[bok]

I am quite pulled in different directions at the moment and was looking for some feedback from Mini owners.

Looking at buying a Mini in Calgary and have been getting great service from Craig (hi Craig), my only problem is trying to justify spending the extra money to get the Cooper S Rallye edition over the Cooper Soho edition.

I like the seats and some of the other things about the Rallye, but would have to buy winter tyres which would be another extra grand or so.

So I guess the question is, do you think it's worth it to get the Cooper S over the Cooper in this situation?

[heli_guy]

Hi,

Welcome to Mini world. I own a cooper. Not an S. The reason why was simple for me:

Price, and ownership cost. To me the regular cooper's performance is great, the S must be better, but the regular one was good enough for me and the type of driving I do. I can only go so fast up to the speed limit anyway . Also, mileage was a big factor in choosing a car, and the cooper get's way better mileage than the S and in Calgary, I have been able to sucessfully run regular fuel (not premium like the S requires), and am getting better mileage than running premium. This may be different at other altitudes, but due to Calgary's high altitude it works for me.

Again, for the S you need winter tires and such, and there may be more maintainance required for the supercharger (not sure though).

So ultimately I personally think you need to decide what you want the car for. If you want the extra performance and such the S gives, then get the S. If you want a more economical but still fun car, get the Cooper.

My thoughts, I'm sure you will enjoy whatever you get!
Trevor.

Oh yeah, don't believe anything Craig has to say

[bok]

hmm, Craig said you were a handsome intelligent guy...i will not listen to him anymore

thanks for your input, that's the kind of stuff i am looking for

[Ferroequine]

I have an S (which funnily enough also came from Craig ), and I am quite addicted to that great power delivery and supercharger whine you get when you put your foot into it at around 4,000 rpm.

I came from a 245 HP V8 sportscar, so I was already addicted to power. Plus I think the bulgier 'S' bonnet gives the car a bit better front end look with a bull-dog stance, a bit more similar to the Classic Mini.

In the end, like Heli_guy already said, it depends on what you're wanting to get out of the car. If you haven't already, test drive both the Cooper and the 'S' if possible. FWIW, I drove a Cooper a couple of months ago and they still go pretty good - you just don't get the extra 'oomph' and 'kick in the butt' from the forced air induction .

Oh, and when buying a MINI, it makes sense to buy one from a British guy, doesn't it?

[RS3TURN]

I own a 2004 S. Most of the time my wife uses the car for commuting to/from work.
If I could do it again I would buy a cooper. It has enough performance and is a much more practical car than the S. The few times I've had a cooper as a loaner my wife and I have actually enjoyed driving it in more than our MCS. It feels much easier to drive than the MCS. Sure there isn't the same power there when you mash the pedal, but good enough for city driving.

Why not buy used. Hint hint.

[RS3TURN]

Quote: Originally Posted by MiniVee

I came from a 245 HP V8 sportscar, so I was already addicted to power.

haha. I came from a 400hp V6 Twin Turbo.
Miss the power, but my wallet thanks me.

[beken]

Hi Bok,

I own an S. But I started out looking at a Cooper. Actually a Cooper Classic. I would not have bought an S if I didn't suddenly come into some money (severance package and found another job right away). Where I am, the addition horsepower for highway hill climbing is certainly useful, but a Cooper would have certainly been adequate.

If budget is a concern, then skip on the S and buy a Cooper. Insurance is a bit higher for an S and fuel mileage, though very good, is not quite as good as the Cooper's.

For the extra $5K to upgrade to an S, you get...supercharger and intercooler, stiffer suspension, bigger runflat tires, extra set of tailpipes (and muffler), battery in the back, big chrome fuel door, 6 speed transmission and slightly different interior and exterior options. Certainly worth the upgrade price. But with the upgrade comes responsibility, of handling the extra power as well as the maintenance costs (insurance and things that might go wrong).

Personally, I found the Cooper engine to rev more freely and more engaging to drive. But this is offset by the extra power in the Cooper S engine and the extra gear ration in the transmission.

Only you can make that choice based on your budget and realistically looking at your driving needs.

[xtremepsionic]

Everything worth saying seems to have been said already in this thread. I bought my car from Craig as well (Hi Craig) and I think you should just listen to what he tells you :P

Personally I bought a Cooper without looking at an S because I was on a budget. The Cooper is fast enough to get you into serious trouble (ever tried top speed in 5th? I have confirmed that the listed top speed is infact, correct) and if you stick semi close to the speed limits, the extra performance of the S doesn't matter a whole lot. Of course, if you're used to driving more powerful cars and like passing other cars without downshifting or giving it much thought, then the S would be a much better choice. The Cooper definitely isn't a "fast" car, you'll get smoked at the lights by mini vans. If you like to be faster than most people from the lights, get an S.

The Cooper is 200lbs lighter than the S, so in theory it should feel more nimble and it is more economical. In Calgary city driving I'm able to average about 34mpg (42 UK mpg) but I do spend a lot of time crusing down Crowchild doing like 90km/h, so you'll probably get worse mileage than I do.

As for tires, its not really an extra expense, just something you NEED to buy regardless. I take full advantage of every ounce of performance in my Cooper, and my stock all season tires are pretty much bald now at just 19000km. I will need to get winter tires later this year.

Strangely I prefer the non Sports seats (sports seats are standard on the S, right?), but thats just me. And even though I corner pretty quickly all the time, I think the SS suspension has enough control that I don't ever feel like the suspension is slowing me down or lack roll stiffness. The SS+ suspension is more stable and make the car more tossable, but it does give an even stiffer ride. The difference isn't huge though, and I'm sure I'll be happy with both setups.

Drive both and see which one you like better. The best thing to do on test drives is to drive like you normally do. Don't baby the car or thrash it just because you're on a test drive.

[bok]

Well you all made great sense and i talked to my brother on the phone tonight and it came down to.
"For you is the extra money worth it for seats and the HK sound system?" since those were the only real options i was pining for in the Rallye edition.

So, I went up to talk to Craig and have a lovely Hyper Metallic Blue Cooper Soho Edition with a black roof coming "sometime soon" apparently it's on Mars or in Southampton or something equally far from me.

Now i guess i have to do the obligatory, "I can't wait for my Mini" post

So far the experience has been great and I hope the wait doesn't kill me hahah

Thanks Craig for all your hard work and tree killing on my behalf

[RS3TURN]

Quote: Originally Posted by xtremepsionic

Everything worth saying seems to have been said already in this thread. I bought my car from Craig as well (Hi Craig) and I think you should just listen to what he tells you :P

Personally I bought a Cooper without looking at an S because I was on a budget. The Cooper is fast enough to get you into serious trouble (ever tried top speed in 5th? I have confirmed that the listed top speed is infact, correct) and if you stick semi close to the speed limits, the extra performance of the S doesn't matter a whole lot. Of course, if you're used to driving more powerful cars and like passing other cars without downshifting or giving it much thought, then the S would be a much better choice. The Cooper definitely isn't a "fast" car, you'll get smoked at the lights by mini vans. If you like to be faster than most people from the lights, get an S.

The Cooper is 200lbs lighter than the S, so in theory it should feel more nimble and it is more economical. In Calgary city driving I'm able to average about 34mpg (42 UK mpg) but I do spend a lot of time crusing down Crowchild doing like 90km/h, so you'll probably get worse mileage than I do.

As for tires, its not really an extra expense, just something you NEED to buy regardless. I take full advantage of every ounce of performance in my Cooper, and my stock all season tires are pretty much bald now at just 19000km. I will need to get winter tires later this year.

Strangely I prefer the non Sports seats (sports seats are standard on the S, right?), but thats just me. And even though I corner pretty quickly all the time, I think the SS suspension has enough control that I don't ever feel like the suspension is slowing me down or lack roll stiffness. The SS+ suspension is more stable and make the car more tossable, but it does give an even stiffer ride. The difference isn't huge though, and I'm sure I'll be happy with both setups.

Drive both and see which one you like better. The best thing to do on test drives is to drive like you normally do. Don't baby the car or thrash it just because you're on a test drive.

Well said. I completely agree. Even though I was used to the power in my previous car, I think the cooper is a better buy. Just passed the 1/2 way mark on my lease, only 2.5 more years....uggghhh. The cooper makes a more competitive autocross car also!

Bok, you made a good choice. Congrats on the purchase!

[heli_guy]

Yes congrats, you will like it I'm sure. See you at a run sometime soon.

Speaking of which, there has been nothing in Calgary for a long time now. When is the next one??

[bok]

make it late august or september so i can make it lol

or i might just have to ride my bike along with the pack (lord knows the car i have doesn't corner like a mini)

[velveteen_mini]

Congratulations on your purchase.

As to tires, my Cooper has 16" run flats. I went to my regular tire guy here in Vancouver and purchased 15" rims and winter tires for less than 2 tires at MINI. It is now two years later and I know that the 16" rims are more readily available. Check out your local tire places when you are ready to buy that winter rubber. My winter rims almost fooled MINI, they look quite similar to factory.

I have done track days in the Cooper (and it's an automatic!) and I toss it around the corners on drives and throughout my comute. In fact, I once found myself doing over 100k through an S curve sandwiched between two motorcycles. All three of us were grinning like idiots. As long as I don't try to jump off the line, I'm fine. My point is, you can still have a great time in a Cooper. Enjoy.

[bok]

the 16's on the Soho are all season rubber but not knowing how the Mini and winter get along, would it make sense to get winter tires anyway and get better summer tires ...or run the all seasons and see how i like em?

[xtremepsionic]

That depends on your comfort level and experience with driving on snow. Personally I think its ok to drive in the winter here with fresh (less than half worn) all season tires. I never got stuck once last year using all seasons. However I do have the narrower 175/65/15 tires, so that makes grip in snow a bit better than your 16". Still, I think its quite acceptable to drive on those all seasons.

Besides, if you do decide mid winter that you should get snow tires, you won't be any worse off financially. velveteen_mini's advice is great, shop for used tires and rims now that you're (im)patiently waiting for your MINI to arrive

Here is my first impression on really slick ice/snow last year
http://www.xp.solidhelium.com/Mini/firstsnownov2005.htm

[beken]

Congratulations on your order, Bok.

Of course, pictures are manditory on MINI2 when your car arrives.

Look forward to reading about your motoring antics too.

[RS3TURN]

Quote: Originally Posted by xtremepsionic

That depends on your comfort level and experience with driving on snow. Personally I think its ok to drive in the winter here with fresh (less than half worn) all season tires. I never got stuck once last year using all seasons. However I do have the narrower 175/65/15 tires, so that makes grip in snow a bit better than your 16". Still, I think its quite acceptable to drive on those all seasons.

IMO. You'll be fine driving with the all-season (no-season) tires as the majority of people have done for years.....BUT, better safe than sorry. No all-season tire comes close to providing the level of grip and safety that winter tires do. The cost of one fender bender is easily higher that a set of winter tires. My 15" (FRD - 6) rims with Kumho tires cost just over $800. Plus you will extend the life of your all-season tires.

I say run the all-seasons in summer until it is time to replace them. Then upgrade to better summer rubber.

[bok]

grew up in manitoba/northdakota so running in snow on less than perfect tires isn't a huge worry, but i think i may switch to proper tires for the proper season when the stock ones wear in a bit.

now if i could only figure out how to GPS track my mini

[Ferroequine]

One other thing to remember about buying winter tires is that while you have them on your car, you are not putting any mileage on your summer threads; thus you are increasing their live span and you don't have to buy new summer tires nearly as quickly as if you were running them year-round.

FWIW, I run 16" winter tires. There is no comparison between a winter tire and an all-season.


Edit: Oops RS3 beat me to it.

[bok]

arrrrgh, will the waiting game never end.

apparently my car is in town and was at the rail yard yesterday.
i desperately need a good night's sleep and the wait is driving me mad.

Now i expect Craig to chime in and taunt me with a delivery date.

I've tried to avoid Minis so as not to tease myself, but watching Bones last night, there was an old right hand drive red mini...and then i watched Distraction and the grand prize was ...another Red Mini!!

this morning on the drive to work, there was an all Red mini beside me on 12th Ave.

thank goodness mine will be blue so i won't feel so common.

ahh, now i feel a bit better, at least it looks as though i should have my new baby any day now.