[suzysafloozy]

hiya everyone,

after reading through the acident post it really got me thinking.

i told my insurance company i had no idea what mods were on my car, and i still havent! bought it 2nd hand not from a dealer.

what comes as standard, do u need to state all factory fitted extras?

what about new stereo/ipod kits? decals? i didnt realise changing the tyres was classed as a mod! check below for my alloys. no idea what to tell my insurers but worried as feck now that im not really covered!

bloody nora, help!!

[suzysafloozy]

p.s. its a mini one 54reg

[supa-dupa-cooper]

Insurance is a pain in the rear

Have a look at this thread, I had major problems when it came to insurance for my MINI ONE (despite it having already been insured, or so i thought)

http://www.mini2.com/forum/finance-i...ules-long.html

Basically as I understand it, and have been told the same by a few different companies (MINI, Churchill, Zurich) Anything that is not part of the spec of the car i.e MINI ONE Pepper in my case is classed as a modification. My alloys ive been told are ok, as they form part of the Pepper pack (though im sure they would change their mind )

For my car the 'modifications' i have listed on my policy with Zurich are, Rear Spoiler, Side Skirts and Decals....this was after numerous discussions and phonecalls and eventually the guy at A Plan saying thats all that needed to be put on it (it even got to the point of me getting him to sign the piece of paper with it on! )

So yes, you will need to tell them about the GP alloys, any decals you may have, a spoiler if it has one, things like that....

[FergusM]

Speak to a dealer and get a list of what was standard on the car...and then try and work out what extras have been added.

I know when my last car was stolen (and subsequently recovered) they inspected it to check it was standard peior to settling my claim. They also did a check with DVLA that I had declared all my points (I had none) before settling....so basically they look for any means of getting out paying !

[Randall Raines]

Those wheels actually look like the GP wheels, although I suspect that they are actually copies, and not the genuine article .

On older cars the tyres didn't make any difference as long as they where legal (good condition) however I think, I may be wrong , that the problem with the MINIs is due to the run-flats being classed as a safety feature, so changing them will / could possibly effect any claims, although that can be down to the different insurance companies.

My other ½ wanted to insure her MINI, as I'm in the motor trade, I come across horror stories on a regular basis, so I know what the insurance companies can be like, I made sure that she told them of all her modifications, nothing performance wise, all cosmetic, including a set of aftermarket alloy wheels, but her insurance just asked where where they the original size, as they have the original run-flats fitted to the wheels, all that we could reply was I think so as they have the original tyres on and they didn't seem to interested in anything else (aero kit, spoiler as our MINI was quite highly spec'd from the start), but the premium did go up a little, but I would rather be safe than sorry , providing they pay out in the event of an accident, the other ½ has not had any need to claim in the MINI so we may / will hopefully never find out .

It's also not just the performance side of things that they're interested in, as a fully kitted up car would be more attractive to thieves and even if they don't actually get the car, damage could be caused trying to get it (car or mods) .

[suzysafloozy]

thanks for that. i think i have a chilli pack so shall call to clarify that and mention my ipod kit and alloys. the decals cant be put on till its dry and warm so no point letting them know that for a few more months!

[Buz999]

Didn't think you could get the chilli pack on a ONE.

[supa-dupa-cooper]

Quote: Originally Posted by suzysafloozy (original)

thanks for that. i think i have a chilli pack so shall call to clarify that and mention my ipod kit and alloys. the decals cant be put on till its dry and warm so no point letting them know that for a few more months!

Buz999 is right, you cant get the CHILI Pack on the MINI ONE.

Looking at the pics of your car I would say its got the SALT Pack as you dont appear to have the Chrome Line Exterior. You might want to clarify this with a local dealer though

[David King]

Those are GP Replicas, and by the looks of things 17".

Pepper pack has chrome line exterior as standard, so it could either be Salt, or no package at all. For some reason insurance is more expensive if you have a salt pack over a standard one

[South Shore Lad]

I too have been following/contributing to the recent accident thread on here.

At one point a frequent poster said it was all getting a bit silly when we started talking about tyre mods. And yet here, RR is saying that ALL mods, even cosmetic, should be listed!

Now I can understand a claim getting busted back if safety/performance/handling mods (and I agree tyres/wheels should be amongst these) aren't notified, but cosmetic...?

The way I understand it is that your car has an agreed value with standard kit/approved extras. If it's damaged/a total loss, they'll repair to original spec, or will replace with market value - again to the value of original spec. I'd have thought undeclared cosmetic mods won't affect the validity of a claim as such, it's just that the value of them won't be covered when it comes to replacement.

As ever, please correct me if I'm wrong!

SSL

[supa-dupa-cooper]

Quote: Originally Posted by South Shore Lad (original)

I too have been following/contributing to the recent accident thread on here.

At one point a frequent poster said it was all getting a bit silly when we started talking about tyre mods. And yet here, RR is saying that ALL mods, even cosmetic, should be listed!

Now I can understand a claim getting busted back if safety/performance/handling mods (and I agree tyres/wheels should be amongst these) aren't notified, but cosmetic...?

The way I understand it is that your car has an agreed value with standard kit/approved extras. If it's damaged/a total loss, they'll repair to original spec, or will replace with market value - again to the value of original spec. I'd have thought undeclared cosmetic mods won't affect the validity of a claim as such, it's just that the value of them won't be covered when it comes to replacement.

As ever, please correct me if I'm wrong!

SSL

Insurance companies will do anything to get out of paying up

The rear spoiler/side skirts on my car were declared on insuring it....on renewal they denied knowledge of it, refused to reinsure the car and told me it hadnt really been insured properly.....they DO NEED to know, coz if ANYTHING happens they MAY NOT pay out...its just not worth it

[Restyle]

I knew my collection of MINI brochures would come in handy someday
Heres the one relating to the spec of the 2002 One & Cooper


<Ooops ...Just seen yours is a 2004 ...give me a couple of minutes to look up yours ...{Missus} >

EDIT - 2004 salt & pepper spec list added as 2nd pic

[suzysafloozy]

i dont make things easy do i! haha

right its a salt pack, least ive got that straight now.

im of out with a tape measure now to measure my wheels lol hahahahaha

[suzysafloozy]

p.s. thanks for that restyle - made it tonnes easier!

[Randall Raines]

Quote: Originally Posted by South Shore Lad (original)

I too have been following/contributing to the recent accident thread on here.

At one point a frequent poster said it was all getting a bit silly when we started talking about tyre mods. And yet here, RR is saying that ALL mods, even cosmetic, should be listed!

Now I can understand a claim getting busted back if safety/performance/handling mods (and I agree tyres/wheels should be amongst these) aren't notified, but cosmetic...?

The way I understand it is that your car has an agreed value with standard kit/approved extras. If it's damaged/a total loss, they'll repair to original spec, or will replace with market value - again to the value of original spec. I'd have thought undeclared cosmetic mods won't affect the validity of a claim as such, it's just that the value of them won't be covered when it comes to replacement.

As ever, please correct me if I'm wrong!

SSL

Quote: Originally Posted by Hugo (original)

Quote: Originally Posted by GarryThomas (original)

Hugo If you had an accident like lolance, at or close to to a total right off.
With non standard tyres insurance company's may look at it as a un notified mod
not cover the car.
Ive still got runflats on mine haven't approach them yet.

Has anyone asked there Insurance company on this subject ?
Lolance hope you get your car sorted

I think this is getting a bit far fetched, 'tyres a modification'.

Hope you guys get the Minis sorted out soon.

Hi, I struggle a little typing so I can't keep up at times, sometimes I can word things wrong, and when read back, can say something slightly different to what I meant and some of you are so quick, sometimes by the time I can correct it, someone has picked up on it .

However "South Shore Lad", it sounds like your comment was aimed at me, RR (Randall Raines) , I didn't actually post the comment that I think you are referring to (I kept out of that one), the two highlighted quotes are from the mentioned thread (My accident), I have read and interpreted your comment as meaning, I have said one comment on one thread, and then I'm contradicting myself on this thread (I may be wrong , SSL reading your comment a couple of times, I've changed my opinion, it says "a frequent poster said it was all getting a bit silly when we started talking about tyre mods.And yet here, RR is saying that" it makes it sound like your referring to me on both counts "frequent poster & RR", see what I mean about this, and my comment about people picking up on things ) and the two user names don't really seam as though they are frequent posters, although one has done more post than me.

Whoever started the discussion in the other thread about the tyres has a valid point, in my opinion (this is relevant to this thread, and I think, the prompt for this thread).
I think the run-flats are / may-be classed as a safety feature (depending on the insurance company), I don't think we disagree on this, picture this scenario: Someone gets a puncture and has to stop because of the puncture (they may not have a spare, due to original run-flats fitted), then an accident results from that (however it happens), the insurance would / could say "why didn't you pull in safely or continue" (run-flats), answer: "I removed them last week because I didn't like the way they handled" or "they were hard" or "I replaced the wheels and they didn't have run-flats" (you can see why and how an insurance company could and would use it (some models only have run-flats, no other option)) .

Adding the mods issue is a little different / complicated with the MINIs as there can be so many options to start off with (That's why a lot of people like them, but that's also where some can get into issues with the insurance (someone not normally into modding cars, but adds some to their MINI)), it used to be easy to spot if a car had any extras / mods fitted, eg a 1.4 LX meant a car had certain options whatever they may be, XR3I even though this was a well known sporty model people knew roughly what extras they had, (easy to spot any mods, and very easy to check) It's not the same with MINI's.

Quote: Originally Posted by South Shore Lad (original)

The way I understand it is that your car has an agreed value with standard kit/approved extras. If it's damaged/a total loss, they'll repair to original spec, or will replace with market value - again to the value of original spec. I'd have thought undeclared cosmetic mods won't affect the validity of a claim as such, it's just that the value of them won't be covered when it comes to replacement.

I'm just going to clarify a few points (this is all apart from big-bore exhausts, chips, racing mods etc... etc...).

Un-modified by an insurance means, as it was originally spec'd when originally supplied (IMO) .

Modified by an insurance means, any add-ons that change from the original un-modified, will be classed as a modification, inc cosmetic & anything that isn't classed as a standard replacement, including any genuine OEM add-ons or retrofits (IMO) .

The "approved extras" is this originally fitted or fitted after , "approved extras" means Genuine OEM extras to me, and if fitted after initial delivery it would be classed as a mod, whether it's a genuine or a cheap item / mod.

I'm not picking but your whole comment contradicts itself depending on how you look at it .

The "If it's damaged/a total loss, they'll repair to original spec, or will replace with market value - again to the value of original spec. I'd have thought undeclared cosmetic mods won't affect the validity of a claim as such, it's just that the value of them won't be covered when it comes to replacement.".

How this reads to me is:

If your cars worth £8,000 and you have £5,000 worth off un-declared mods, total: £13,000, your saying your insurance is going to say "you value your car at £13,000" all the figures as above, "here's £8,000, sorry, you never told us about the £5,000 worth of mods, tough", it doesn't work like that, they will just throw throw the claim out .

If you've had a aero-kit, spoiler, aero-spoiler, graphics fitted & not told the insurance, they're going to repair your car, but put a normal bumper on, not put the graphics back on, put 1 black plastic sill on, either no spoiler or a normal one, one seat (cloth), two 15in wheels (obviously all dependant on the damage) or say the original stuff is going to cost £2,000, your modded stuff is £5,000, they're going to say "give us £3,000 or we'll put the original stuff on, not the mods.", it doesn't work like that, they will just throw throw the claim out .

Or your car gets stolen & stripped of the full aero-kit, aero-spoiler, panels, leather-trim (you never told them about), they're going to put it back to standard or again pay the difference and we'll put your mods back on (the only reason it probably got stolen was because of the mods) and OK so they may never know (insurance), and you'll end up with a standard car , if you don't tell them (this would be classed as fraud), but what if the POLICE actually caught them with all the bits, how could you say that they were your bits without dropping yourself in it .

Even just bonnet stripes could add approx £200 on to the price of the repair of a bonnet if you got it damaged (removal of the old ones, replacement stripes & re-fitting) .

Or another cosmetic point, what if you just paint your car a pearlescent colour (flip colour) that's just cosmetic, but the financial complications if a car is damaged could be horrendous .

So as "supa-dupa-cooper" says you do need to tell them (even third party only), as they are covering you for the risk of any eventuality, if you don't tell them the full risk factor isn't taken into account and may get your claim thrown out .

Quote: Originally Posted by supa-dupa-cooper (original)

Insurance companies will do anything to get out of paying up

The rear spoiler/side skirts on my car were declared on insuring it....on renewal they denied knowledge of it, refused to reinsure the car and told me it hadnt really been insured properly.....they DO NEED to know, coz if ANYTHING happens they MAY NOT pay out...its just not worth it

All the actual risk factors will be calculated by a computer from previous claims, so all the added extras & factors will be calculated.

The actual act of adding extras such as graphics, kits, wheels, spoilers, etc... etc.. will usually tend to suggest that you are a Boy-Racer / Girl-Racer and you are more likely to be involved in an accident (again on normal cars MINIs are different, IMO), increasing your premium / risk factor.

Factory / dealer add-ons will also be calculated differently, a couple of examples.

Aero-kit, spoiler fitted properly will be different to ones fitted by someone else / yourself: If not fitted properly may / could fall off and cause an accident (spoiler, kit, falling off & causing a crash behind ).

Wired in mods, fitted properly will be different to ones fitted by someone else / yourself: If not fitted properly may / could cause a fire (wired in wrong, not tested or programmed in properly ).

What also needs to be remembered not all insurance policies are the same, not all insurance companies are the same & not everybody's circumstances will be the same (in an accident or claim), so what applies to one person wont apply to another, hence everybody will have different experiences and different reasons for claims being voided or problems that they have had with their insurance.

Even after-market wheels can be a pain when doing a repair (you often have to buy a new set just because one is damaged), either because no one actually knows what they are or where you can get replacements from (especially if the owner never actually purchased them), they are a dis-continued item, wheel manufacturers don't have the same restrictions as a car manufacturer has (they (car manu') have to make replacement parts, or provide some sort of parts service for a certain amount of time).

I have also stated in the past that insurance companies will pay / avoid paying out on certain circumstances and although it shouldn't make any difference at all, the following circumstances could (in my opinion), and also remember a lot of the insurance companies are linked together.

An Insurance company is responsible for both cars whoever the blame is on, both drivers can't / don't agree ("it was his / her fault", "no it was his / her fault" the evidence is a little unclear) is the insurance company going to suggest a long court case, or would they try and get both party's to try and agree on a compromise, or even try and throw a claim out (this is only IMO).

You have a crash, 100% not your fault, someone hit you, your insurance won't be that bothered unless they're covering the other car as well, so no matter what you have on your car it should be repaired by the third party's insurance no matter what, no matter what you have on it, as long as your insured .

You have a crash, your insurance is somehow liable, ie percentage claim (50:50, 25:75, 75:25), the other person turns out not to be insured , your insurance will then be 100% liable, you are actually found to be 100% responsible for the crash , even if the accident was 100% the third party's fault and you weren't covered by your insurance properly, they could blame you and say you shouldn't have been on the road and get out of paying up.

Also important to remember, we're not just talking about cars here, it's possible property damage, personal injury, hire cars, solicitor fees, doctor fees etc... etc..., some of these claims mount in to millions so again if they can throw a claim out they will again this could be dependent on circumstances (IMO).

Even if an accident isn't your fault your insurance will pay for everything 1st of all, providing your covered (fully comp, not voided), and then when everything is sorted out & all agreed who's fault it actually is, even if it's a percentage claim, then that's when the money is all sorted out, and believe me it doesn't always come down to who actually caused the accident, it comes down to who can word things right (someone getting nervous / confused, being in court could look like there lying, trying to make things up), say the right things, got the best solicitor (one who's noticed all your un-declared mods) etc... etc... so nothing is guaranteed.

After this post has been absorbed / ignored, I may do a post highlighting some reasons of why, insurance companies have thrown claims out, all true, and ones that I have had personal experience with or I actually know the person that has had the claim rejected, so it hasn't gone trough about 20 people (Chinese whispers).

"supa-dupa-cooper" If you're still with us, well done on the 10,000, you must have made about 150 post yesterday, I can't put any more winks or smiles in I've ran out ;-) (limited), or is that another user with a similar user name? (you'll know what I mean if it's you).

"South Shore Lad" we seem to have similar views on this and other subjects that I've seen you post on, we / I may have got our wires crossed eg 1+1=3, if you know what I mean.

I've had enough now this is getting posted, faults & everything included.

[supa-dupa-cooper]

Quote: Originally Posted by Randall Raines (original)

"supa-dupa-cooper" If you're still with us, well done on the 10,000, you must have made about 150 post yesterday, I can't put any more winks or smiles in I've ran out ;-) (limited), or is that another user with a similar user name? (you'll know what I mean if it's you).

Im still here, though I think ive just gone boggle-eyed reading that post

and yes it is me


Something else i'll add, not sure if its relevant or not is that most insurance companies have a major lack of understanding! Combine that with the customers lack of understanding and youve got a bit of a problem

Take the insurance on my car for example...after MINI refused to reinsure the car I went to Tesco for a quote (both underwritten by UK Insurance) he asked if the car was modified so I said yes and said to him about the spoiler/side skirts/decals.....he gave me a quote, but when I asked him to confirm what mods he'd put down he said 'side steps' So politely explained they were not side steps but side skirts This made the premium go up once he'd ticked the right box!

Same thing happened when I phoned MINI insurance for a quote on my new Dooper. I asked if I needed to declare the alloys as they are an 'upgrade' in the CHILI Pack.....for starters he had no idea what a CHILI pack was.....then had to ask his manager twice if it was ok! It was eventually decided that yes they were ok as they were still part of the pack!

Ive taken to going into the local insurance broker for my car insurance...its far far easier as your actually talking face to face with a human being!! You can see what they are typng into the computer, you can make them understand what youve got on the car (by showing them a pic if necessary ) and it can still all be organised on the spot, and you walk out of there with your insurance certificate. I believe also if anything happens and you need to make a claim, that they deal with it for you? And again samething applies, youve got a person to talk to face to face!

Just something else to think about

I wont be going back to call centres for my insurance, not after what has happened in the past!!

Wooo

[Hyper Active]

Well i disagree with those who are saying that replacing runflat tyres with normal tyres is a modification. This is just scare mungering .

[Restyle]

Quote: Originally Posted by Hyper Active (original)

Well i disagree with those who are saying that replacing runflat tyres with normal tyres is a modification. This is just scare mungering .

Look at it from an insurance companies point of view..
A car with runflats is less likely to crash if it hasa a blowout at high speed, than one where