MINI2

AussieMini · Aug 16th, 2003, 02:25 PM

Hi All, while driving around today normally in my March 03 build MCS' (with only 4200 k's on the clock) the EML, traction control and battery light came on and cut the engine. When I stopped and opened the bonnet (hood) the coolant bottle was boiling out coolant from the lid and continued to boil for a minute or so after I stopped the engine. It was only 8 degrees outside too so nice and cold.

Now my car is in a holding yard 150 k's away while I have to drive round a rental (paid for by BMW) for the next three to five days!

I know a few 02 build MCS had the cooling fan break down so does this scenario sound the same? Or is it something new?

Any help please

Root Ginger · Aug 16th, 2003, 02:30 PM

Sounds like it may be the problem with the power steering cooling fan sucking up some debris. This then overloads causing the fuse to go. Rather stupidly this is the same fuse as the main engine fan so this won't work either. It only takes a minute or so for the car to overheat without the fan.

There are plenty of threads on the subject so do a search.

AussieMini · Aug 16th, 2003, 09:32 PM

Sounds plausable mate and I have read other forums about that problem, however when the car stopped the main engine fan switched on trying to cool the engine down so the fuse must still be in tact. Disturbing...

Root Ginger · Aug 17th, 2003, 07:37 AM

Hmm. Could be a loose connection. A dodgy fan. Maybe the BCU needs a reset by disconecting the battery for 10secs. You'll have to get the dealer to look at it I think. Sounds an unusual problem.

MNEHAHA · Sep 17th, 2003, 06:08 PM

My July 03 MCS began having the radiator fan continue to operate after short trips. A few days later the SES warning light came on, following that, I now get an intermittent Temp warning light and the temp gauge shoots to max, often upon a cold start??? Also had my DSC light come on while at a standstill and remain on while driving a rather short distance along with all the other colorful little "warning" lights already on the blink.

EBMCS03 · Sep 19th, 2003, 06:56 AM

YIKES... can u update us later after u find out what really happened?

MNEHAHA · Sep 19th, 2003, 07:56 PM

MCS is now at dealership and hope to have a diagnosis today. Will keep you posted on their findings. I miss my NEW car!!! But I get to go to the WIndy City to pick it back up so there is a positive to such a negative situation.

liznewman · Sep 27th, 2003, 07:10 AM

I had this problem with my S. (July 02) When I stopped the fan came on and the car showed it was overheating. I phoned mini help and was told that if this happens not to drive it as it could cause more damage. It was taken away a new water pump was put on and have had no problems since. Must admit it scared the life out of me when it happened. I was also told by my dealer that the water should not need topping up between services? Anyone else heard of this. Brilliant car though!

MNEHAHA · Sep 28th, 2003, 10:15 PM

The temp sensor on my 03 "s" failed causing the fluctuation in the temp gauge. I has been replaced and seems to be running very well. Talked to the dealer about the after market guard for the PS fan but they had not heard of it. Suggested it would be a good idea tho' as they recognized the issue with foreign objects blocking that fan.

Thanks to this site, I have learned quite a bit about operating my car and some of its quirks. I also need to say that Knauz BMW in Lake Bluff, IL was much more responsive than Patrick Mini in Schaumberg where I purchased my car. Service was voice mail and very slow response. So, if you are a IL or MI owner, I woudl highly recommend Knauz.

Happy Motoring!!

minitech · Sep 29th, 2003, 12:12 PM

that p/s fan needs to be removed. the person that thought up the fan location should be fired for thinking so stupidly. i have seen at the dealship more than 150 fans fail and make the cars overheat. this is a big problem and will be till BMW get off thier ass and have the earlyer cars rewired. i was told by a man that is very high in BMW they would not fix them because of the cost factor and the newer cars alreadly have been fixed at the factory.he more or less told me they dont care about the small amount(10.000)of cars in the states that have this problem.they need to get a clue!!!!!!!!

wmd · Sep 29th, 2003, 04:06 PM

I think that the best solution is to remove the fan as well. It's only needed for very hot climates or extreme conditions such as racing that put added load on the PS motor.

The aux PS fan circuit is a marginal electrical design at best. On early build cars, the PS fan, PS relay, and the lowspeed radiator relay, are all fused by the same 5 amp fuse. Relays generally draw 0.3--0.5 amps and I measured the current draw on my Hoover PS fan at 4.75 amps at start up and 2.0 amps while running. Do the math, and the use of a 5 amp fuse doesn't seem reasonable to me. I think the fuse can blow on start up even if not clogged by debris. I have replaced my F5 fuse with a 7.5amp fuse instead.

Even with the rewiring of the PS fan on post Dec2002 build MINIs, the problem is if the fan is locked and blows the fuse, you won't know it.

I think that MINI ought to jump on this opportunity and market the PS fan as an environmentally friendly feature----what other car out there vacuums the road as it goes. MINI should have attached a vacuum cleaner bag to the back of the fan that the owner could empty on a once-a-week basis.

I think the screen is a good idea, but only if you check it periodically for anything stuck to it, otherwise it will have the effect of nullifying the effectiveness of the fan. The only drawback I see to the screen would be the task of cleaning any G4 off of it.

Bad Ess · Sep 29th, 2003, 04:23 PM

What is the remaining spinning sound when the motor is shut off. I though it was my PS fan?

wmd · Oct 1st, 2003, 05:07 AM

Bad Ess: I don't think you are hearing the PS fan, since it only runs when the hi-speed radiator fan is on. The radiator fan will make much more noise than the PS fan. And the PS fan has a small 3in blade that stops less than 2 sec after current is shut off. I don't hear any motor running after shutting off my car unless it's the radiator fan. I do hear a relay clicking and a crackling electrial sound for about 20 sec after shutdown. Sounds a bit like the ignition module discharging a residual current, but I haven't pinpointed the source of that noise yet.

Bad Ess · Oct 1st, 2003, 02:20 PM

wmd, Is the rad fan on all the time? I get this spool down even on a cold engine. Could it be a hydrolic pump on the brakes?

wmd · Oct 1st, 2003, 03:13 PM

The radiator fan is temperature controlled by the DME thru the coolant temp sensor. The lo-speed fan comes on at about 95ºC and the hi-speed fan along with the PS fan come on about 110ºC. In normal driving the radiator fan is rarely on and the hi-speed fan even less so, since above 20MPH there is sufficient natural airflow thru the radiator without the fan.

I am thinking that what you're hearing is inside the cabin. Have you ruled out the HVAC blower already? Or one other possibility might be the interior air sampling fan which is on the front panel of AUTO A/C only. It runs all the time so the A/C has a temp reference value of the inside air temp. I have the manual A/C, so I naturally wouldn't hear this noise.

If the sound is definately from under the bonnet, then I would say it would have to be the PS motor. Some MINI owners have reported loud PS motors and some like myself don't hear it at all. How long does the sound last after engine stall?

Bad Ess · Oct 1st, 2003, 06:02 PM

wmd: The sound is like a fan and it is under the bonnet. I thought the power steering pump was on demand. Is there an acumulator? There is no additional noise when turning the wheel side to side. I can't imagine it is a fan if the car is cold.

The spool down is about 3 seconds.

minitech · Oct 4th, 2003, 01:20 AM

did any body think of the p/s electric motor???. i have replaced at least 4 of them and all of them had a high pitch noise before they failed.....just a thought......

wmd · Oct 9th, 2003, 09:12 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by Bad Ess

wmd: The sound is like a fan and it is under the bonnet. I thought the power steering pump was on demand. Is there an acumulator? There is no additional noise when turning the wheel side to side. I can't imagine it is a fan if the car is cold.

The spool down is about 3 seconds.

The power steering motor is a variable speed motor, but it is running all the time at slow speed so it is ready for any steering input. The speed of the motor increases when steering input is required. So you must be hearing the PS motor coasting down, since the PS fan only runs intermittently and only when the radiator fan is also running.

dsc68 · Oct 13th, 2003, 04:00 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by wmd

I
I think the screen is a good idea, but only if you check it periodically for anything stuck to it, otherwise it will have the effect of nullifying the effectiveness of the fan. The only drawback I see to the screen would be the task of cleaning any G4 off of it.

Go to your local electronics/computer parts store and purchase a computer fan finger guard. Fits perfectly and keeps plastic bags out.

EBMCS03 · Oct 13th, 2003, 06:21 AM

I was just going to goto Home Depot and get some chicken wire fencing the small hole ones and attach it on somehow... just need to figure out how to get under the car.

Aug 16th, 2003, 02:25 PM	#1
AussieMini MINI2 Senior Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Brisbane Local Time: 04:51 PM Posts: 659 Offline	Overheated MCS 03 Build Hi All, while driving around today normally in my March 03 build MCS' (with only 4200 k's on the clock) the EML, traction control and battery light came on and cut the engine. When I stopped and opened the bonnet (hood) the coolant bottle was boiling out coolant from the lid and continued to boil for a minute or so after I stopped the engine. It was only 8 degrees outside too so nice and cold. Now my car is in a holding yard 150 k's away while I have to drive round a rental (paid for by BMW) for the next three to five days! I know a few 02 build MCS had the cooling fan break down so does this scenario sound the same? Or is it something new? Any help please

Aug 16th, 2003, 02:30 PM	#2 (permalink)
Root Ginger Amiga 500 to PS3 20 Years Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Slough, Berkshire Local Time: 07:51 AM Posts: 4,571 Offline	Sounds like it may be the problem with the power steering cooling fan sucking up some debris. This then overloads causing the fuse to go. Rather stupidly this is the same fuse as the main engine fan so this won't work either. It only takes a minute or so for the car to overheat without the fan. There are plenty of threads on the subject so do a search. It was acceptable in the 80's

Aug 17th, 2003, 07:37 AM	#4 (permalink)
Root Ginger Amiga 500 to PS3 20 Years Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Slough, Berkshire Local Time: 07:51 AM Posts: 4,571 Offline	Hmm. Could be a loose connection. A dodgy fan. Maybe the BCU needs a reset by disconecting the battery for 10secs. You'll have to get the dealer to look at it I think. Sounds an unusual problem. It was acceptable in the 80's

Sep 19th, 2003, 06:56 AM	#6 (permalink)
EBMCS03 M5 Extraordinare! Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: So Cal Local Time: 11:51 PM Posts: 6,763 Offline	YIKES... can u update us later after u find out what really happened? EB/W MCS Arrived (3/26/03) SOLD 4/25/06

Sep 27th, 2003, 07:10 AM	#8 (permalink)
liznewman MINI2 Newbie Join Date: Sep 2003 Local Time: 06:51 AM Posts: 40 Offline	Overheating I had this problem with my S. (July 02) When I stopped the fan came on and the car showed it was overheating. I phoned mini help and was told that if this happens not to drive it as it could cause more damage. It was taken away a new water pump was put on and have had no problems since. Must admit it scared the life out of me when it happened. I was also told by my dealer that the water should not need topping up between services? Anyone else heard of this. Brilliant car though! Last edited by liznewman : Sep 27th, 2003 at 07:36 AM.

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Aug 16th, 2003, 09:32 PM	#3 (permalink)
AussieMini MINI2 Senior Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Brisbane Local Time: 04:51 PM Posts: 659 Offline	Sounds plausable mate and I have read other forums about that problem, however when the car stopped the main engine fan switched on trying to cool the engine down so the fuse must still be in tact. Disturbing...

Sep 17th, 2003, 06:08 PM	#5 (permalink)
MNEHAHA MINI2 Newbie Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Michigan Local Time: 01:51 AM Posts: 5 Offline	My July 03 MCS began having the radiator fan continue to operate after short trips. A few days later the SES warning light came on, following that, I now get an intermittent Temp warning light and the temp gauge shoots to max, often upon a cold start??? Also had my DSC light come on while at a standstill and remain on while driving a rather short distance along with all the other colorful little "warning" lights already on the blink.

Sep 19th, 2003, 07:56 PM	#7 (permalink)
MNEHAHA MINI2 Newbie Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Michigan Local Time: 01:51 AM Posts: 5 Offline	MCS is now at dealership and hope to have a diagnosis today. Will keep you posted on their findings. I miss my NEW car!!! But I get to go to the WIndy City to pick it back up so there is a positive to such a negative situation.

Sep 28th, 2003, 10:15 PM	#9 (permalink)
MNEHAHA MINI2 Newbie Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Michigan Local Time: 01:51 AM Posts: 5 Offline	The temp sensor on my 03 "s" failed causing the fluctuation in the temp gauge. I has been replaced and seems to be running very well. Talked to the dealer about the after market guard for the PS fan but they had not heard of it. Suggested it would be a good idea tho' as they recognized the issue with foreign objects blocking that fan. Thanks to this site, I have learned quite a bit about operating my car and some of its quirks. I also need to say that Knauz BMW in Lake Bluff, IL was much more responsive than Patrick Mini in Schaumberg where I purchased my car. Service was voice mail and very slow response. So, if you are a IL or MI owner, I woudl highly recommend Knauz. Happy Motoring!!

Sep 29th, 2003, 12:12 PM	#10 (permalink)
minitech Let's Motor... Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Manchester, Mass Local Time: 02:51 AM Posts: 91 Offline	that p/s fan needs to be removed. the person that thought up the fan location should be fired for thinking so stupidly. i have seen at the dealship more than 150 fans fail and make the cars overheat. this is a big problem and will be till BMW get off thier ass and have the earlyer cars rewired. i was told by a man that is very high in BMW they would not fix them because of the cost factor and the newer cars alreadly have been fixed at the factory.he more or less told me they dont care about the small amount(10.000)of cars in the states that have this problem.they need to get a clue!!!!!!!! *let's motor*

Sep 29th, 2003, 04:06 PM	#11 (permalink)
wmd MINI2 Regular Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: CO Local Time: 12:51 AM Posts: 193 Offline	I think that the best solution is to remove the fan as well. It's only needed for very hot climates or extreme conditions such as racing that put added load on the PS motor. The aux PS fan circuit is a marginal electrical design at best. On early build cars, the PS fan, PS relay, and the lowspeed radiator relay, are all fused by the same 5 amp fuse. Relays generally draw 0.3--0.5 amps and I measured the current draw on my Hoover PS fan at 4.75 amps at start up and 2.0 amps while running. Do the math, and the use of a 5 amp fuse doesn't seem reasonable to me. I think the fuse can blow on start up even if not clogged by debris. I have replaced my F5 fuse with a 7.5amp fuse instead. Even with the rewiring of the PS fan on post Dec2002 build MINIs, the problem is if the fan is locked and blows the fuse, you won't know it. I think that MINI ought to jump on this opportunity and market the PS fan as an environmentally friendly feature----what other car out there vacuums the road as it goes. MINI should have attached a vacuum cleaner bag to the back of the fan that the owner could empty on a once-a-week basis. I think the screen is a good idea, but only if you check it periodically for anything stuck to it, otherwise it will have the effect of nullifying the effectiveness of the fan. The only drawback I see to the screen would be the task of cleaning any G4 off of it. Attached Thumbnails

Sep 29th, 2003, 04:23 PM	#12 (permalink)
Bad Ess MINI2 Senior Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: New Hampshire Seacoa Local Time: 02:51 AM Posts: 430 Offline	What is the remaining spinning sound when the motor is shut off. I though it was my PS fan? Ess

Oct 1st, 2003, 05:07 AM	#13 (permalink)
wmd MINI2 Regular Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: CO Local Time: 12:51 AM Posts: 193 Offline	Bad Ess: I don't think you are hearing the PS fan, since it only runs when the hi-speed radiator fan is on. The radiator fan will make much more noise than the PS fan. And the PS fan has a small 3in blade that stops less than 2 sec after current is shut off. I don't hear any motor running after shutting off my car unless it's the radiator fan. I do hear a relay clicking and a crackling electrial sound for about 20 sec after shutdown. Sounds a bit like the ignition module discharging a residual current, but I haven't pinpointed the source of that noise yet.

Oct 1st, 2003, 02:20 PM	#14 (permalink)
Bad Ess MINI2 Senior Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: New Hampshire Seacoa Local Time: 02:51 AM Posts: 430 Offline	wmd, Is the rad fan on all the time? I get this spool down even on a cold engine. Could it be a hydrolic pump on the brakes? Ess

Oct 1st, 2003, 03:13 PM	#15 (permalink)
wmd MINI2 Regular Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: CO Local Time: 12:51 AM Posts: 193 Offline	The radiator fan is temperature controlled by the DME thru the coolant temp sensor. The lo-speed fan comes on at about 95ºC and the hi-speed fan along with the PS fan come on about 110ºC. In normal driving the radiator fan is rarely on and the hi-speed fan even less so, since above 20MPH there is sufficient natural airflow thru the radiator without the fan. I am thinking that what you're hearing is inside the cabin. Have you ruled out the HVAC blower already? Or one other possibility might be the interior air sampling fan which is on the front panel of AUTO A/C only. It runs all the time so the A/C has a temp reference value of the inside air temp. I have the manual A/C, so I naturally wouldn't hear this noise. If the sound is definately from under the bonnet, then I would say it would have to be the PS motor. Some MINI owners have reported loud PS motors and some like myself don't hear it at all. How long does the sound last after engine stall?

Oct 1st, 2003, 06:02 PM	#16 (permalink)
Bad Ess MINI2 Senior Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: New Hampshire Seacoa Local Time: 02:51 AM Posts: 430 Offline	wmd: The sound is like a fan and it is under the bonnet. I thought the power steering pump was on demand. Is there an acumulator? There is no additional noise when turning the wheel side to side. I can't imagine it is a fan if the car is cold. The spool down is about 3 seconds. Ess

Oct 4th, 2003, 01:20 AM	#17 (permalink)
minitech Let's Motor... Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Manchester, Mass Local Time: 02:51 AM Posts: 91 Offline	did any body think of the p/s electric motor???. i have replaced at least 4 of them and all of them had a high pitch noise before they failed.....just a thought...... *let's motor*

Oct 9th, 2003, 09:12 PM	#18 (permalink)
wmd MINI2 Regular Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: CO Local Time: 12:51 AM Posts: 193 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by Bad Ess wmd: The sound is like a fan and it is under the bonnet. I thought the power steering pump was on demand. Is there an acumulator? There is no additional noise when turning the wheel side to side. I can't imagine it is a fan if the car is cold. The spool down is about 3 seconds. The power steering motor is a variable speed motor, but it is running all the time at slow speed so it is ready for any steering input. The speed of the motor increases when steering input is required. So you must be hearing the PS motor coasting down, since the PS fan only runs intermittently and only when the radiator fan is also running.

Oct 13th, 2003, 04:00 AM	#19 (permalink)
dsc68 MINI2 Regular Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Canberra, Australia Local Time: 04:51 PM Posts: 187 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by wmd I I think the screen is a good idea, but only if you check it periodically for anything stuck to it, otherwise it will have the effect of nullifying the effectiveness of the fan. The only drawback I see to the screen would be the task of cleaning any G4 off of it. Go to your local electronics/computer parts store and purchase a computer fan finger guard. Fits perfectly and keeps plastic bags out. Attached Thumbnails Dean MCS CR/W with bonnet stripes, DSC, full leather, MPSW, alarm. trip computer, X-Lites Superduperminicooperexpertengineering

Oct 13th, 2003, 06:21 AM	#20 (permalink)
EBMCS03 M5 Extraordinare! Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: So Cal Local Time: 11:51 PM Posts: 6,763 Offline	I was just going to goto Home Depot and get some chicken wire fencing the small hole ones and attach it on somehow... just need to figure out how to get under the car. EB/W MCS Arrived (3/26/03) SOLD 4/25/06

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