I have read a few articles now on the subject and I agree with most of them, if you want a stripped down drivers car the the clio cup just (and only just) beats the S.
But if you want a stylish, fun design icon with near peerless driving characteristics....well there can be only one winner!
Comparing them both together id still go for the S, its built a lot more solid has that woderful whine of the charger, and the interior is a refreshing smack in the face compared to the dull look of the Clio...(apologies anyone with a Clio).....plus you get all the advantages of ABS etc etc that the Cup doesnt get...but i like the colour
I just cant get over just how much like a limpit the MINI S is compared to other cars
I think the S is a more complete car than the Clio. If I had just wanted a car that was quick I would have bought a CTR, but even that is a bit one dimensional in comparison with the S.
A large part of the appeal for me is the fact that the s is fairly quick and you can spec it up as much or as little as you want, so it can be anything from a B road racer to a small luxury car with leather, cruise etc. etc.
I would only ever change my S for another MINI.
On second thoughts MINI please make an equivalent to the CLio V6. But can I have a M3 straiught six in it please, oh go on then the V8 out of the M5.... 400bhp in a MINI,i am drooling already
I had a Clio 16V in the mid 90's - what a pile of b*llocks that was:
- 3 power steering pumps (the first 2 failed)
- It used 1 litre of oil every 1500 miles
- The plastic covers on the back of the headlamps used to regularly fall off into the fanbelt
- Really nasty fit and finish
- Tinny build quality
I bought it for it's dynamic qualities, which I have to admit were pretty good. however as an OWNERSHIP experience - It sucked for France.
It put me off Renaults for life, in the same way that ownership of a variety of British cars put me off them as well. It has to be German, or Japanese.
I have no problem with articles prefering the clio cup to the S, but it just depends what you're after.
As said above if I wanted a frantic, fast, raw car I would have gone for a Type-R but it just isn't me. I like my creature comforts
They should really be comparing the clio cup to the JCW as they're more in the same ballpark
MINI, RX8 and MX5 - Done those............. It's now TTime Unofficial MINI2.com bean counter
The JCW Kit will actually give you a power/wieght ratio close to the WRX STi and when i see one with my kitted up car, i'm gonna stick to him like $h1t to a blanket
************************************************** ****** Bit like if you want a track car Clio wins hands down according to the journo's If you want ultimate all round road car (IMO) MINI still has no serious competition hence my eagerly awaited arival of MCS 1/9/02 inspite of far too many niggles still being reported here!
Similar scenario with Elise 111s and Boxster. Elise is ultimate track car and a few thousand less than a Boxster 2.7 but the Boxster leaves the Elise for dead as a road car and isn't that far behind as a track star either
I would love to know how many of these boy racer type journo's, that rave about stripped out street legal racers, would actually part with there ££££'s to own one privately as every day transport. Good point well argued if I say so myself
Too many freaks not enough circuses
Tell a man that there are 400 billion stars and he'll believe you.
Tell him a bench has wet paint and he has to touch it.
Having had a 94 Renault 19 RSi as a company car, I will do my best to avoid Renaults from now on!
Dynamically it was a good car, but the number of electrical, trim and bodywork problems was ENORMOUS!
For instance, and the final straw, - one of the tailgate hinges BROKE OFF in my colleagues hand and ended up twisting the roof and cracking the windscreen because of the huge weight of the completely naff spoiler they had stuck on the bootlid... the sunroof only shut completely if you were going under 5mph, and like davep the headlight covers fell off and disappeared somewhere... the cambelt broke, the back seat base fell off, the dashboard appeared to be constructed out the plastic they use for model aircraft...
My friend at work recently traded his 172 in for a Clio V6 and he loves it. It really is an amazing car to look at whether you like it or not. Performance is special but not ballistic, its more of a constant power on delivery as you would expect from a large displacement engine. It sits very well on the road with very little body roll and has a solidness to it the 172 never had. Driven at the 7/10ths "limit" that some people seem to talk about, it beats the 172 handsdown.
Having said all that,
Its very twitchy in the rain. Driving even near the limit is tricky. Its not really a hot hatch, more of a grand tourer. Its about as practical as a push bike. Everything about it is expensive (itself, insurance, parts, tyres, etc.). Inside it looks almost the same as a 1.2 Clio. If a 172 and V6 are driven at the limit on a track there wouldn't be THAT much in it.
The V6 is a poseurs car, more of a style statement than an out and out racing car. It can be seriously tweaked to make it a true performance motor but overall its about looking good with a generous dollop of power. I'd imagine that most of the 400 RHD in the country are in collections and rarely driven. Probably there are about 100-150 in the UK that are actually used on a "daily" basis. This makes the car even more unique and desirable. Literally (and I have seen this) it turns more heads than some other cars 3 times its price (a bit like the new MINI! ).
Here are a few *FACTS* I've been collecting/calculating about the 172 and V6, Cooper S and JCW S:
Cooper S
Weight: 1065 (without driver) = 1140 - 75(std driver weight apparently)
BHP/ton: 153
JCW Cooper S
Speculation of course....
Weight: 1065 (without driver as above)
BHP/ton: 197 (based on 210bhp!!)
This kind of explains why the CooperS and *NEW* Clio 172 are so close in accelerative times but the new Cup and the *OLD* 172 are that little bit faster. But looking at the JCW S....
Now who's your daddy!
PS the information about Clio weights not including driver comes directly from Renault Customer Services, who I emailed about 4 months ago and came back with an answer 2 weeks ago.
My Volvo 440 Turbo has a Renault engine in it. And what a pile of crap it is, just over 100,000 miles on the clock and it's knackered. I would touch a Renault with a barge poll. You can't beat German engineering. I used to own a Golf and did a good 220,000 miles on it. And it's still going strong to this day. Now that was a well built car.
For those of you that haven't read the article in Autocar he does say that the Cooper S is the complete package.
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Clio 172 Cup Vs Cooper S 
hence my eagerly awaited arival of MCS 1/9/02 inspite of far too many niggles still being reported here!
replaced a 2001 BRG/White Cooper 
).
I used to own a Golf and did a good 220,000 miles on it. And it's still going strong to this day.
