[911ETR]

I have seen the numbers that say that BMP produces more power.

Anyone had both or do I have to do it

[jlm]

almost. first I had the BMP, but then got rid of it and got the Rogue. I had driven the car with the BMP and it worked fine, as others have stated, but I had not taken it to the track or the dyno.

I preferred the Rogue even though it was reported to have 9.7, not 12.9 hp gains. by the way, if you correct the 9.7 for 15% drivetrain loss, you get around 11 hp...do we know if any of those claims are wheel or flyweel hp?

I was convinced the rogue was better designed from the point of view of capturing only (almost only) cold air. It does have a more limited supply, however. They both use very similar K&N style cone filter, the rogue being slightly larger, the rogue uses stainless steel for the shiled, BMP uses aluminum.

Went to the dragstrip with the rogue and drove the car with and without the metal shield in place. Without, it can draw air from everywhere. two runs with, two without, two different drivers each running with and without. no performance difference, consistent times. This was a suprise, since one of the other drivers was convinced the BMP would pull away.

then I had my car on the Mustang dyno at Helix, we also tried to measure a difference with and without the shield but no significant difference. That is the time we discovered the duct tape mod, which did produce a repeatable 4 hp, the circumstance being that the shield was back in place and with the tape we were getting not only more air (which didn't seem to be the problem, given the non-shield results) but the air was cold. ambient was around 60 degrees; under-the hood air gets heat dumped from the intercooler and engine components and while we didn't measure its temp, you could feel at least a 20 degree increase on the metal of the shield .

My thinking is that in the hot weather, there will be a benefit in not using under the hood air at all and the Rogue will have a better shot at getting all cold air in and is more amenable to air supply mods for getting even more cold airs supplied to it.

if you are going to Davbret's dyno run in Portland, try out the Rogue with and without the shield so we have more data.

My next step is to work on getting more cold air supplied to the rogue box and perhaps mod the box even more to keep it cool.

[Silver "S"]

I keep on hearing this DUCK tape mod can you guys give an ILUSTRATION of this idea. I am lost I also have the Mini-Madness/Rogue intake and would love to do it. I am scheduled for a DYNO run in december with RENNTECH in Florida and would like to give an insight of this. If you guys look at the "S" ECU upgrade in Mini-Madness the first schematics is from my car @ RENNTECH. Have a nice Holidays!!!

[Silver "S"]

gracias my friend!! Duh of me

[911ETR]

Well I am dead tired after driving 500 miles too Portland from Seattle and back. We did a bizillion Dyno tests. Thanks big time to Davbret for loaning us his S. We broke an exhaust bolt so I owe him!! I will only post the results as they apply to this topic. I have not downloaded the video and pics plus the dyno sheets. BUT.....................

Here are the results. I am happy and sad to announce that the BMP's dyno results DO NOT hold water. This was our second run with the stock cooper S. The first being a base line run. The BMP design showed a gain of 2hp at the wheels. Pretty sad news. We did a few runs then went directly to the Rogue. It posted as claimed between 7 and 9.5 or so. I will post the exact results as soon as I awake from acoma.

Check the exaust forums for more...

[Grinder]

Cant wait to hear alllll about it.

[911ETR]

Before I go to bed I thought I would also tell you a bit about the two filters. I noticed that the BMP filter was quite a bit smaller in size. I was not really impressed with the battery clip on sort of looked cheezy to me. We had two fans blowing in the front of the car for effect of driving and then I was blowing cold compressed air over the intercooler.

I was just about to push the order button on the BMP until this morning. I am a bit bummed.

[gowest]

Exhaust Forum? Am I missing something, I don't think I've ever seen it. Where is it?

I am sad to hear, as well, that the BMP is so far off their claimed hp. Maybe the dyno charts , when posted, will put it in a little better light than just +2hp. Maybe that's just a peak gain and more was gained in off peak areas. That would help to explain the improvement others are feeling.

I hope 911ETR got a chance to do the "remove the plug" mod as well since this opens up to more cold air flow as I understand it.

[911ETR]

Hehhe I meant the Magnaflow thread. Once I get all the data I will create a Quicksilver one too.

It may be a day or so, I need to call george and sort out the dyno charts.

remove the plug, meaning the tape mods.

We thought about this but then thought how would you really replicate the wind blowing on the front of the entire car.

Fans only do so much and its just not the same as putting your hand out the window at 50mph.

I dont doubt that this works but I think testing it may be another story.

I guess the bottom line is its free.. why not. It it does cool. If not no big.

[Grinder]

No, by remove the plug i think he meant that on the rogue intake, a lot of people think that airflow can be improved significantly by simply removing a tiny rubber..."plug", i guess. There was a great deal of discussion about it a few weeks ago. But I guess you didn't remove the plug then.....

[911ETR]

Sorry no I didnt catch that. We were testing with plugs installed.

I think I need a dyno is my back yard!

[Grinder]

http://mini2.com/forum/showthread.ph...=#post172 534

[Davbret]

Yes, I didn't have to drive back to Redmond WA, and I'm tired too! We did alot of parts swaping. Dang that stock exhaust is SOOOOOO heavy! :lol:

I was more than shocked to see that the BMP intake just didn't produce power like the Rogue did. And much to my astonishment George of MINI-Madness traded me his Rogue for my BMP!!! That is PURE class. He wanted me to have the intake that produced the most hp. I'm still in shock over that.

We ran two baselines on my car if I remember correctly. The first at 143, the second at 147 (again, from memory as the dyno sheets were still printing after I left, George is going to email them to me). I'm very happy with that. We were measuring about 11.5 pounds of boost, too.

Can't wait to show you all the dyno results. But really, the Rogue makes more horses. I wouldn't have traded my BMP for the Rogue if it wasn't better.

Stay tuned.

R

[coops41]

JUST A THOUGHT!

I notice that the dyno runs that davebret did are with the bonnet open. The bmp has a sheild over most of the filter so when the bonnet is open there is infact a restriction compared to the rouge which is completly open. Btw i have nothing to be gained either way as i have a pipercross cai.
When tested the pipercross gave about 6hp at the wheels WITH THE BONNET OPEN ! I think the increases would be less with bonnet closed as the inlet is much more restricted.

It seems to prove the mcs is resticted for air and maybe the bmp works slightly better with the bonnet closed as it has another air source.

On a different note I have asked this question before but does anyone think there would be a benifit by opening the hole at the back of the box up signifitly to supply more air to the rouge/pipercross cai? Or would the air be sucked past the filter buy creating a vacum when moving? Im no engineer would like some thoughts? anyone?

[coops41]

FORGOT TO ASK

jlw if you are reading this were your runs done with the bonnet open or closed?

[jlm]

if you meant jlm: yes we had the hood closed and made a point to latch it as well. We did check the rogue with and without its metal shield in place, as noted in my previous post; no hp difference.

[911ETR]

We did have the hood open because of all the sensors installed didnt have enough slack as shown in the pics. What you dont see in the pics are the two fans. We had one HUGE fan blowing into the intake tube and overall engine.

The other small on was on the radiator. Hood Open or closed you would get the same amount of air flow into the tube so BMP is not going to gain but I can see your point about air blowing directly on to the Rogue and letting it get more air.

I wonder if BMP SHOT compressed air into the intake vent to get the HP numbers up?


Next runs we will close the top. Its so hard to simulate real driving conditions I think the Gtech may be more accurate than we think.

I am going to get one.

[911ETR]

Guys,

Hold the phone. We have a problem. You see I am worried that since we went from dyno run to dyno run without actually driving the car, the ECU never had a chance to accept the part we were testing.

I dont want to release the results until I do a few more runs and verify this.

This may be the reason BMP filter was so low in numbers.

We tested the Stock, then BMP, Mini-Madness (rogue), then exahusts with and without aftermarket and stock intakes.

Back to the dyno.....

[Casey]

You could try disconnecting the chip between runs and then let the car idle a bit before re dyno'ing. I thought I heard that unpluggin the chip will force the system to calibrate quicker then just running the car.

[911ETR]

Thanks I was thinking the same.. I will give it a go.