MINI2

pregan · Sep 17th, 2003, 01:57 PM

hi .. only recently joined the forum but had a MCS from oct 2002 .. i've been reading the various posts on the problems with the ecu software .. so far i've found stumble, yo-yo and hiccup but no-ones (and i did search) really managed to explain these .. could someone have a try ..

i have a 1st gear problem which i've always called bogging (its how i used to describe carb problems on bikes), eg normal pulling away and its like you drive through glue for a bit .. which i'm sure applies to one of these but i cant find which one ...

sorry to start yet another thread ..

RickB · Sep 17th, 2003, 04:21 PM

I would put that under "stumble". I get this in my S only when accelerating hard with the DSC turned on; the car pulls away strong initially, but then loses power for what seems like a second, then goes again. This is the one that can get you killed, as it seems to happen only when you are trying to pull out into traffic. "Hiccup" (I think I coined that one) is a momentary stutter, like a "miss", that happens only in first gear. For some, it happens only the first time the clutch is engaged after start-up, for others it happens every time on standing starts. "Yo-yo" is a kind of surging effect. When accelerating at a moderate rate, in the 2500-3500rpm range, there was a sense of the acceleration rate varying, so giving the "yo-yo". I had the yo-yo from new (July '02 build), and when that was fixed with the 32 upgrade, I came away with the hiccup - yes, the fix for the yo-yo and cold start problems on early-build Ss seems to have caused the 1st-gear hiccup.

Froggie · Sep 17th, 2003, 07:17 PM

My hiccup happens in 2nd gear also

pregan · Oct 14th, 2003, 10:22 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by RickB

I get this in my S only when accelerating hard with the DSC turned on; the car pulls away strong initially, but then loses power for what seems like a second, then goes again.

can you let me know what you mean by hard .. just so i can try and re-create it at will, eg stopped, upto # revs, dump the clutch/let it out normally .. only so i can get this in my head, as i would'nt say the problem i've got would be a show stopper when trying to pull out into traffic, but it may just be that i've learnt to live with it and compromise for it ..

RickB · Oct 14th, 2003, 04:25 PM

By "hard" I don't mean a racing start, I just mean briskly - maybe 2500rpm, and feed in the gas and clutch. Since I notice it only when pulling into traffic, it could be the act of accelerating and turning is causing some tire slippage that is being sensed and (over)corrected by DSC. The effect is to give a nice, "one-one-thousand, two- . . ." with absolutely no power delivery. I'm too busy cringing, in anticipation of being rear-ended, to watch for the DSC light.

cpeters1 · Oct 15th, 2003, 07:06 PM

I have had all these problems. Unfortunately I use slightly different terms:

Yo-Yo: A feeling of oscillating acceleration force usually in second gear between 3500 and 4000 rpms. I would expect only a driver to notice this.

Stumble/Hiccup: At the last inch of clutch release after starting from a stop in first gear, the engine looses power for less than a second. Like a 1/10th of a second. This happens to me 75% of the time while accelerating in first gear. Not only on the first start, not only with DSC, not only with AC. Always.

Bog: This is also in first gear. Seems to occur mostly on turning and accelerating in first gear. Car accelerates normally for one car length. Total loss of engine power for two car lengths, then power resumes as normal. Results in nearly getting rear ended by the car you are pulling out in front of.

Cold Start: Engine will not start cold. Multiple attempts to start required.

I have a June 02 MCS. Never had cold start. Always had and still have yo-yo. Stumble/hiccup/bog introduced with new SW upgrade in Feb 03. New SW again in June 03 did not fix anything.

Hope that helps.

RickB · Oct 16th, 2003, 04:20 PM

I would have called it "hiccup" and "bog/stumble"; either way, I'd like to get them fixed. After driving with the hiccup for a few months, I've adjusted my driving style so I can usually avoid it. If I turn off DSC, I don't get the . . . other, so I guess I have my own adaptive system to correct for the MINIs problems.

pregan · Oct 17th, 2003, 12:17 PM

well mines not even in the same league as expecting a rear ender

when it goes, either that or i've adapted (hmm upgrades - neo, matrix 2) .. i guess the thing to do is wait till they release a fix and then put it in the shop ...

Sep 17th, 2003, 01:57 PM	#1
pregan MINI2 Newbie Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: London Local Time: 10:55 PM Posts: 12 Offline	Stumble, Hiccup, Yo-Yo ?? hi .. only recently joined the forum but had a MCS from oct 2002 .. i've been reading the various posts on the problems with the ecu software .. so far i've found stumble, yo-yo and hiccup but no-ones (and i did search) really managed to explain these .. could someone have a try .. i have a 1st gear problem which i've always called bogging (its how i used to describe carb problems on bikes), eg normal pulling away and its like you drive through glue for a bit .. which i'm sure applies to one of these but i cant find which one ... sorry to start yet another thread ..

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Sep 17th, 2003, 04:21 PM	#2 (permalink)
RickB MINI2 Master Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Seattle, WA Local Time: 09:55 PM Posts: 777 Offline	I would put that under "stumble". I get this in my S only when accelerating hard with the DSC turned on; the car pulls away strong initially, but then loses power for what seems like a second, then goes again. This is the one that can get you killed, as it seems to happen only when you are trying to pull out into traffic. "Hiccup" (I think I coined that one) is a momentary stutter, like a "miss", that happens only in first gear. For some, it happens only the first time the clutch is engaged after start-up, for others it happens every time on standing starts. "Yo-yo" is a kind of surging effect. When accelerating at a moderate rate, in the 2500-3500rpm range, there was a sense of the acceleration rate varying, so giving the "yo-yo". I had the yo-yo from new (July '02 build), and when that was fixed with the 32 upgrade, I came away with the hiccup - yes, the fix for the yo-yo and cold start problems on early-build Ss seems to have caused the 1st-gear hiccup.

Sep 17th, 2003, 07:17 PM	#3 (permalink)
Froggie MINI2 Regular Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Westchester County, New York Local Time: 04:55 PM Posts: 83 Offline	My hiccup happens in 2nd gear also

Oct 14th, 2003, 10:22 AM	#4 (permalink)
pregan MINI2 Newbie Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: London Local Time: 10:55 PM Posts: 12 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by RickB I get this in my S only when accelerating hard with the DSC turned on; the car pulls away strong initially, but then loses power for what seems like a second, then goes again. can you let me know what you mean by hard .. just so i can try and re-create it at will, eg stopped, upto # revs, dump the clutch/let it out normally .. only so i can get this in my head, as i would'nt say the problem i've got would be a show stopper when trying to pull out into traffic, but it may just be that i've learnt to live with it and compromise for it ..

Oct 14th, 2003, 04:25 PM	#5 (permalink)
RickB MINI2 Master Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Seattle, WA Local Time: 09:55 PM Posts: 777 Offline	By "hard" I don't mean a racing start, I just mean briskly - maybe 2500rpm, and feed in the gas and clutch. Since I notice it only when pulling into traffic, it could be the act of accelerating and turning is causing some tire slippage that is being sensed and (over)corrected by DSC. The effect is to give a nice, "one-one-thousand, two- . . ." with absolutely no power delivery. I'm too busy cringing, in anticipation of being rear-ended, to watch for the DSC light.

Oct 15th, 2003, 07:06 PM	#6 (permalink)
cpeters1 MINI2 Regular Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Florida, East Coast Local Time: 05:55 PM Posts: 119 Offline	I have had all these problems. Unfortunately I use slightly different terms: Yo-Yo: A feeling of oscillating acceleration force usually in second gear between 3500 and 4000 rpms. I would expect only a driver to notice this. Stumble/Hiccup: At the last inch of clutch release after starting from a stop in first gear, the engine looses power for less than a second. Like a 1/10th of a second. This happens to me 75% of the time while accelerating in first gear. Not only on the first start, not only with DSC, not only with AC. Always. Bog: This is also in first gear. Seems to occur mostly on turning and accelerating in first gear. Car accelerates normally for one car length. Total loss of engine power for two car lengths, then power resumes as normal. Results in nearly getting rear ended by the car you are pulling out in front of. Cold Start: Engine will not start cold. Multiple attempts to start required. I have a June 02 MCS. Never had cold start. Always had and still have yo-yo. Stumble/hiccup/bog introduced with new SW upgrade in Feb 03. New SW again in June 03 did not fix anything. Hope that helps.

Oct 16th, 2003, 04:20 PM	#7 (permalink)
RickB MINI2 Master Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Seattle, WA Local Time: 09:55 PM Posts: 777 Offline	I would have called it "hiccup" and "bog/stumble"; either way, I'd like to get them fixed. After driving with the hiccup for a few months, I've adjusted my driving style so I can usually avoid it. If I turn off DSC, I don't get the . . . other, so I guess I have my own adaptive system to correct for the MINIs problems.

Oct 17th, 2003, 12:17 PM	#8 (permalink)
pregan MINI2 Newbie Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: London Local Time: 10:55 PM Posts: 12 Offline	well mines not even in the same league as expecting a rear ender when it goes, either that or i've adapted (hmm upgrades - neo, matrix 2) .. i guess the thing to do is wait till they release a fix and then put it in the shop ...

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