[dev_null]

I visited Universal City, Crevier, Alexander, and Long Beach to get my MINI.........UC=buy all this crap or you don't get the car. Long beach you don't have to buy any extras but no cars to sell....... gee thats great, cheap but unavailable? Crevier about $4000 over window......Alexander I couldn't get waited on. I then went to Assael in Monrovia...talked to Nick very nice soft spoken gentleman. He stated that due to demand there was a premium, OK but can I get a car? Nick said he had a couple coming in, 2 days later he called Dark Grey S, OK perfect how much? Sorry he said we don't quote prices over the phone, alright I said I'll be right over. When I got there He stated the price would be $3000 over sticker but no extra accessories had to be purchased, we haggled for a few minutes and he finally sold me the car for $2500 over sticker. I think I got a good deal based on all the other dealers, plus I'm driving a great car. About 3 days after I got the car Nick called me and said he forgot to give me something, I went over and he gave me a $100 gift certificate for accessories, or service, I attacked the t-shirt display and loaded up. All in all I don't mind paying a premium, It's like Lobster "market price"--LOL

[sixfoot6]

If you got money to burn, and you don't want to spec your own car, Assael's your man.

Personally I've got better ways to spend two and a half grand...

and one of the things I love most about my MINI is that it'll be built specifically for ME.

have fun with yours,
sixfoot6

[jediprincess]

I went to assael yesturday (6/11) and test drove a Cooper S for the 2nd time. Let's just say that the are not decisive on how much they want to charge for their premiums. The first time I talked to them, they said the markup on a Cooper S is about $3000. About 3 weeks later (if that) I came back and they were telling me markup for the same vehicle will be $10,000. Let me tell you...THAT'S ABSOLUTELY OUTRAGEOUS!!! You'll probably end up paying $40,000 for a car whose base price is $19,300. The saddest part is that there are people out there who will actually pay that.

Izzy

[Sealevel]

Money talks-MINI Rocks-BS Walks: philosophy of life by dev_null

Very humanitarian and selfless outlook. Welcome to the community, I'm sure you'll be an assael, oops, asset.

[jediprincess]

Hey I am just letting everyone what the deal is with assael. I am going with Long Beach because they don't charge a markup!

Isabel

[Sealevel]

Quote:

Originally posted by jediprincess
Hey I am just letting everyone what the deal is with assael. I am going with Long Beach because they don't charge a markup!

Isabel

No problem Isabel, the post was for dev_null. Welcome to the community, truly, you'll be a plus

[dev_null]

Quote:

Originally posted by Sealevel
Money talks-MINI Rocks-BS Walks: philosophy of life by dev_null

Very humanitarian and selfless outlook. Welcome to the community, I'm sure you'll be an assael, oops, asset.

Well it looks like I have found a friend. Apparently someone who thinks different than you is to be considered an Ass****. My, my aren't we so grown up and adult. Well here is a flash. I'm happy with my deal, I earned it, I can spend it any way I want to. I'm sure that you are mother Teresa and give all your money to the blind. As my sainted mother used to say, There is always one more sob than you counted on". She was right! Perhaps your nick should be seafloor,or bottom feeder. The only MINI you will ever own, or subscribe to, is your intellect.
"Sixfoot" An intelligent response I do have a "little" to burn, and I was in a hurry, if both people in a deal are happy who is harmed?
"JediPrincess" I'm also happy that you are happy, personal attacks have no place. I wish you and sixfoot all the best, sea-dweller, however can continue to bottom feed. Perhaps a nice tasty carp would suit him/her/it.... LOL

[MGB Boy]

Isn't that fun, someone says "personal attacks have no place" in the midst of a posting filled with them. Makes sense

-Ricardo

[MINIMatthew]

Boy, am I ever glad I live in Canada where it's illegal to charge over MSRP for a car. Well, that might only be Ontario, but the point is I paid sticker price for my Cooper and not a penny more, just like everybody else. Of course, dealers can still charge $1500 for a mandatory 6 disc CD changer if they want, but luckily my dealer isn't doing that. Enjoy your car dev_null.

[erazo]

Quote:

Originally posted by MINIMatthew
Boy, am I ever glad I live in Canada where it's illegal to charge over MSRP for a car. Well, that might only be Ontario, but the point is I paid sticker price for my Cooper and not a penny more, just like everybody else.

And if you turn around and resell the car, do these price controls continue to apply?
Scarcity + price controls = increased scarcity.

[MINIMatthew]

Quote:

Originally posted by erazo
And if you turn around and resell the car, do these price controls continue to apply?
Scarcity + price controls = increased scarcity.

No, those price controls don't apply if I resell my car. If I wanted to sell my car for more than MSRP and found someone stupid (or desperate) enough to buy it, there's nothing to stop me. In Canada we have to sign a Right of First Offer/Refusal with MINI Canada saying that if we sell within a year, we have to offer it to MINI Canada first. But that still doesn't stop me from selling it above MSRP.

I'm not sure what you're getting at.... Anyone can go to the dealer and pay MSRP - that doesn't make MINIs and more scarce.

[PigLick]

dev_null, I'm glad you got the car you wanted and are happy with your deal, but I don't think most of us here would consider paying $2500 over MSRP a "good experience." But again, I'm glad you got what you wanted, and feel good about it, though I wish no one out there was willing to do things like this, because it really hurts the rest of us who can't pay the "premium charges." As for myself, I'll continue to avoid Assael for anything more than a test drive center, and in a few months when I'm ready to buy go somewhere where I'll be happier.

PigLick

[erazo]

Quote:

Originally posted by MINIMatthew
I'm not sure what you're getting at.... Anyone can go to the dealer and pay MSRP - that doesn't make MINIs and more scarce.

Not "anyone" exactly. The MINI market at MSRP is a rationed one...meaning most buyers have to get on a waiting list or pay premiums of one sort of another, or both. So the only way you can keep prices down is to ration the product. Sort of like the former Soviet grocery shelves.

But the price controls in Canada aren't universally applied. As you said, you are free to scalp, but the dealer isn't.

I like that First Right of Refusal provision, and the no-export clause I've heard about too. And someone else said you can't sell your place on the waiting list in Canada as some have done here and in the UK. Clever devices in an attempt to make the rationing more equitable. Some U.S. dealers are trying to sell only to local markets or to their regular BMW customers before allowing "outsiders" a high spot on their lists.

The laws of supply and demand at work before our very eyes....

[dev_null]

Quote:

Originally posted by PigLick
dev_null, I'm glad you got the car you wanted and are happy with your deal, but I don't think most of us here would consider paying $2500 over MSRP a "good experience." But again, I'm glad you got what you wanted, and feel good about it, though I wish no one out there was willing to do things like this, because it really hurts the rest of us who can't pay the "premium charges." As for myself, I'll continue to avoid Assael for anything more than a test drive center, and in a few months when I'm ready to buy go somewhere where I'll be happier.

PigLick

Let me get this straight.... It's ok to take their time to test drive but other than that you'll go somewhere else. Perhaps if someone was wasting your time you would think a little differently. Supply and demand is the American way, if the car is worth more people will pay more, I personally have purchased many a car for less, actually much less than factory window price. Some times your the windshield, some times you're the bug.

[dev_null]

Quote:

Originally posted by MGB Boy
Isn't that fun, someone says "personal attacks have no place" in the midst of a posting filled with them. Makes sense

-Ricardo

I wouldn't expect that you would comprehend the fact that I did not start any personal attack. Perhaps the 14th century motoring has clouded your ability to reason. MG?

[MGB Boy]

Quote:

Originally posted by dev_null

I wouldn't expect that you would comprehend the fact that I did not start any personal attack. Perhaps the 14th century motoring has clouded your ability to reason.

This from someone who wrote "My, my aren't we so grown up and adult. ... I'm sure that you are mother Teresa and give all your money to the blind. As my sainted mother used to say, There is always one more sob than you counted on". She was right! Perhaps your nick should be seafloor,or bottom feeder. The only MINI you will ever own, or subscribe to, is your intellect."

Whatever...

-Ricardo

[erazo]

Quote:

Originally posted by PigLick
...it really hurts the rest of us who can't pay the "premium charges."

I really don't think anyone is "hurt" by a handful of unscrupulous dealers who run their dealerships like auction houses and cater to those who "can pay" any more than those who can't even afford MSRP are hurt, or than we would be if MSRP were raised above what we paid.

We traded our time for the lower price. Others like dev_null would rather pay more to wait less. Meanwhile, those who wait benefit from a smaller depreciation than those who didn't.

[PigLick]

dev_null, yep, that's right, I'm going to "waste their time" by taking test drives there but buy somewhere else, just like they'll be wasting my time by making me drive further to get to a dealer that is selling at a price I'm willing to pay (namely, MSRP). I don't see anything unfair about that. If they want me to not "waste their time," I'd be happy to buy a car from them at MSRP. It's their choice how much to charge, just as it's my choice to choose when and where I buy.

erazo, I see what you're saying, but what I was getting at is that if no one was willing to pay over MSRP, then no MINIs would be sold over MSRP, whouch would mean those of us who can't (or won't) pay over MSRP would have a fair chance at getting a car early, rather than being "forced" to wait. Of course, that's all fairy-tale talk, there will always be people willing to pay more than MSRP, and will always be people who can't or won't. I'm not trying to moan and groan about that (I'm not even ready to buy yet anyway, regadless of whether I can/will pay over MSRP), just saying that it would be nice.

PigLick

[dev_null]

Quote:

Originally posted by PigLick
dev_null, I'd be happy to buy a car from them at MSRP. It's their choice how much to charge, just as it's my choice to choose when and where I buy.

erazo, I see what you're saying, but what I was getting at is that if no one was willing to pay over MSRP, then no MINIs would be sold over MSRP, whouch would mean those of us who can't (or won't) pay over MSRP would have a fair chance at getting a car early, rather than being "forced" to wait. Of course, that's all fairy-tale talk, there will always be people willing to pay more than MSRP, and will always be people who can't or won't.
PigLick

Economics 101: what if MSRP were higher lets just say $24000 would that make it ok to pay that much for the car. Just curious about the philosophy. As I understand it from edmunds.com the dealer makes 9.1% +- on a car.MSRP $16850 Inv $15340. I know my business could not operate on a 9% gross profit, unless I had an unlimited amount of goods to sell. So by my calculations if a dealer sells all the cars that they get for MSRP, that would be 30 X 1510 or $45000, I don't think that would go very far in keeping the lights, water, insurance etc.etc. However, 'piglick" as you stated you can't even buy one if they were less than msrp, "yet", so the whole exercise is a moot point. I love my MINI and was already offered what I paid for it by a friend,...... NO IT's NOT FOR SALE.....LOL

[erazo]

There's MSRP and there's market value. I think many have too much emotional attachment to the MSRP. You can discuss BMW's strategy behind arriving at the MSRP all day (and it's been done in other threads) but you have to accept that it's artificial. Made more complicated when regulations (such as Canada's) prohibit dealers from selling above MSRP.

But market values fluctuate widely, not only over time, but also space (less so in a global economy, but different tax rates in different regions still wreak plenty of havoc on market values as residents in a high tax jurisdiction try to make their purchases elsewhere). The delta between market value and MSRP is reflected in either a discount or a premium. (BMW doesn't like to see its cars discounted, as discounts affect depreciation and BMW is proud of its low depreciation rates.)

Currently, all of us are paying a premium of one kind or another (except for a lucky few positioned in the right time and space). Fortunately, for most of us in the U.S., the premium consists only of waiting or traveling long distances. You can avoid this by paying or exceeding the market value, whereby you get your car earlier but accept a greater depreciation than those who wait.

If "no one was willing to pay over MSRP" then that would mean that market value is less than or equal to MSRP. But as we have seen, that is not the case at the present time. If it were, anyone could go to Assael or Niello and immediately custom-spec a June/July build at MSRP without unwanted dealer extras.