[Dawn]

Quote: Originally Posted by batou (original)

"Apparently"

Whatever, its still a PROPER Works

Quote: Originally Posted by Streeters (original)

Cheeky !

Sorry, had to be said

Quote: Originally Posted by hoojkel (original)

Ahh, its in the same context as putting badges on cars that aren't completely what they truely are no matter how close you get them to be. I didn't say you owned a cooper, i'm making a comparison and it looks like a bit like my own 210 JCW MCS

Oh how jealousy rears its ugly head at times (not you hoojkel)

[batou]

I thought you'd ended your argument Dawn

I think you've missed the point, or something isn't reading right from just words alone. If you saw my confused expression at your strange anger and resentment you'd understand.

1. I don't want to own a WORKS. I could sell mine and buy one with no extra cash needed.
2. I'm not jealous of someone who has a WORKS.
3. I don't question what is real WORKS (if it has an engine plate & number it's real).
4. I'm not badging my car as a WORKS to increase it's value.
5. I'm not going to brag about owning a real WORKS when I clearly don't.

I hope thats clearer.

I don't judge someones current financial situation and personal status on what car they choose to buy, regardless of where it is in it's respective class anyone who does is simply a snob, infact a lot of what is said pretty much meets the standard definition of a snob or snobbery.

Your first post was aimed at someone else questioning what is or isn't a real WORKS.... I know your car is a real WORKS and I know that even though some don't make the claimed 210BHP that doesn't mean they are not real. I'll just be thankful I can meet that claim with plenty of change

I had a Mini 1000 Cooper look-a-like with John Cooper badges.... maybe I'm just a born wannabe

[Dawn]

Quote: Originally Posted by batou (original)

I thought you'd ended your argument Dawn

I think you've missed the point, or something isn't reading right from just words alone. If you saw my confused expression at your strange anger and resentment you'd understand.

1. I don't want to own a WORKS. I could sell mine and buy one with no extra cash needed.
2. I'm not jealous of someone who has a WORKS.
3. I don't question what is real WORKS (if it has an engine plate & number it's real).
4. I'm not badging my car as a WORKS to increase it's value.
5. I'm not going to brag about owning a real WORKS when I clearly don't.

I hope thats clearer.

I don't judge someones current financial situation and personal status on what car they choose to buy, regardless of where it is in it's respective class anyone who does is simply a snob, infact a lot of what is said pretty much meets the standard definition of a snob or snobbery.

Your first post was aimed at someone else questioning what is or isn't a real WORKS.... I know your car is a real WORKS and I know that even though some don't make the claimed 210BHP that doesn't mean they are not real. I'll just be thankful I can meet that claim with plenty of change

I had a Mini 1000 Cooper look-a-like with John Cooper badges.... maybe I'm just a born wannabe

Nope
And lets just clear this up ok, there is no anger or resentment, where did that come from
And neither do i judge someones financial situation, if i was being a snob id have bought a Brand new Works and not a cherished one, where have i ever judged what someone can and cant afford
And non of that post was aimed at you, why are taking offence over it
I can big up what i/we have plenty, but why should i ? where would it get me, i happen to be proud of my car, and it wasnt just me who changed the direction of the original post, read through, i dared to say i didnt agree and got an indirect backlash at being a snob
Not so, am more down to earth than 90% of the people that posted probably !
Im entitled to my opinion without being accused of being bitter/angry etc..
Just as you are entittled to your judgement of me thinking im 'up myself'
That is the end of my argument as its going nowhere fast..
Enjoy your car, get your badges, your engine upgrade or whatever and i'll dream of my Carerra (or maybe stick some badges on my MINI instead, its cheaper )

[black20vt]

62 posts about a badge. Discuss

[Dawn]

Quote: Originally Posted by black20vt (original)

62 posts about a badge. Discuss

nothing construvtive to add ? discuss

[alski]

any thoughts on tattoo's, as my middle name is john..

could i have JCW across my shoulders

or mini on a smaller part of my anatomy

at least i could argue one was correct

[black20vt]

Quote: Originally Posted by Dawn (original)

nothing construvtive to add ? discuss

I think you'll find that its constructive

[Capsaisin]

Quote: Originally Posted by black20vt (original)

I think you'll find that its constructive

Only on your planet.

Now I will give my views on badging.
Not so long ago I owned a Triumph TR8. It wasn't a factory produced car, it was a RHD replica. Thus it was a UK TR7 which had been rebuilt to US TR8 spec but in RHD. I bought this car after conversion and it was an almost exact copy, including the TR8 badges.
The car was registered as a TR7 with 3.5l engine, but I felt that the badges were appropriate as it not only replicated the original, but it was in fact a little more special than just a standard TR7.

Now we come to the MINI.
I have a MCS with GTT 230 conversion. I also have a set of JWC badges, they are sat in a drawer in the kitchen.
I just cannot see that it would be right to put them on the car, even though I have a JCW works airbox (with GTT filter). My car is NOT a MCS JCW. To me the JCW badge denotes a JCW tuning conversion, not a few body parts. So I guess my view is, why bother with the JCW badges, unless it really is a JCW tuned car.

[supa-dupa-cooper]

So why then do JCW sell not only the tuning parts but also the styling and interior parts as well? So that people can pick and choose which bits they want on their car, not everyone can afford or wants the whole package.

All those parts are therefore JCW, so unless the car has nothing to do with JCW on it, then what is the problem with putting the badge on?

The JCW side skirts that have been fitted to my new car have been fitted with JCW black sill strips, I suppose your all going to tell me thats wrong as well

[Fizzoid]

Quote: Originally Posted by supa-dupa-cooper (original)

So why then do JCW sell not only the tuning parts but also the styling and interior parts as well? So that people can pick and choose which bits they want on their car, not everyone can afford or wants the whole package.

Exactly. That's one of the reasons why I like the MINI so much, because of the amount of choice you have not just for tuning, but mainly for styling. JCW is more than just adding a few extra horses...

[batou]

The JCW kit was developed in house by the team at John Cooper Works for the MINI Cooper S, all BMW did was agree to offer and fit the kit from their dealership network with a warranty (wheres the heritage in that?) and then the factory kit/car. This is essentially what slowed business at the JCG shop and led to it closing it’s doors.

JCW originally offered restoration and a was retail outlet for its tuning parts both classic and new. Where is the garage now? Well one has reopened (minimotorsportcentre) offering after market versions of the parts offered in the kit sold by BMW. The other is focusing on developing kits for the new mini to be sold through BMW.

So...

A Cooper S JCW 210 is a car fitted with parts developed by JCG and sold/fitted by BMW is a real WORKS and fully entitled to display a Works emblem at the back.

A Cooper S fitted with JCW parts developed JCG not bought through by BMW fitted by someone else is a.... ?

...and is a fraud/fake/wannabe/insult and in the same context as putting GSI badges on a 1.2 corsa?

I thought the whole attraction about Minis old and new was the potential to accessorise to your own personal taste. As far as I was concerned there was nothing wrong with putting Works Emblems on a Mini be it a classic (cooper or not) or a new one (one, cooper, cooper s) that has parts designed and developed by John Cooper Works.

A lot have missed the actual point of this thread, it wasn't to ask if this is "OK" to do this I asked how owners of Works cars felt about me doing this and a lot of people took that assumption which just goes to show how narrow minded some people can be about status symbols and what makes them so high and mighty to call someone a fraud.

black20vt has actually hit the nail on the head here. 62 posts about a badge pretty much sums it up, whether it's valuable or not I was interested in finding out current views on Minis and what it means to some people.

An old Mini 1000 restored in black with white minilites, checked roof, JC signature stripes with cooper badges that looked identical to a Cooper was consider as a cool car.

Nowadays John Cooper Works badges on anything less than a kit sold and fitted through BMW is a big NO-NO to some.

[alski]

if i was worried about the opinion of a vocal minority, i could have took on board the following remarks, from family, friends, dealer etc
1] should not have brought a girls car......
2] all coopers and MCS should have a white roof and mirrors.....ie not same as body colour
3] spent all that cash on a sun roof when a convertable was only 1k more
4] why put a CFC plate on my car
5] colour coded my car
6] 230 + bhp thanks to GTT
7] fitted ATE BBK that stops the car
8] should have kept run flats and s-spokes

did all this, and fitted front jcw badge for fun, which will upset both camps, as at least 50% wrong which ever way you look at it....

all with change compared to dealer fit costs for the real deal...

the down side.....
risked my warrenty with aftermarket performance parts and risked scorn from real JCW owners...

hope you all feel my pain

[batou]

I've had a few of the same from friends or others for me lol.

Quote: Originally Posted by alski (original)

if i was worried about the opinion of a vocal minority, i could have took on board the following remarks, from family, friends, dealer etc
1] should not have brought a girls car......

I got this with pretty much all my mates. One short trip round the block with them as a passenger cleared that up very quickly.

[DaFlake]

Funny how that works...

[Fizzoid]

Got to agree with point 4 though alski

[alski]

Quote: Originally Posted by Fizzoid (original)

Got to agree with point 4 though alski

fair comment.....and i don't expect or care if most people like it,
on the other hand
if the majority of Londoners cant be wrong how come you got ken livingstone

surprisingly my car always get a thumbs from opposition fans anyway... a degree of daftness earns respect

so i say each to their own,

[hoojkel]

[quote=supa-dupa-cooper;3336807]So why then do JCW sell not only the tuning parts but also the styling and interior parts as well? So that people can pick and choose which bits they want on their car, not everyone can afford or wants the whole package.

Is it because JC garages struck a deal with bmw to have a range of accessories which they could make money at, on top of the tuning kit??

[m44rkr]

Any one can put a badge on the car they have if they want - they own it .

The JCW kit that means the most to me , is the Engine tuning kit .
this is what its about - the tuning.??

rally car originally ! , but about tuning .

The other parts are accessories for this and BMW are cashing in on this CUSTOMISING .


As loads of people have said - u get a MCS from factory and the JCW is an add-on.

Fitting the badge to non JCW is flattery if people want to immitate it .

When u Put the foot down - You might see the difference.

otherwise , Who cares - ITS A BADGE

Enjoy your mini and people have opinions - don't mean we have to like or believe the SAME.

[batou]

Quote: Originally Posted by m44rkr (original)

When u Put the foot down - You might see the difference.

otherwise , Who cares - ITS A BADGE

Funny you should say that... a "Works" tried overtaking after a brief slow section in traffic the other week on the M40... lets just say it looked more like he found reverse rather than 4th .....

[wibbly]

Quote: Originally Posted by batou (original)

Funny you should say that... a "Works" tried overtaking after a brief slow section in traffic the other week on the M40... lets just say it looked more like he found reverse rather than 4th .....

But how do you know it was a 'Works' car and not someone who had put a badge on his car