MINI2

JerzyBondov · Jul 14th, 2008, 11:26 AM

Went back up North for the weekend just gone and got a good chance to explore the performance of my (relatively) newly tuned MCS. It's pretty quick

(not so scientific timing with my brother revealed 0-60 in 6.4sec and 30-70 in 5.3 through the gears).

However one other thing that has certainly changed since the tuning is the propensity of the car to torque steer. I can't say I'd ever really noticed it before, but now if I pull out to overtake and floor it in 3rd gear, any undue camber or truck grooves in the road really do make themselves felt. Can be quite alarming in fact...

Is this something that LSD cars cope better with? (Mine is a facelift, but pre LSD car) How do you guys with north of 240bhp deal with it? Quaifes and stuff? I'm running non-runflats on 16" wheels, so I don't think there's too much more I can do in that department...

Anybody else found this?

batou · Jul 14th, 2008, 11:35 AM

I "had" this exact problem too:

http://www.mini2.com/forum/suspensio...ml#post3402436

It has now completely gone all for £233 inc VAT

JerzyBondov · Jul 14th, 2008, 12:01 PM

Good stuff... to be honest I'm not massively surprised something like this might sort it out. I was actually thinking on the weekend that I was really noticing what felt like chassis flex - I did a trackday in the car when it had just 2k on the clock and I didn't remember it feeling quite so lurchy when changing direction then. (It's got 26k on the clock now).

How many miles had you done when you changed the bushes Batou? And which ones did you go for?

I'm tempted to get them sorted pronto if this is the case - going to the Nurburgring in a couple of weeks so would rather have a car with sorted handling for it!
The car also feels a little bit edgy when cornering reasonably hard at 70ish mph - like the weight is shifting from front to back, and it's very sensitive on the steering (i.e. small input makes it feel like the weight goes all over the place, relatively speaking). Anybody else had this?

Bhozar · Jul 14th, 2008, 12:13 PM

Suplerflex bushings have made a huge difference to my car too.

Ant FR · Jul 14th, 2008, 12:19 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by JerzyBondov (original)

Good stuff... to be honest I'm not massively surprised something like this might sort it out. I was actually thinking on the weekend that I was really noticing what felt like chassis flex - I did a trackday in the car when it had just 2k on the clock and I didn't remember it feeling quite so lurchy when changing direction then. (It's got 26k on the clock now).

How many miles had you done when you changed the bushes Batou? And which ones did you go for?

I'm tempted to get them sorted pronto if this is the case - going to the Nurburgring in a couple of weeks so would rather have a car with sorted handling for it!
The car also feels a little bit edgy when cornering reasonably hard at 70ish mph - like the weight is shifting from front to back, and it's very sensitive on the steering (i.e. small input makes it feel like the weight goes all over the place, relatively speaking). Anybody else had this?

just makesure your brakes are good for the ring, thats all i'll say

JerzyBondov · Jul 14th, 2008, 01:19 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by Ant FR (original)

just makesure your brakes are good for the ring, thats all i'll say

Reassuring advice

We all know R53s don't have the best brakes in the world - I do have Roland's spiroslots on the back though, and the OEM fronts are new at least...

batou · Jul 14th, 2008, 01:27 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by JerzyBondov (original)

How many miles had you done when you changed the bushes Batou? And which ones did you go for?

I'm tempted to get them sorted pronto if this is the case - going to the Nurburgring in a couple of weeks so would rather have a car with sorted handling for it!

Mine were both split after 30k miles. One of the most noticeable improvements I've made to my car to date

Bhozar · Jul 14th, 2008, 02:03 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by JerzyBondov (original)

Reassuring advice

We all know R53s don't have the best brakes in the world - I do have Roland's spiroslots on the back though, and the OEM fronts are new at least...

I managed to cook stock brakes quite easily, the Spirolot ones lasted a bit longer, but I could eventually cook them too. Both tested on Castle Combe, but I am quite heavy on the brakes.

batou · Jul 14th, 2008, 02:49 PM

Change your fluid to 5.1. I switched to 5.1 and fitted some Mintex 1144's and not had any brake fade yet

Bhozar · Jul 14th, 2008, 03:00 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by batou (original)

Change your fluid to 5.1. I switched to 5.1 and fitted some Mintex 1144's and not had any brake fade yet

Motul RBF 600 in mine now. Has a very high wet and dry boiling point, and its a fairly decent price for the performance you get.

batou · Jul 14th, 2008, 03:47 PM

Cool, I just used what ever 1320 use

. Tbh, I was really surprised at the difference it made considering I didn't change the brake lines. Great bang for book at around £6 lol!

JerzyBondov · Jul 14th, 2008, 03:56 PM

I thought the fluid that was standard in the MCS's was 5.1? Is this a piece of terribly wishful thinking?! I do have a spare 500mls of 5.1 - will that stretch to replace the fluid for the fronts?

MINI-Morgan · Jul 14th, 2008, 05:09 PM

stock is dot4 so far as I remember. Spare? being old? If you have any open bottles then bin them as they will have gone off. Brake fluid soaks up the moister out of the air and then becomes spongy. You need brand new 5.1 but sadly in most cases you will waste 3/4 of a bottle.

JerzyBondov · Jul 14th, 2008, 06:40 PM

One other point on the bushes - do people only tend to replace the front ones? Do the back ones not wear as quickly, and is it not worth replacing those too?

batou · Jul 14th, 2008, 06:52 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by JerzyBondov (original)

One other point on the bushes - do people only tend to replace the front ones? Do the back ones not wear as quickly, and is it not worth replacing those too?

I only did the fronts on mine, will do the backs when needed

Lucky Dave · Jul 15th, 2008, 04:27 AM

After the front were done I found the back to be a little loose!

The rear bushes work a treat!

Again there are 2 brands to choose from:

Superflex and Powerflex, the Superflex are a full metal bodied press in bush, the Powerflex are push in plugs which fill the voids in the standard mini bush.

On the front I would always fit Superflex

On the rear I would fit Powerflex as they wont require a wheel alignment and will do the same job.

batou · Jul 15th, 2008, 07:34 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by Lucky Dave (original)

After the front were done I found the back to be a little loose!

The rear bushes work a treat!

Again there are 2 brands to choose from:

Superflex and Powerflex, the Superflex are a full metal bodied press in bush, the Powerflex are push in plugs which fill the voids in the standard mini bush.

On the front I would always fit Superflex

On the rear I would fit Powerflex as they wont require a wheel alignment and will do the same job.

Interesting!! Did you notice as much difference as the fronts by changing the backs?

Lucky Dave · Jul 15th, 2008, 08:29 AM

Only when on the limits!

MINI-Morgan · Jul 15th, 2008, 01:13 PM

Has anyone tried the proflex front bushes?? I have a brand new pair of stock bushes and holders in my boot and now i am in two minds what to do. Do I fit superflex front bushes although will have to press fit them or do I fit PowerFlex inserts to my brand new bushes? Interested to know who has tried the powerflex and if they used them on brand new stock bushes?? other wise I cant see it being effective on worn/torn ones.

batou · Jul 15th, 2008, 01:17 PM

Stock ones are not up to the job, splitting after 30k is poor. I replaced with ones that can hack it!

Jul 14th, 2008, 11:26 AM	#1
JerzyBondov MINI2 Rebirth Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: London Local Time: 09:07 PM Posts: 112 Offline	Torque steer on 200bhp+ cars Went back up North for the weekend just gone and got a good chance to explore the performance of my (relatively) newly tuned MCS. It's pretty quick (not so scientific timing with my brother revealed 0-60 in 6.4sec and 30-70 in 5.3 through the gears). However one other thing that has certainly changed since the tuning is the propensity of the car to torque steer. I can't say I'd ever really noticed it before, but now if I pull out to overtake and floor it in 3rd gear, any undue camber or truck grooves in the road really do make themselves felt. Can be quite alarming in fact... Is this something that LSD cars cope better with? (Mine is a facelift, but pre LSD car) How do you guys with north of 240bhp deal with it? Quaifes and stuff? I'm running non-runflats on 16" wheels, so I don't think there's too much more I can do in that department... Anybody else found this?

Jul 14th, 2008, 11:35 AM	#2 (permalink)
batou Turbo Schmurbo... Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Maidenhead Local Time: 10:07 PM Posts: 809 Offline	I "had" this exact problem too: http://www.mini2.com/forum/suspensio...ml#post3402436 It has now completely gone all for £233 inc VAT 235+ BHP "Works" Eater

Jul 14th, 2008, 01:27 PM	#7 (permalink)
batou Turbo Schmurbo... Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Maidenhead Local Time: 10:07 PM Posts: 809 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by JerzyBondov (original) How many miles had you done when you changed the bushes Batou? And which ones did you go for? I'm tempted to get them sorted pronto if this is the case - going to the Nurburgring in a couple of weeks so would rather have a car with sorted handling for it! Mine were both split after 30k miles. One of the most noticeable improvements I've made to my car to date 235+ BHP "Works" Eater

Jul 14th, 2008, 02:49 PM	#9 (permalink)
batou Turbo Schmurbo... Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Maidenhead Local Time: 10:07 PM Posts: 809 Offline	Change your fluid to 5.1. I switched to 5.1 and fitted some Mintex 1144's and not had any brake fade yet 235+ BHP "Works" Eater

Jul 14th, 2008, 03:47 PM	#11 (permalink)
batou Turbo Schmurbo... Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Maidenhead Local Time: 10:07 PM Posts: 809 Offline	Cool, I just used what ever 1320 use . Tbh, I was really surprised at the difference it made considering I didn't change the brake lines. Great bang for book at around £6 lol! 235+ BHP "Works" Eater

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Jul 14th, 2008, 12:01 PM	#3 (permalink)
JerzyBondov MINI2 Rebirth Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: London Local Time: 09:07 PM Posts: 112 Offline	Good stuff... to be honest I'm not massively surprised something like this might sort it out. I was actually thinking on the weekend that I was really noticing what felt like chassis flex - I did a trackday in the car when it had just 2k on the clock and I didn't remember it feeling quite so lurchy when changing direction then. (It's got 26k on the clock now). How many miles had you done when you changed the bushes Batou? And which ones did you go for? I'm tempted to get them sorted pronto if this is the case - going to the Nurburgring in a couple of weeks so would rather have a car with sorted handling for it! The car also feels a little bit edgy when cornering reasonably hard at 70ish mph - like the weight is shifting from front to back, and it's very sensitive on the steering (i.e. small input makes it feel like the weight goes all over the place, relatively speaking). Anybody else had this?

Jul 14th, 2008, 12:13 PM	#4 (permalink)
Bhozar Overly excited!! My Classifieds Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Worcestershire Local Time: 09:07 PM Posts: 1,280 Offline	Suplerflex bushings have made a huge difference to my car too.

Jul 14th, 2008, 12:19 PM	#5 (permalink)
Ant FR MINI2 Master My Classifieds Join Date: Oct 2006 Local Time: 09:07 PM Posts: 1,922 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by JerzyBondov (original) Good stuff... to be honest I'm not massively surprised something like this might sort it out. I was actually thinking on the weekend that I was really noticing what felt like chassis flex - I did a trackday in the car when it had just 2k on the clock and I didn't remember it feeling quite so lurchy when changing direction then. (It's got 26k on the clock now). How many miles had you done when you changed the bushes Batou? And which ones did you go for? I'm tempted to get them sorted pronto if this is the case - going to the Nurburgring in a couple of weeks so would rather have a car with sorted handling for it! The car also feels a little bit edgy when cornering reasonably hard at 70ish mph - like the weight is shifting from front to back, and it's very sensitive on the steering (i.e. small input makes it feel like the weight goes all over the place, relatively speaking). Anybody else had this? just makesure your brakes are good for the ring, thats all i'll say

Jul 14th, 2008, 01:19 PM	#6 (permalink)
JerzyBondov MINI2 Rebirth Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: London Local Time: 09:07 PM Posts: 112 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by Ant FR (original) just makesure your brakes are good for the ring, thats all i'll say Reassuring advice We all know R53s don't have the best brakes in the world - I do have Roland's spiroslots on the back though, and the OEM fronts are new at least...

Jul 14th, 2008, 02:03 PM	#8 (permalink)
Bhozar Overly excited!! My Classifieds Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Worcestershire Local Time: 09:07 PM Posts: 1,280 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by JerzyBondov (original) Reassuring advice We all know R53s don't have the best brakes in the world - I do have Roland's spiroslots on the back though, and the OEM fronts are new at least... I managed to cook stock brakes quite easily, the Spirolot ones lasted a bit longer, but I could eventually cook them too. Both tested on Castle Combe, but I am quite heavy on the brakes.

Jul 14th, 2008, 03:00 PM	#10 (permalink)
Bhozar Overly excited!! My Classifieds Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Worcestershire Local Time: 09:07 PM Posts: 1,280 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by batou (original) Change your fluid to 5.1. I switched to 5.1 and fitted some Mintex 1144's and not had any brake fade yet Motul RBF 600 in mine now. Has a very high wet and dry boiling point, and its a fairly decent price for the performance you get.

Jul 14th, 2008, 03:56 PM	#12 (permalink)
JerzyBondov MINI2 Rebirth Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: London Local Time: 09:07 PM Posts: 112 Offline	I thought the fluid that was standard in the MCS's was 5.1? Is this a piece of terribly wishful thinking?! I do have a spare 500mls of 5.1 - will that stretch to replace the fluid for the fronts?

Jul 14th, 2008, 05:09 PM	#13 (permalink)
MINI-Morgan MINI Obsessed... My Classifieds Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Southampton, Hants Local Time: 09:07 PM Posts: 4,679 Offline	stock is dot4 so far as I remember. Spare? being old? If you have any open bottles then bin them as they will have gone off. Brake fluid soaks up the moister out of the air and then becomes spongy. You need brand new 5.1 but sadly in most cases you will waste 3/4 of a bottle. One Man, One Project......find out what happens next at MINIProject.co.uk For MINIs in the south it can only be South Coast New MINI Club

Jul 14th, 2008, 06:40 PM	#14 (permalink)
JerzyBondov MINI2 Rebirth Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: London Local Time: 09:07 PM Posts: 112 Offline	One other point on the bushes - do people only tend to replace the front ones? Do the back ones not wear as quickly, and is it not worth replacing those too?

Jul 14th, 2008, 06:52 PM	#15 (permalink)
batou Turbo Schmurbo... Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Maidenhead Local Time: 10:07 PM Posts: 809 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by JerzyBondov (original) One other point on the bushes - do people only tend to replace the front ones? Do the back ones not wear as quickly, and is it not worth replacing those too? I only did the fronts on mine, will do the backs when needed 235+ BHP "Works" Eater

Jul 15th, 2008, 04:27 AM	#16 (permalink)
Lucky Dave Thinking Minis My Classifieds Join Date: Jun 2005 Local Time: 09:07 PM Posts: 811 Offline	After the front were done I found the back to be a little loose! The rear bushes work a treat! Again there are 2 brands to choose from: Superflex and Powerflex, the Superflex are a full metal bodied press in bush, the Powerflex are push in plugs which fill the voids in the standard mini bush. On the front I would always fit Superflex On the rear I would fit Powerflex as they wont require a wheel alignment and will do the same job. For All Your Mini's Needs 01905 620011

Jul 15th, 2008, 07:34 AM	#17 (permalink)
batou Turbo Schmurbo... Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Maidenhead Local Time: 10:07 PM Posts: 809 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by Lucky Dave (original) After the front were done I found the back to be a little loose! The rear bushes work a treat! Again there are 2 brands to choose from: Superflex and Powerflex, the Superflex are a full metal bodied press in bush, the Powerflex are push in plugs which fill the voids in the standard mini bush. On the front I would always fit Superflex On the rear I would fit Powerflex as they wont require a wheel alignment and will do the same job. Interesting!! Did you notice as much difference as the fronts by changing the backs? 235+ BHP "Works" Eater

Jul 15th, 2008, 08:29 AM	#18 (permalink)
Lucky Dave Thinking Minis My Classifieds Join Date: Jun 2005 Local Time: 09:07 PM Posts: 811 Offline	Only when on the limits! For All Your Mini's Needs 01905 620011

Jul 15th, 2008, 01:13 PM	#19 (permalink)
MINI-Morgan MINI Obsessed... My Classifieds Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Southampton, Hants Local Time: 09:07 PM Posts: 4,679 Offline	Has anyone tried the proflex front bushes?? I have a brand new pair of stock bushes and holders in my boot and now i am in two minds what to do. Do I fit superflex front bushes although will have to press fit them or do I fit PowerFlex inserts to my brand new bushes? Interested to know who has tried the powerflex and if they used them on brand new stock bushes?? other wise I cant see it being effective on worn/torn ones. One Man, One Project......find out what happens next at MINIProject.co.uk For MINIs in the south it can only be South Coast New MINI Club

Jul 15th, 2008, 01:17 PM	#20 (permalink)
batou Turbo Schmurbo... Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Maidenhead Local Time: 10:07 PM Posts: 809 Offline	Stock ones are not up to the job, splitting after 30k is poor. I replaced with ones that can hack it! 235+ BHP "Works" Eater

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