[Daddu]

I sent this to MINIUSA
question/comment:
I WAS excited about the new Mini, Notice the word WAS is in capital letters, this is because the way your Dealers are Adding $500- $2400 of MANDATORY Dealer installed items!!!!!!! Some Dealers are charging $5000 over Sticker !!!! When this happened with the FORD T-BIRD, they cut off that dealers supply. Again I don't need to hear that every Dealer is Independently Owned. MINIUSA should step in and do something, A letter, reduced ordering, etc. Oh by the way there are many people that I have spoken to that don't like the Dealers scamming people.

Their response
Automobile manufacturers have the right to establish the Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Price (MSRP). The dealer and consumer determine the transaction price.

Please keep in mind that our MINI dealer candidates are independently owned and operated. They determine the details of their own sales transactions, including selling price and waiting lists.

Prospective purchasers should carefully evaluate the price-value relationship of the vehicle being offered. May I suggest you work with your future MINI sales representative to discuss pricing that includes product specifications, delivery, and deposit arrangements.

I apologize for any frustration you have experienced in your efforts to try to acquire a MINI passenger car in the United States.

Sincerely,

Steve Smith
MINI Division
Customer Relations

[Daddu]

All I can say is, what my daughter would say,"WHATEVER!"

[Paul]

I like the way you state you dont need to be told they are independent...

And the response...

[gromit]

Looks like the canned response everyone that complained has gotten. I wouldn't give up hope yet of it having some effect upon allocations, they've gotta be getting tired of hearing about the gouging.

[Daddu]

The WEB, It's a beautiful thing!!

[MiniMoke]

Does this mean that the reciept I have, good for one MINI Cooper S at MSRP means the dealer can decide what-ever they want to charge?

[sixfoot6]

Just as soon as I have time to word a proper response, I too will be voicing my frustration to MINI USA at both the outrageous dealer mark-ups (mandatory $4500 wheels) as well as the delays in popular colors on the S (to enable them to make more money... erm, cars).

I suggest everyone do the same... let's be heard here.

sixfoot6

[mixdman]

Here's what I got back from MINI after complaining about Niello MINI in Sacramento.


"I understand your frustration with dealers charging a premium price.
However, we chose our dealers based on their excellent customer service
history.

We're sorry about how you were handled regarding the waiting list you
were on, lack of communication and the purchase of your new MINI.

As you stated in your letter, you are aware that the dealers operate
independently. They determine the details of their own sales
transactions, including selling price and waiting lists. Unfortunately, we cannot
force them to sell a MINI at a certain price. We can only encourage them
to sell it at the MSRP. Prospective purchasers should carefully
evaluate the price-value relationship of the vehicle being offered.

We do care how customers and potential customers are treated by, not
only our dealers but by the entire MINI Division. Please know that your
complaint is being reviewed by our management.

Again, please accept our most sincere apology for the way you were
treated."

Sincerely,
Jen Schuelke
MINI Division
Customer Relations


Since when is $699 for paint proctection and mats and added value and part of the MSRP???

[MINIsota_Cuke]

The second letter in this thread sounded as if the Customer Service Rep. actually read the letter, but the first one sounds like it should be in a letter-writing manual under the topic of "How to write a form letter".

[Daddu]

Creative Writing 101: Form Letters and You.

Creative Writing 102: Form Letters to make it appear you care.
Creative Writing 103: Form Letters and Legalities.
Creative W Well you get the Idea!!!!

[Coati1]

I think they use the same letter with a computer making random grammatical variations and assigning a random name to the signature block.
Here's mine:

I am sorry to read of your disappointment with the MINI dealerships in your area.

Please keep in mind that our MINI dealer candidates are independently owned and operated. They determine the details of their own sales transactions, including selling price and waiting lists.

Automobile manufacturers have the right to establish the Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Price (MSRP). The dealer and consumer determine the transaction price.

Prospective purchasers should carefully evaluate the price-value relationship of the vehicle being offered.

I printed your complaint, and will share it with our national dealer manager on Monday 4/1.

Sincerely,

Wayne Kung
MINI Division
Customer Relations


--Original Message--

First name: xxxx
Last name: xxxx

question/comment:
We had high hopes of gettting a Mini Cooper S loaded with exactly the options we'd wanted. Unfortunately, last Saturday when we visited two dealers near us, Crevier and Irvine, the mandatory dealer-installed options and added markups were beyond predatory. Ludicrous is a more apt description. $800 dollars to have the dealer wax the car, and $3,600 for rims that aren't as nice as the stock one, or in Irvine's case, silly overpriced needless options and then a $1,500 added markup. Paying these fees both eats up the money we would be using to order the factory options desired, and defeats the whole concept of the Mini as a car customized just for its owner.

I realize the "dealers are independent" but there must be something BMW/Mini can do. I'm sure we're neither the first nor the last potential customers to complain about this, but I'd like to add our voices to the chorus of the displeased. Our own local dealer, Brecht, doesn't even have any cars yet, so maybe there's hope their behavior will be better. If not, we'll be waiting until the madness dies down, or until we find a different car to buy.

Thanks for your time.
xxxx

[BOFH]

Quote:

Originally posted by Daddu
Creative Writing 101: Form Letters and You.

Creative Writing 102: Form Letters to make it appear you care.
Creative Writing 103: Form Letters and Legalities.
Creative W Well you get the Idea!!!!

Yup. But I'm in a different position -- I'm not in a hurry to grab a Mini or ANY new car at this point. There are too many new cars being released in the coming months to really dedicate myself to one. Yes, I'm on the waiting list at my local dealer, but I can guarantee everyone that if they begin screwing around with options, MSRP, etc., I won't get one. Currently, the local dealer isn't doing this (amazing, isn't it?), but they could.

I like the Mini as much as anyone else. And I see the tremendous potential the Mini has a super-fun-to-drive go-kart that gets great gas mileage. But the Mini / BMW dealers need to realize that those of us that are in the market for a new car will have (very soon) a HUGE set of options for other cars in the coming months. I kid you not, I still want an RX-8 -- mainly because I've always wanted a rotary engined car. If my local Mini dealer jacks around with me, I'll get an RX-8. I hope it doesn't come to that (the RX-8 is more money), but these are the choices that dealers make.

Just my $0.02, and that's what it's worth. . .

[rich]

Frankly I'm amazed that MINI USA tolerate this kind of behaviour from dealers. If they cannot see that it will cost them lost sales then they are fools. Their response actually suggests that they may be encouraging the option-loading approach... i.e. Nowhere do they oppose it

It might be legal, it might be good for profits (in the short term only), but I can't see it's good for long term business, and it's certainly not a practice that has any integrity whatsoever

The only thing we have seen in Aus that has any similarity to the US situation is the pre-spec cars - But that is only basically the first month's supply of cars. After that, you pay only for what you want

[PghArch]

I suspect that MiniUSA has no choice but to tacitly allow the dealers to do as they like. Any action which a dealer could argue impacts them financially could potentially be grounds of a restraint of trade suit or somesuch. For example, say MiniUSA replies with a letter stating that "This dealer is being contacted relative to these complaints and will receive a reduced shipment of cars if they do not engage in fairer trade practices." I wouldn't be surprised if a dealer could use a subsequent drop in new car deposits along with such a statement as grounds for action.

Unfortunately, in this land of lawyers, the best action is probably to do as the form letter says. Don't pay more for the car than you are happy with. Wait, or find another dealer. I put down a reserve spot one week ago here in Pittsburgh, and they have already contacted me about some pre-spec MINI's being available. I've since decided I need the S though. In any case, the original Cooper looks to be a pretty short wait within six months, especially for the manual transmission.

[Apex]

I wonder if MINI has customer satisfaction surveys or post sale follow up?

When I bought my Ford Explorer 2 years ago, the dealer practically begged me to give them a good grade on the follow up survey. It appears that there was some incentive money riding on them getting a good report.

If MINI is a class company, they will have some type of dealer rating after the sale.

Anybody know?

[sixfoot6]

I do know that MINI chose the BMW dealerships they did based on a number of criteria, one of which was that dealership's current customer satisfaction rating. So BMW keeps track of this, somehow...

Unfortunately it's most likely that they ask for your satisfaction only *after* you've purchased the car... such that those dissatisfied enough to walk away never voice their reasons for doing so.

sixfoot6

[mixdman]

Here is a response from MINI USA followed by my original blog.


Hello Mr. XXXX,

This isn't a form letter, and it isn't scripted. (If it were it would be very badly done.) We are really sorry that your dealership experience didn't meet your standards. We are very attentive to our customers comments, and we do listen. Please understand the relationship with our
MINI dealers is as an independent franchisee, and like most car dealers in America, they are independent businesses and we cannot restrict their trade.

To oversimplify, a rough analogy of the independent business relationship can work with lemonade stands. If you went to a roadside lemonade stand somewhere, and they wanted to charge you $5 for a lemonade, and
then another stand down the road may be selling the exact same brand and size of lemonade for $1.50. The lemonade manufacturer sells it to all the stands at the same price of $1. Then again, if it's really hot out,
some people are pretty thirsty and want the lemonade right away from the $5 stand. (Then again you might just buy iced tea.) Would you never buy that brand of lemonade because of the $5 stand?

Moral of the story: As a consumer, if you are dissatisfied with a sales offer, you have the right to refuse purchase and shop, if you choose. Each dealership is an independent business that has different sales
policies. Like any consumer product, we sell to the dealers at the same price, and set MSRP.

We're really sorry, we are trying very hard to improve our customer experiences. We care very much that we may have lost you as a customer. Is there anything we can do? Write back or call us at 1-866-ASK-MINI if you'd like to talk about it.

With deepest apologies,
Wayne
MINI Division



--Original Message--

I can see that MINI USA really does not care about
their image. Nothing has been done, talked about,
responded to, etc, regarding dealers losing customers
due to dealer add-ons and poor customer service. This
really does not make MINI a unique car company. It was an unfortunate decision to choose Niello BMW to represent your company and I am now re-thinking eve buying a MINI. But of course, you don't care if only one
little customer is lost, and that's really a sad state
of affairs for a company....it seems to be all to
common these days.
XXXXXX
ex MINI lover


------------------------------------------------------------------------

[sixfoot6]

that is an awful nice letter...

to further clarify the situation though...

there's only 4 local lemonade stands. we've been in line, under the hot sun, for a year now. we were promised lemonade at 1.50. actually, the lemonade still costs a dollar fifty, but now the cup's another dollar. stands a few cities away have the same lemondade for that buck fifty, only it means starting at the back of the line again. sure is hot out.

iced-tea anyone?

i don't know what to think of any of this anymore, except that a lot of dealers and salespeople representing MINI simply aren't being very MINI. i got caught up in the good spirits, fun driving, 'lets motor' attitude; and they certainly haven't.

patience.

sixfoot6

[mixdman]

Check out this latest response. Did I ask for a dealer recommendation?

Hi Mixdman ,

I'm sorry, but I am unable to recommend any dealers for you. The best thing I can suggest is for you to confer with your fellow MINI fans to see if they have any recommendations.

Best wishes,
Wayne
MINI Customer Relations



--Original Message--

To answer your lemonade question... I would go to the
lemonade store that is .owned. operated. stocked. etc.
byt the /maker of the lemonade to buy the product.... For
example, Saturn car company. They have control over the way their product is sold...

This should have been the way MINI came back to the US. Customer service and realtime value pricing are what matters to American customers now. People will turn away from a company easily. There are other cute little cars out there and there are more on the near horizon. The MINI is a quality product so far, but if the service in the field does not match the quality of this
product, then there is no sale.

[jcam711]

Apex,

You raise an interesting question regarding customer satisfaction surveys. As a consultant, I have developed these for automotive clients. The dealers definitely receive incentives for high customer satisfaction (which is why they try to bias their customers by "coaching" them to give 5's). I have only had my MINI a few days, but it would be normal to receive a phone survey quickly, and a mail survey within the first few weeks. I also registered at miniusa in the owner's lounge which is another opportunity for BMW/MINI to conduct a web survey of customer experiences. So far, nothing. (Fortunately, I'm very pleased with my dealer).

In addition to mfg sponsored surveys, there are industry surveys by JD Edwards and other organizations ... so that is another place where we will be heard.