[valkyre13]

Hello everyone!I am a very happy owner of a Mini Cooper S and since i am interested in tunning i would like to know wether the Hartge conversion is faster than the Works conversion.Please note that i already know the figures each company states,what i really want to know is what happens in "real life" i.e. has anyone with the Hartge conversion raced a Works in the quarter mile?What was the result?Also is the Hartge/Works Mini Cooper S faster than the Honda Civic Type R (200bhp) in the quarter mile?(again "real" results).Thank you very much and i am terribly sorry if my questions are already answered in this huge and great forum!

[MINIAC]

Welcome to MINI2

EVO Magazine did test of the tuning kits by JCW and Hartge plus AmD, BBR, Digitec, GGR and Schnitzer.

You can find a link to a [PDF format] copy of the article in the following thread:

The BIG mini test - EVO, Nov 2003

[JCW beat Hartge, but BBR was fastest]

[valkyre13]

Thank you very much MINIAC!!I already have the EVO magazine with the Big Mini Test and also many other magazines that put the Hartge vs the Works and the results are Hartge faster.Since the numbers are way different in each magazine i choose not to believe them.Hartge's performance in EVO was very very bad in comparison with other reviews and although i truly believe EVO is propably the best magazine out there i find it difficult that EVO's 0-100 mph is 1 -1.5 secs slower than every other magazine(maybe that particular Mini wasn't in very good condition i dunno).Also Top Gear tested Hartge ,Works and BBR (275) and after BBR (ofcourse) second came the Hartge which they stated was faster than the Works.As you can see after all these reviews and tests i am quite confused,so i would like to know wether anyone of you has actually seen or put the Hartge vs Works in everyday streets and was the outcome.I don't really care about numbers i want to know which is actually faster in the 1/4 mile.Thanks again for the reply and welcoming!

[MINIAC]

Dynos have shown variances in horsepower and torque ratings on different stock MCS engines, so results depend on how "strong" each engine is to begin with.

The only "true" test would be using each tuning kit on the same car with the same driver under the same conditions.

[LMB]

Well I've driven a Hartge and my Works definitely felt faster.

[Paul]

And I've driven the Works and the BBR is definately faster....(But faster isn't always the full story, but that's another conversation).

[DinkaDonka]

Put it this way , iv got the Hartge and it dosent do 0-100 mph in 16.2 seconds , sounds good on paper but it just dosent deliver , the car feels quick but in the real world it hardly and faster than a stock cooper s , i called Hartge after we did some testing with a stock car , from approx 40mph to 130 my car was one cars length ahead (yes yes on a runway , bla bla bla) , they said it was due to the amout of option my car has , what! Anyway £1800 wasted imo , i know im probably the only person to give a review of this conversion in that kind of way and may get salted by others , just my honest opinion and i must stress it has nothing to do with how im driving it.

As for the Works , iv driven one on two occasions , it definatley felt faster than a stock car but witout a doubt not £3500 faster , i know you get a full warranty but iv had a new gearbox , clutch and flywheel reciently replaced by my dealer due to a serious fault with these components , iv also had around 5 new driveshafts replaced , and my cars Hartge'd I know every dealers different though.

Paul

[LMB]

You ain't drive my Works.

Mine ended up costing me £2,800 - worth every penny.

[Paul]

I drove a lovely light weight works, it's fantastic, but not as quick as the BBR. I've yet to drive a Hartge car (slow to get onto that I know).

[DinkaDonka]

Wot u done to it !? hehe

[DinkaDonka]

Hmmm this BBR sounds the dogs , lol

[LMB]

Quote: Originally Posted by DinkaDonka

Wot u done to it !? hehe

I've ran it in a la Mo.

Jackson 4-2-1 Racing Header next......lol.......

[DinkaDonka]

Ohhh no man, u cant do that!! , hehe , my cars bin run in well , red lined in all the gears from new , fair enuf the englines life may have lost 30,000 miles but i wont have it that long

[LMB]

Quote: Originally Posted by DinkaDonka

Ohhh no man, u cant do that!! , hehe

How does it compare to the Miltek?

[LMB]

Quote: Originally Posted by DinkaDonka

Hmmm this BBR sounds the dogs , lol

It does.

[valkyre13]

Wow!!From what i'm reading now i see that the Hartge conversion,well um....sucks!I am really amazed because i always read and heard how fast,reliable and great the hartge is!Even from almost everyone in here i remember suggesting the conversion with no second thoughts!Never heard such bad words though...Is it THAT crap?OMG!!You guys blew me away!!Please i am really confused because where i live i have only 2 options Works or Hartge.(i remember reading from many guys that the works doesn't "feel" any faster than the stock car and that the Hartge "feels" and IS faster.)What should i do ?Should i go with the Works(6000 Euros i think is waaaaay too much)?Please HELP MEEE!!

[JBOO]

There have been lots of positive reviews of the Hartge conversion, both in magazines and users.

Actually, the negative comments in this post are some of the first I can recall reading. Maybe over time people are getting used to their power and it doesn't seem worth it anymore. For the comparison given, you have different drivers and weights for each car to consider. That will make a difference. How many car lengths ahead would you expect to be anyways?

I don't think the Works has even been consistently proven any faster, so if you're looking for the best power for the money I would say no. However, people always say it seems smoother and more stock like. Never quite understood that since I've never driven one and my car doesn't seem to drive any different with the Digi-Tec conversion, with the exception of more power of course.

If you can afford the Works, I would say get it. You would probably be happier with the peace of mind of the warranty and prestige of the name it offers. Of course a lot of Works owners seems to crave more power, so you may spend even more and eventually void the warranty anyways.

It's a touch decision.
Hartge=more power, less cost

Works=more power, BMW warranty, prestige

Either way, I think you will enjoy it.

[valkyre13]

JBOO i really thank you for clearing things up for me.Actually considering the warranty issue i am a bit lucky because an uncle of mine is a BMW dealer so he has ensured me that either option will not affect my warranty!In fact he is the one who is going to make the conversion during my programmed service.So warranty between these two conversions is not an issue for me.The point is i am a bit scared from what i've read here,because i 've only heard good things about the Hartge.Seems though that still the majority of people is happy.

[kenny78]

Just buy a 15% smaller pulley for 150 euros & stick it on job solved ;-)

[ScottyB]

When I watched the review on Top Gear, I think I decided Id get the Works kit down the track

Hartge still seems great though, from the cars Ive been with the kit installed