[Adrian_T]

This may be in the wrong section so please put it where it should be.

After 6 months and 10,000 miles in my MCS I am now officially sick of the Traction control system.

Keep it on and the slippy roads cause it to kill power on all but the slowest pull aways.
Turn it off and you need to be vigilant as have had a couple of near misses with the hedges on the country roads.

I know that GTT do a ECU flash which will give a more progressive action to partly counteract this issue but I do not want any worries with insurance and / or warranty as it gives a healthy 18bhp increase

Is there any simple fix or do I have to put up with this as a "feature" of what is without doubt my best ever purchase?

Your advice is greatly appreciated!

A

[Carlos.]

take it to a track and learn how to drive without it??

Edit: Sorry, that came across a bit harsh.......I meant, learn how to handle the power/grip properly, on a track, where you can go past "sensible", and see what happens, and learn how to correct it.

Interesting bit in the Times a few weeks back, an article saying that all the ttraction and braking aids were actually making most people poorer drivers, as they expected the car to keep itself right. (not a dig at you, Adrian , just an observation)

[Adrian_T]

Would be nice to do my 30,000 miles per year on a track but the roads I have to endure are pretty poor, covered in Horse S**t, tractor mud and ice which means that the traction control and DSC are very useful on occasion.

Any other suggestions....

[AndyH_MCS]

If you drive with it on sometimes i find it a real asset, although most of the time if i plan on doing something quickly i turn it off.

[mooneymini]

i do that too. Mostly because i forget to turn it off.
But when i do, its a nice change.
When i picked up my mini from the dealer, the sales lady said that she would just keep it off unless shes driving on snow!

[beken]

At the risk of sounding like I'm lecturing (trying not to),

My proposal would be to learn to drive with the traction control on but not having to have it activate all the time. That is, learn the feather the throttle so the you control the wheel spin so that the traction control doesn't intervene. Once you have that figured out, then you can turn it off.

My daily commute includes a lot of hills with bends in them. As well as a lot of traffic. I've practiced driving with the traction control on enough now so that I can scoot along pretty well and never have the traction control intervene. However, a few weeks ago it snowed and I didn't have snowtires on. I would say the traction control probably saved my car from sliding back down a hill and allowed me to keep moving up even though it was slow, it was a good thing I had it on. When I came to a stop, I turned off the traction control until I got moving again and then turned it back on.

It is a great safety device but only that. If the traction control is coming on all the time, you might have your foot on the gas pedal a bit hard.

[Adrian_T]

I am more than capable of not lighting up the TC light but if I wanted a slower car or wanted to dive like my grandma I would have kept my Cooper.

Turning the TC off as rightly pointed out is possibly not the answer to my question as it is more than useful on occasion. All I really am after is it not to come on in such an all or nothing manner. Other can makers seem able to do this.

The technique of turning off the TC for a quickish getaway is a good one but I would prefer not to have to do this for 2 reasons. Firstly the yellow light is annoying and secondly if I "forget" to turn it back on I wonder what the insurance company will think of a claim for "hedge-diving" having disabled a safety feature.

So back to my original question.

Is / are there any suggested fixes other than GTT's updated ECU?


Any other helpful comments would be useful

[Paul]

Apart from either modifying your ECU (which you've said you dont want to do in terms of insurance/warranty) or modifying your throttle technique, that's it really. Not sure what other answers you may be hoping for? Better tyres maybe, improved grip may reduce slip and the requirement for the traction control to kick in.

[Adrian_T]

Thanks Paul - a sensible suggestion.

Shall be swapping fronts to back this weekend and in another 5 months will need 4 new tyres. Shall then have the fun of deciding which to go for!

Have the folks at BMW been asked about this point?

Does the ECU remap help much with this?anyone with experience care to let me know?

Thanks

A

[Carlos.]

Quote: Originally Posted by Adrian_T

I am more than capable of not lighting up the TC light but if I wanted a slower car or wanted to dive like my grandma I would have kept my Cooper.

I have a Cooper, I dont drive like my Grandma (shes dead and never had a licence, anyhoo), and I'm also more than capable of driving something much more lairy than a MCS without any traction aids, thanks ............which is exactly the reason I DIDNT spec traction on the Cooper.

There are a lot of faster cars than the MCS on the market that DONT have traction, and demand a lot of respect - I offer my original advice...take it somewhere private, and learn how to control the power without the driver aids. There seems little point adding HP,
if you are struggling to control what you already have???

[Adrian_T]

Hi Carlos

My Cooper Before was no problem at all and didnt have TC.

170 bhp will break traction no matter how light you are on the gas if the road is very slippy which is often the case. I quite often drive without the TC on but the yellow light gets a bit wearing and the technique of covering it up with a bit of black paper as dicussed elsewhere seems to me a little silly.

I am fully au fait with cars needing respect without Traction control having had the dubious pleasure of a year with an Alfa 33 with 137 bhp seemingly being directed somewhere between the 3 front wheels (steering wheel included).

Looks like I shall have to think of new tyres and / or an ECU mod. If GTT can do it why can't BMW. I am sure there must be a reason but who knows.

BRING ON THE SUMMER!

[Lohen]

Not a cheap solution but i was going to suggest the following: Install a Quaife diff.

Your traction controll is activated because one or two of your wheels looses grip with the road, hence to regain it wheel speed needs to be reduced (killed engine) untill both wheels are again rotating at the same speed. A good differential will aid power transfer, thus reducing wheel spin which in turn should reduce the amount of time your traction control, kicks in. Coupled with better tyres you should see a definate improvement.

I was also wondering, why are you suggesting that turned off traction controll will see you end up in a bush? As it merely contols power...

And another thing, when you turn the engine off, the traction contols is turned back on, hence your insurance policy should never see the light turned on. And does your insurance policy have a clause suggesting that you must never turn traction controll off?

Andrey

[Adrian_T]

Thanks for that Andrey

The hedge diving experience was nearly caused by some misplaced cow S**T on a bend coupled with enthusiasm (somehat misplaced). Manically spinning wheels and mad understeer followed by lots of grip and a very rapid change of direction.

Looks like a vist to the tyre shop for me as I think I need some non Run-flats!

[roland2003]

Quite an interesting one this with some good input.
Yes traction control is designed for people that dont know what corrective action to take when faced with under/oversteer. And to be fair is probably? better than just sitting there 'rigid steering wheel & throttle' not knowing what to do .
Learn to drive without it is ideal , though learning to drive (traction on) as fast as possible without it activating is also good practice. Helps you to turn in gently, feed the power in,get the lock off as early as possible etc... A good 'Im bored so I'll play this game /excercise'
Better tyres is a good idea,;-if its gripping more then you are slidding less! So less traction intervention.
Best Regards Roland GT Tuning

[Richard Crofts]

Quote: Originally Posted by Adrian_T

Would be nice to do my 30,000 miles per year on a track but the roads I have to endure are pretty poor, covered in Horse S**t, tractor mud and ice which means that the traction control and DSC are very useful on occasion.

Any other suggestions....

you must live near me then lol

There is nothing you can do really...I didn't have DSC in my old MINI and it was OK you just had to be very aware of what the surface looked like...particularaly difficult at night...but you manage. If you have it one its a bit of a bummer in the mud as its way too OTT and come on far to early IMO...but thats life.

[TallAndy]

I like my DSC in greasy conditions and it can be a real life saver as i've found in most cases it can act quicker than you and brake wheels indepentantly to fix over and under steer which again you cant do yourself.

I've lost the back end a few times and given the car opposite lock and the DSC feathers the power, brakes and tightens up the rear very cool

[Adrian_T]

Absolutely right. The DSC does feel good when it works especially after a nice oversteery moment.

As for correct driving technique all we need to remember is that James Hunt's mode of transport was an Austin A 35 van with very skinny tyres. Allegedly this gave him more driving pleasure than many sports cars of the time.

Thanks for all your input on this - it seems like I am not the only one!

[PaulusMaximus]

Roads covered in s***, mud, and ice? You aren't from Norfolk are you!? Everytime I go home I have to clean my car, and recover from the shudders that my back takes with the bumpy roads. The roads over there aren't exactly fun!

However I agree, see if you can learn to drive your car without TC. I spent four months learning to drive it properly without it, and then subsequently spent £500 on four new tyres! Its now back on!

Paul

[SteveM3]

If I read the original post and Adrian's follow ups correctly I agree with him. I don't think
the problem is with traction control cutting in but with it cutting the power so brutally. At
least when the wheels spin without it you can back the throttle off a lot less and get
traction back. It's annoying because it is so close to being a very useful system but
just comes across as irritating instead. I still leave mine on, the plus points outweigh
the bad.

[Adrian_T]

Thank The Lord

Someone understands what I am getting at.
You are so right, the plus points do outweigh the negatives.

It seem sthat there is no further to go on this so thanks for eveyone's input but its time for closure on this thread.

No idea if I can close it so if someone can help me out I would be grateful.

T V M

A