[Silver "S"]

Well my fellow Mini friends I have crossed the land of Modifications!!! I have done the job some of us deemed UNWARRENTED I have teamed up with Mini-Madness and EvoTech, and jumped ship and to prove it, I HAVE the Dyno sheets for those of you whom are very skeptical!!
Test results were outstanding and the owner of RennTech Mr. Harmut Feyhl himself(yes, the guy who actually helped produce the AMG Hammer) was very impressed with it. Here are the results:

Dyno Run.001:
93.9 Farenheit/29.92-0.79 in.Hg 0 ft. CF=1.02 Rpm/Mph=63
Max Power= 153.6/Max torque= 137.7
This is using Mini-Madness "S" Intake

Bear in mind I left the Stock Air Box at home Duh!!

Dyno Run.007: After 6 hrs waiting for download to arrive THANKS to Bellsouth DSL

96.3 Farenheit/30.12-0.65 in.Hg 0 ft. CF=1.01 Rpm/Mph=78
Max Power= 163.6/Max torque= 141.7

With modified Software. Remember,I do not have a modified EXHAUST only STOCK. Call George @ Mini-Madness.

PlEASE do NOT contact RENNTECH, the only distributor for this is MINI-MADNESS!!!!! www.mini-madness.com
Phone number is 1-866-410-5809

[minimini36]

I agree with Mr. Harmut Feyhl that this is a good increase considering the chip can only change the fuel and timing maps. I want to know what the other 5 dyno runs showed. Could you post the actual dyno charts? If the 7th run had been done in fourth gear like the first run there might have been a bigger gain. Also since modern OBD2 ECUs can update the fuel maps as they learn the correct mapping to yield the 14.7 to 1 mixture will the performance change with time? The optimum ratio for performance is normally between 12.5 or 13 to 1. Will only the timing changes remain? My math also indicates only a 10 Hp gain. This does not seem to agree with and I quote from MINI-Maddness

"Cooper S - MINI
Weight: 100.0 lbs
List Price: $749.00

EVOTECH ECU upgrade for the Cooper S. Evotech's primary business is ECU tuning in Germany. Evotech has developed a 22.9hp increase for the Cooper S. Simply remove your ECU, pack up and send to Evotech USA and within 2-3 days you'll recieve your ECU back fully tuned. We are the official Evotech "MINI" representatives in the USA."

This indicates a 22.9 Hp increase with only an ECU upgrade. The dyno chart for their air intake indicates a stock MCS has 150.6 HP. This is consistent with other peoples results on the dyno. This results at best in an increase of 13 Hp with the ECU and air intake upgrade at a cost of about $1000. I am amazed they are charging $749 just to down load new software into the ECU. Jet Performance chips has an upgrade to the ECU for a Chevy truck that is actually a module that plugs between the ECU and the engine. This module contains a 20 Mhz RISC CPU and some other hardware. This unit only sells for $319. They still seem to make a profit even when they have to supply hardware that probably costs them $50 to $100. Actually 10 Hp is probably a good increase for a small displacement, OBD2 controlled engine running on premium fuel. Many ECU mods are on engines running on regular gas that will need premium fuel to get the results. Also many require a change to a cooler temperature thermostat to allow more timing advance.

[Silver "S"]

The other 6 runs were not given to me due to me WAITING 6 hrs for Bellsouth download and granted I had a 5 hr drive back home. I might of overlooked this but, as I stated before call George @ Mini-Madness and he can call the shop for figures. All I can say is that I have gotten an increase on mileage of approx 4 mpg(hwy) and I still cannot believe it. The COLD start issue has also GONE and, I still cant believe it. Yes I have spent money as you state but, if I wait for DINAN, JCW etc etc I'll be paying double the money. The car runs smooth But, it surges due the exhaust constraint(remember, I wrote that I have the stock exhaust). Like I stated before call George It is 10 hp gain BUT,on the wheels. If you do your math we are looking at approx 15 to 20 on the flywheel. I am more than HAPPY Any other person would be . I'll tell you something my Mini is faster than MOST Mini's out there And, yes you do mention JET Performance(Chevy's are we not here for the Mini) and I know they are reliable but, I have not yet seen anyone mention them but yourself. We are talking bussiness here, true you mention companies making ECU's for mere money but, also realize that others have to make money. That's a fact of life. I realize you have some engineering degree or something , hey I'm just an average guy who will do the best for himself and I have

[Sausagefingers]

so Silver, what does this do to your warranty? Where are you seeing most of the improvement? Is there a geater amount of low end tourque? How is this going to impact the long term ware and tear of your cars engine? Have you done any 0-60 times yet?

I have to agree with mini36. It seems like an unreasonable price to remap an ECU. At the very least they should be sending you a new chip or something incase you need to replace the old one for warranty purposes. I understand that a company needs to make money, but there is also a fine line between making money and ripping off the consumer. JCW has the latter down pretty well right now. I find it ironic that its namesake was trying to develop a car that was economical.

[Mugami]

For me id like to see a graph if possible between the two runs. The part on your dyno runs thats giving me trouble is the RPM/MPH if its meaning rpm then the first run was to only 6300 rpms while the second was taken to 7800 rpms. even if it was MPH still allowing a car to run out an extra 15mph or 1500 rpms can give greatly different readings with no change to the car what so ever. Not saying the car didnt get peak power by the 63 in both cases but I would need to see something a bit more clearer. this is just my 2cw btw

[Silver "S"]

My friends, like I stated before. I am just a HAPPY guy the first run if not mistaken was on 4 gear and the last run on 3rd gear if I recall. The warranty would be VOIDED but according to George in MINI-MADNESS he has gone various times to BMW and they cannot find any wrong doing. AND please call George HE HAS THE READINGS!!. Good point my friends but you fail to realize I had been awake from 3am that morning drove 5 hrs on the due and accident that held me 2 hrs behind , later i had to wait for a download approx. 6 hrs then I had to drive back,so, maybe I overlooked this but then again call George I think he's going to put it up soon!!! Power was across the band the way I feel it. The torque is there and you can feel it. Long term effects I have no idea, will my car or your car last a lifetime we do not know. Life is a risk and some of us are willing to take them. I am more than haappy to answer any questions!!

[minimini36]

Mugami

You have miss interpreted the meaning of rpm/MPH. This is the number of revolutions per minute for each 1 MPH of speed at the wheels. The value of rpm/mph = 63 tells me at 6300 rpm the car will be going 100 MPH or at 6750 rpm it will be 107 mph. For a MCS this is fourth gear. An rpm/mph = 78 gives about 87 MPH at 6750 rpms which is third gear. This is really telling you the gear ratio and not the MPH or rpm the engine was run to during the test. Usually all runs are done in the same gear for a better comparison. If the last run had been in fourth gear the results would have been a little higher since less Hp is required to accelerate the wheels and tires because the speed is increasing at a slower rate.

[Mugami]

Thanks for clearing that up for me. Yes i didnt know exactly what was meant by it. Most of the dyno(ok all) the ones I use the RPM was motor RPM and not wheel rpm. So i didnt understand that value.

[Silver "S"]

Great insight my friends I was not aware of this. I am confirming that I am getting better gas mileage before I used to get 150 miles per half tank, now I have 150 miles and I have at least a gallon left to half tank WOW , also It has been cool here in the morning and the COLD start problem has gone away I'll keep u guys poested ok

[Silver "S"]

Sorry OBEHAVE I wish you could be here, then you would put aside your spouses thoughts jajajaja

[suprchrgdmini]

Does anyone know of any other chips that are out or close to being released. i cant see spending that much money on it.

[Silver "S"]

My fellow superchdmini, to get more you have to compromise, and to compromise you have to pay!!! I have compromised and my car is running great!!! When I put myself on the list over a year ago I had to come to some conclusions and that is I was going to do 3 things to my MINI Under $1500 and they are as follows:

1) Intake: DONE that!! $239
2) Ecu Upgrade: Done THAT!!! $700
3) Exhaust Mod: Not YET!!

4) Smile on my FACE : PRICELESS!!!!!

Or worst yet if you wait for DINAN whom I heard strongly is coming out with ECU etc etc upgrade you will pay over $2000
and if you so desire JCW then you might as well go get another LOAN!! The estimates being made East of the Pond(England) are qouting at minimum $3000 for this upgrade GRANTED you will have some sort of warranty but at expense of YOUR pocket!! Good Luck in your endevours searching for the right solution and your car. Meanwhile, I'm smiling all the way to the bank

[Sausagefingers]

Listen Silver, if anything we should be applauding your move to upgrade. We are not questioning your judgement in paying for the upgrade, the fact of the matter is your a very pleased with the investment and I could not be happier for you. I think what we are questioning here is simply what you get for the money. It seems like a lot for them to reprogram a chip. The fact that you feel like it was worth it however is awesome and definately makes me think more seriously about it.

[chris@helix]

We are getting the first version of the GIAC chip for the MCS later this week for dyno and road testing. We are not sure of the final price of this item but I can tell you that it is no where near some of the #s that were quoted above. As many of you know , GIAC chips are second to none the quality and performance. As we have done in the past with other products, we will post the results here when we are done.


All the best


Chris Kellett
helix MINIsports
helix13.com

[suprchrgdmini]

chris@helix,
please post the performance gains you get from the chip upgrade.

[Casey]

Quote:

Originally posted by chris@helix
We are getting the first version of the GIAC chip for the MCS later this week for dyno and road testing. We are not sure of the final price of this item but I can tell you that it is no where near some of the #s that were quoted above. As many of you know , GIAC chips are second to none the quality and performance. As we have done in the past with other products, we will post the results here when we are done.


All the best


Chris Kellett
helix MINIsports
helix13.com

I'm curious on your site why it says the GIAC chip is the first US legal chip. Evotech is selling one here and I'm guessing it is not illegal.

[benggolf]

Can someone tell me what happens when you get an aftermarket ECU chip upgrade, then for some reason or another BMW service installs a new "upgrade" (such as the case of resolving cold start problem).

Do you lose the performance upgrade that was previously installed? TIA!

[CurtP]

Quote:

Originally posted by Silver "S"
It is 10 hp gain BUT,on the wheels. If you do your math we are looking at approx 15 to 20 on the flywheel.

Exactly how are you doing your math? That's a 25-50% driveline loss. So that would mean that the S should only have 81.5hp at the wheel in stock form? Personally, if I had spent that much money for a tune, I'd expect alot better returns for my investment. I think I'll wait this one out until the price drops (and if it doesn't drop, I'll just forgo it altogether).

I spent less than $200 on the cable and software to program my F-body.

[Silver "S"]

Casey my ECU mod is from EVOSport/Tech I get them confused,but, by installed by RennTEch.
Curt P the Mini has a loss of 15% in the drive train maybe my math is wrong but the increase is noticeable trust me on this The output on the wheels is 163.7 hp. The DYNO runs will be posted soon by MINI-MADNESS.COM or better yet guys WHY dont you call them, I dont have a scanner George at madness got the copies from RENNTECH.
Mr Kellet I wish you the best in getting the ECU for the rest of the guys here in USA. Try also to resolve the cold start issue that I have already resolved with the ECU upgrade and that BMW cannot resolve
By the way I am getting 27.6 mpg in the city here in Florida and with a/c on and off!!! The car still surges and I really believe its the STOCK exhaust I have. Will keep you all posted and PLEASE DO NOT INQUIRE about the DYNO SHEETS call Mini-Madness ok . I am doing this to info you guys about what I did to my car NO ONE ELSE can try to judge my actions. I will respopnd to you all accordingly but please do not question my integrity

[minimini36]

Here is a link to the California Air Resources Board database of emission related devices that have received approval as of October 9, 2002. I don't see a listing for EVOTECH or anything listed for a MINI under the PROM/ECU category. Individual states are allowed to use either the EPA standards or the stricter California standards. I believe there are already 3 or 4 eastern states using the California requirements. I was unable to find a similar listing on the EPA site.

http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermk...es/devices.htm