Bigger Engine For MINI ???

[robinboyes]

What do you think the possibilities are of increasing the Engine size of the MINI to 1.8 ??
It seems quite obvious really but I wonder whether it would be possible with the current "pentagon" engine??

Does anyone know whether this is possible? It would mean better performance and tourque and it would be easier to squeeze more BHP out of for a "HOT" version, maybe even an Alpina version.

Anyone have any Info?

Cheers

[smiffy]

I thought Alpina were developing a 1.8 engine for the MINI

Or was it one of those dreams

[Ady]

As far as i am aware the current "tritec" engine in the MINI is the same as used in the chrysler neon, and these come in 2 litre flavour. Sadly i am also told that the gearbox won't take more than approx 140 bhp
But where there is a will there is a way.

Ady (R50)

[macncheese]

The 2.0L is in the US Neon and the 1.6 is in the Euro-Spec Neon.

http://www.allpar.com/mopar/rover.html


otherwise I'd be dropping the mini off here:

http://www.hahnracecraft.com


--
Cheese

[noahe]

I know your link provides this infor if you read closely enough, but the 2.0L engine in the Neon is not a Tritec engine.

The MINI engine and the Neon engines are the same in europe only. The North American Neons have a very capable 2.0L engine (I don't want to annoy Neon lovers, and a Neon is currently one of the fastest Sport Compact Cars in the craze over here) but it is an older design.

The complaints people have about the gravely, crunchy, tinny, noisy, fuel-sucking, unreliable Neon engines is a reflection of THAT engine (and the people that abuse them, because it is such a cheap car).

The Tritech may be the weakest link of the MINI, but it has to make that name for it's self.

Europeans, if YOU hate the Neon engine, then we can take that opinion as valid.

Personally, I rather liked the MINI engine, and I've had a 1.8L Honda VTEC in the Integra, and some peice of crap called a 2.2L Ecotech in the Sunfire.

[Addicted_to_S]

macncheese's URL about the Crysler/Rover Neon engine states:

Quote:

The webmaster of chryslertakeover.com noted: "The engine is used in Euro-spec Chrysler Neons, it's notable for being the first Chrysler to use a drive-by-wire throttle. (For what it's worth, this throttle set-up stinks on ice. It cannot react quickly enough to close the throttle blades, so the manual trans cars have almost no engine braking.) I haven't noticed this problem with the 5.7 Hemi, which will be the next to use drive-by-wire."

(http://www.allpar.com/mopar/rover.html )

Has anyone noticed poor engine breaking on their MINI?

It's also worth noting that in spite of no end of "problem posts" about rattles and build issues, there are damn few concerned with reliability or quality of these engines.

[noahe]

Quote:

Originally posted by Addicted_to_S
Has anyone noticed poor engine breaking on their MINI?

I have heard a couple of things on this site. One is that the ECU eases off on the throttle progresively to help the Catalytic converter do something and stay hot, which is good for some reason. By reducing revs slowly, or actually raising spark and fuel while engine braking, somehow there is reduced emmissions.

I also heard that the S lowers the revs slowly, and keeps the mix a bit rich, to avoid being blown over-lean by the supercharger. But this sounds odd, as the supercharger can open a sort of waste-gate, and recycle boosted air back into the intake, ahead of the intercooler. This closed-loop mode, allows the supercharger to run low, no, or moderate boost levels, with very little drag on the engine. But here too, the ECU is probably intervening.

I did drive the Cooper S in the snow, and didn't find it to be overly challenging. The conditions were REALLY slick, and I actually appreciated that if you let-off on the throttle too quickly, it wouldn't plow the front wheels. I didn't have any difficulty modulating my speed in the snow or on dry. Down-hill the engine provides much less engine-braking than I would have expected, but I chalked this up to it's being such a small engine... The old Mustang had loads of engine braking. You could actually drag the back tires if you let-up on it too quickly at high revs in a low gear.

[Addicted_to_S]

Quote:

...the supercharger can open a sort of waste-gate, and recycle boosted air back into the intake, ahead of the intercooler. This closed-loop mode, allows the supercharger to run low, no, or moderate boost levels, with very little drag on the engine.

I don't follow this exactly because the intercooler comes after the supercharger... But I think I get the point about the mixture being too lean.

- OK now I've found this was discussed before

Quote:

http://www.mini2.com/forum/showthrea...alve#post59745

and now on reading it again I think I understand what you were talking about this time around!

(Sorry to go off topic, but there again it us going to be hard to get a bigger engine in there, and the supercharger is essentially MINIs solution to the problem!)

[noahe]

Quote:

Originally posted by Addicted_to_S
I don't follow this exactly because the intercooler comes after the supercharger...

All I meant was that the recycled, boosted air goes back through the intercooler again, so it stays cool, or gets even cooler.

Quote:

Sorry to go off topic, but there again it us going to be hard to get a bigger engine in there, and the supercharger is essentially MINIs solution to the problem!)

Yep. Unless you want to bore out a Tritec to larger than 1.6L, I think you're done. Sure, that MINI Cooper SM3 has an I-6 from an M3 and RWD, but I don't think that is in the average persons' budget or technical ability.

I certainly don't know - but I would guess you'd be hard-pressed to significantly increase the Tritech's displacement by boring it out... And since anyone going to that extreme is probably going to opt for the bolt-on supercharger, then just how thin do you suppose the block and header could be, before the blower makes it blow-up?

I am also positive that someone, somewhere is going to make me eat my words, and put a modified 300 HP Honda 2.0L I-4 i-VTEC in one of these cars. But at great expense, with extensive modifications, and possibly not worth it in the end.

I am a great believer in a 'balanced' car. I actually think that the Cooper is the balanced car, and the Cooper S has got a little more than it needs - enough to get you into trouble. That said, the word 'supercharger' makes me all giddy, and I had to have the S. Silly really.

Okay, one thing I'd like to see. An all-aluminum block Tritec. That'd get the weight down in front. But maybe I only think I want a 50/50 weight distribution. Maybe the existing set-up is the best.

While we're on the subject, I think a 16v SOHC engine is fine. I'd also grab BMW's "Double Vanos" technology (like i-VTEC or VVT-i) because all those things sound so cool. But you can't have everything.

[batemano]

Quote:

While we're on the subject, I think a 16v SOHC engine is fine. I'd also grab BMW's "Double Vanos" technology (like i-VTEC or VVT-i) because all those things sound so cool. But you can't have everything.

I think that would make the engine a lot better, it might give it more mid-range pull, which it is currently lacking.