you like it, we know at least one other person shares your views.

Now go and find skoda friends that you can talk to about it because I for one am bored to the high teeth about how great it is. This is a mini site for mini owners/ enthusiasts so take your love of skoda to a skoda site.

adios :rolleyes:

I am a MINI fan - make NO mistake - to think otherwise is wrong.

I owned two and by that fact, and that I still check this site out on a daily basis, it should be pretty obvious that I am STILL A MINI FAN. Thanks for everyone for their valued and balanced discussions on here. They all give me and other food for thought when making a decision to buy a car. Whether it be a MINI, a Skoda, or any other car for that matter.

And as if to re-state my love for all things MINI, please view my other thread:
http://www.mini2.com/forum/showthread.php?t=54332 (http://www.mini2.com/forum/showthread.php?t=54332)

Thanks for making me and others feel so welcome though. Much appreciated.

I am a MINI fan - make NO mistake - to think otherwise is wrong.

I owned two and by that fact, and that I still check this site out on a daily basis, it should be pretty obvious that I am STILL A MINI FAN. Thanks for everyone for their valued and balanced discussions on here. They all give me and other food for thought when making a decision to buy a car. Whether it be a MINI, a Skoda, or any other car for that matter.

And as if to re-state my love for all things MINI, please view my other thread:
http://www.mini2.com/forum/showthread.php?t=54332 (http://www.mini2.com/forum/showthread.php?t=54332)

Thanks for making me and others feel so welcome though. Much appreciated.

Shut the door on your way out :D

Ok this isnt against the Skoda but anyone saw this comment about the MCS from Tiff? this episode was shown reciently here in the States on Speed TV.


Please Right click and save target as (~264KB (http://home.san.rr.com/ucsdxb0i/MCS.wmv))

Sorry for the low quality.

Ok this isnt against the Skoda but anyone saw this comment about the MCS from Tiff? this episode was shown reciently here in the States on Speed TV.


Please Right click and save target as (~264KB (http://home.san.rr.com/ucsdxb0i/MCS.wmv))

Sorry for the low quality.
Well the Skoda Fabia vRS is diesel, so there's little to excite the senses during tick-over. Personally I loved the MCS Supercharger whine and miss it every day now.

Mind you, I am not missing going to the filling station. For every visit in my vRS, would have had to go more than twice in my MCS's. I have not changed my driving style one bit, and that makes a hell of a difference to my working day.

the ocativia vrs is quicker that the cooper s, particularly at higher speeds. You do have the badge issue but the reality is that the skodas are better/as well built, as most premium brands.

Diesel engines have definately come a long way in the last 5 years or so but they are very different to a petrol engine, especially a supercharged engine like the MCS. They both have advantages and disadvantages. A higher performance diesel engine will give you great torque and more impressively IMO great fuel consumption. Still, although the torque is impressive that is no doubt where nearly all the power is. For example my dads 320D BMW does actually pickup better at very low revs than my MCS but where my MCS really starts to get going his diesel has run out of the powerpand and requires a gear change, and IMO misses out some of the fun of revving a car. Also another downside for diesels is that the engines don't sound very nice either when idle or revved, but hopefully as technology improves so will the sound. It is definatley down to personal preference though and realistically if I done loads of miles, diesels would certainly be an option I would look into.


Wow, I havn't seen this thread for a while.

How times change. Since my above comment I have actually sold my MCS for a VW Golf GTTDI 130 (basically a Skoda Fabia vRS). What is crazy is the opinion I had of diesels back then is exactly what I think of them now - all that has changed is what I want from a car these days. I now truely know the meaning of different strokes for different folkes.

Yes, me too, since originally reading this article, I've sold my Cooper S and bought a Audi A3 3.2 Quattro DSG. Different car altogether, and probably better than the skoda.