[thepilo]

Take a look, and tell me what you think.

http://web.njit.edu/~dpc8620/Mini/

Thanks,
Dan

[LuckyRVA]

I would much rather pay $170 and get a BMP Design intake than pay $135 and get an intake made by some random guy on the internet IMHO. You get what you pay for.

Just my $.02.

P.S. It does look good though.

[thepilo]

It's not going to be sold my some random Guy on the internet, It is going to be profesionally Fabricated, and sold through a reputable Mini Performance Site. I can not say anything about who yet, but I just wanted to give people information on an upcoming product with out adrevtising the companies involved.

Thanks for you opinion though.

[Tom F.]

Good work- keep going at it!

I did not repsond to the poll, because I'd like to see a fourth option:

Post the plans and instructions here for free as a Do It Yourself file, and then offer the kit piecemeal, so people could start out with the plans, decided what is above their skill level, and buy the rest as necessary.

Of course, dyno test results will be the key to the whole idea.

[thepilo]

Forgot to mention, that there will be Dyno test's to compare to the other intakes on the market by the company, so that you can choose which one is right for you.

[ram_one]

Great job. I hope everything works out. Your basic premise is correct. Creating the box is not rocket science and your constructed piece looks very good indeed.
It's all about performance. If yours works as well as or better then the others, you've got a winner on your hands.

[Romhog]

Sorry if I missed this, but are you going to be selling a filter with it? And if so what brand are you going to use?

[MiniG]

I would rather purchase a metal box for less money, providing it fits and there is a good filter inside. I don't think the ones made by the tuners are any better, just a few steps ahead of you (with regards to slick production and packaging.)
I would guess that, once yours is out on the market, theirs will drop in price. Either way we benefit from your work - Thank you!
BCNU - G

[podger]

Not wanting to pour water on your admirable efforts with this product, but all it appears to do is replicate the Pipercross filter, and shield already in the market, and certainly available in the Mulitiple aftermarket stores here in the UKand I don't believe a low volume producer can really affect the price etc ..........

[Romhog]

thats a little rough, they all look the same. There isn't really any different way to make a heat shield. 3 bends and your done. And thats the main point to why its dumb they cost soooo much. Im not driving a BMW

[macncheese]

I have this engineering/manufacturing background that always has me thinking "can i do it cheaper/better?" and I look at these products and usually I find something I think i can improve upon, or some easier way to make it.

The problem comes when you have to lay the money out for production. I've already been through this exact exercise and I could provide a very similar kit to this for a very similar price but I'll do the breakdown for you of the most basic version.

Stainless Heat Shield (shear/punch/bend) ~ $20.00
24" Sponge Rubber Gasket (McMaster PN:12335A42) ~ $1.59 per foot
3" OD - 2.5"OD exhaust reducer (Pep Boys) ~ $1.29
High Quality 3" Flanged Cone Filter (K&N: RE-0910) ~ $39.46
Miscellaneous Parts (Sticker/hardware/box) ~ 5.00

Material Grand Total: ~ $68.93 + tax + shipping costs

Now lets say I invested 20 hours R&D into this product and I value my time at a reasonable $25 an hour. Lets say I conservatively waste $100 worth of materials bending the heat shield, etc. Enough to bend my prototype, plus some scrap/mistakes.

R&D Total: $600

Now you want Dyno proof that my $100 intake is better than yours? Even if someone gave me the three leading intakes, you'll still need 2 hours dyno time. Our good buddies at Helix charge $75 an hour, plus 2 hours of my time for being in scenic Philadelphia.

DYNO: $200


When I sell my 26th intake kit, I will have broken even. My 27th intake will be a $38.89 return on my $2661 investment (~1%). My 50th intake puts $753 in my pocket (~17%). Now thats more like it, I could probably reduce the costs some too in such a high quantity. My investment at this point is $4,250. My girlfriend would kill me if I dipped into the "house fund" to make intakes.

There is some money to made, but it certainly isnt free money. Add in development costs for a website and you might as well forget about the whole thing. I hope I shed some light on to some things for you and everyone else. You need money to make money. I'm not trying to talk you out of this, just a bit of a reality check as to whether or not its feasible/worth it to sell a dirt cheap intake and a bit of an explanation where costs are and why tuners charge what the do. If you're in this just for the experience, its a lot of fun to see what you can make to make your car perform better and its great to want to share it with others. Good luck with it!

--
Dave

[Romhog]

why is everyone being so blaaa with this guy and his efforts. This is America and stuff, where the free rain and he who wants to market thy products, can do so in peace.
I say, hey, market it, sell it, make it cheaper. Who cares about the numbers. Im a customer. All I care about is the final price. Keep up the good work thepilo!

[thepilo]

since there seems to be some debate regarding this. Let me clear some things up. First, Yes, there will be a filter included. The brand will be a ** Filter. It will be 4 " diamater, 7" in length and 10 degree bend down towards the cold air, away from the hood.
The Shield will be a stainless steel part fabricated by a company that is already making parts for the mini and have very high quality too.
This will not be a small quantity job, but when I get things going, it will definatly force the other companies to reduce there cost. And will either meet or beet the performance figures given already.

R&D on the intake is somewhere around 200 dollars, and I have an indapendent source to dyno it, as he has dyno'd all the other perfomance parts as well. so will only tell the truth, he sells all the parts and has nothing to gain by selling mine. or endorsing mine.

I am an engineering student right now, and decided that to use my skills to help the mini aftermarket because I don't think that there was enough competition out there, and I feel that people are getting rippied off at 210-240 for the intake.

As an update, the first production prototype will be produced tomorrow, and will be sent for dyno testing next week, after I test for fit and feel.

I hope that this answers all questions, and will help you understand who I am, and why I am doing this.

I am also working on a complete intake package that will include the hoses to and from the intake box as well.

All this is just the beginning to my motorsports products.

Thanks for your interest. and I hope to make every one happy with this product!

[Humourl3ss]

Quote:

Originally posted by Romhog
why is everyone being so blaaa with this guy and his efforts. This is America and stuff, where the free rain and he who wants to market thy products, can do so in peace.
I say, hey, market it, sell it, make it cheaper. Who cares about the numbers. Im a customer. All I care about is the final price. Keep up the good work thepilo!

No one is saying he can't do it. What precisely it has to do with "America and stuff" isn't in my scope of comprehension, but I'll leave that point alone.

What most responses seem to be concerned (and I'll add my voice to the chorus) about is the modest chances for success. There are already a number of intakes on the market (with presumably more still in development) that have the benefit of larger R&D, advertising, and warranty budgets, with correspondingly larger distribution channels. Unless someone brings a demonstrably superior product to market with a much lower price, it's a tough slog to make a go of it.

thepilo is more that welcome to try his hand at designing a new intake, and I wish him well. But it's an uphill battle, even with "professional fabrication" (which is not always synonymous with "fabrication of both high quality and value". I know this because I work for just such a company. )

-CW

[Romhog]

Proof positive attitude? Has anyone ever heard of that? Words like failure, and already been done, don't get far with me. The thing isn't even built yet.
The only remarks about failure should be after you purchased the product and THEN have something to say about how you dislike it, or its a "failure" or otherwise. I am in no way working or backing thepilo or endorsing his product. But I am endorsing positive attitude. We do own inspiring vehicles... don't we? Lets just talk the intake.

[macncheese]

The intentions of my post were not to put down Dan or his intake. I've actually spoken to Dan regarding his intake via email as I've mocked up a similar setup on my car and offered him advice on bending sheetmetal, being I work in the sheetmetal industry.

I'm sure Dan's intake will work just fine as its for the most part a copy of what already exists (Rogue and Pipercross).

My post was addressing the issue of "Why do the other companies charge so much?" and MY take on why I can't make the simplest intake possible and charge $100 for it.

I apologize if I've posted business advice in the performance advice forum. Best of luck to everyone starting up their own business. Its not an easy task!


--
Dave

[Humourl3ss]

Quote:

Originally posted by Romhog
Proof positive attitude? Has anyone ever heard of that? Words like failure, and already been done, don't get far with me. The thing isn't even built yet.
The only remarks about failure should be after you purchased the product and THEN have something to say about how you dislike it, or its a "failure" or otherwise. I am in no way working or backing thepilo or endorsing his product. But I am endorsing positive attitude. We do own inspiring vehicles... don't we? Lets just talk the intake.

Funny enough, you used the word "failure" three times in your post, yet I didn't once mention it. Please don't put words in my mouth.

I did, however, say the following things:
"No one is saying he can't do it."
"I wish him well"
"thepilo is more that welcome to try his hand at designing a new intake"


So much for me being a nattering nabob of negativity. I'm merely pointing out what the facts bear out: most businesses face a difficult set of tasks. I've been involved with modest one-product start-ups. It's painful to see them fail to flourish. But not recognizing the possibility is foolhardy.

Once again, I wish him lots of success.

-CW

[thepilo]

Thanks all for the comments about whether to do this, or what I should charge and stuff, but let's keep this focused on the intake. like what features would you like.. what would you like changed over the others, and what products would you like to see as well

Thanks,
Dan

[thepilo]

Quote:

Originally posted by obehave
Make an intake kit that's sealed off from the engine and takes it air in from the plenum for the air intake.

That is the purpose of the shield, not sure what you mean by the plenum part though..

[thepilo]

That does make more sence.. That is something that I have planned to create, would market it as more of a race intake, with a snorkel replacement for that cover and force the cold air in. There are some enclosed cold air filters and would need some modification to the firewall box thing, but could be done I believe. and would remove all the stock intake stuff. this will be down the road after I get the first intake going, and do not need to develope this any more.

Thanks!