MINI Cooper S with John Cooper Works G_P Tuning Kit

[jimskater]

As to Jim Ray's "negativity"...

I'll give you my impression, from multiple phone conversations & e-mails. Trust me, Jim Ray's as excited about the car as any of us. I know that he and I are still looking for the :screaminglikealittlegirl: smiley. Both of us want more info--yesterday, if possible. That's where the frustration is coming from.

But enough of me speaking for Jim Ray. That's his job.

[Paul]

Quote: Originally Posted by AprilWhine

Is it true the 2006 JCW is 0-60 in 6.3 but the GP's time is 6.5?

I think we're confusing 0-60 with 0-62 maybe.

[The Red Baron]

Quote: Originally Posted by AlexF2003

Its only a special edition after all, not a new car.

Well said.
I feel their has been a lot of reverse snobbery directed towards those that intend to purchase the GP.

For me it is a very nice Works Mini that represents good value for money IMO. I have for a while wanted a JCW Cooper S and for me this is the easiest way of getting one while they are still around with the supercharger.

Everything I have seen about the new generation S with a turbo leads me to think that they will be no more powerful than the current standard S. Its also worth barring in mind that any JCW upgrades for the new model will not be available until at least a year or so after its release.

A lot has been said about the GP's build quality and where its being built. Well as Alex said its not a new model. I think people intending on purchasing the first of the new generation Mini should have more worries and concerns.

Weight and 0-60 times are not an issue with me, as you can only go so fast on UK roads and I don't intend to take it out on the track. Plus it will be the most powerful car I have ever owned, so 218 BHP will do fine for me.

[Wobert]

Quote: Originally Posted by chrisandjax

Well said.
I feel their has been a lot of reverse snobbery directed towards those that intend to purchase the GP.

For me it is a very nice Works Mini that represents good value for money IMO. I have for a while wanted a JCW Cooper S and for me this is the easiest way of getting one while they are still around with the supercharger.

Everything I have seen about the new generation S with a turbo leads me to think that they will be no more powerful than the current standard S. Its also worth barring in mind that any JCW upgrades for the new model will not be available until at least a year or so after its release.

A lot has been said about the GP's build quality and where its being built. Well as Alex said its not a new model. I think people intending on purchasing the first of the new generation Mini should have more worries and concerns.

Weight and 0-60 times are not an issue with me, as you can only go so fast on UK roads and I don't intend to take it out on the track. Plus it will be the most powerful car I have ever owned, so 218 BHP will do fine for me.

Paragraphs 2-5 I agree with all your comments.......especially paragraph 4.....I personally would never buy the first year's production of any car.....and that's from having worked in the product design/development side of the Automotive Industry!

The only bit I disagree with is paragraph 1.....

My logic all along (FWIW) has been that the GP is a damp squib in terms of it's "ultimate production MINI" title......yes it's the most powerful that is available directly from the factory, but as others have said, most powerful, doesn't mean, the best.....

There are flaws in the spec, which are totally at odds with the moniker, a/c, heavier Recaro seats, CD player etc......for there now to be an announcement that the weight saving isn't fully realised unless the a/c is deleted (when it's std on virtually 50% of the production run) is somewhat laughable.

This again adds fuel to the "marketing over engineering" hype that I've commented on in the past on this thread.

Perhaps for the last of the line MINI3 the engineers will produce a car worthy of the hype, a la BMW CSL, rather what appears to be purely a "marketing excercise"......

[LMB]

Quote: Originally Posted by Tonyt3

Whilst your comments are perfectly true and valid in terms of real world driving - they are not valid in terms of quoted, measured, publiscised data.

Tony 0 - 60 times only mean something to those who know nothing about cars. As Stu's mentioned it is 50 - 70 times that we should be concerned about. When I drove my Works, the first thing I noticed was that starting off it felt very similar to the S. However, once I hit 50, the extra grunt was really noticeable, great for overtaking and general everyday driving.

[Mikael]

I'll agree that the hard performance numbers are only worth so much. Different magazines will test cars and get numbers all over the place - occasionally quicker, usually slower than factory claims. So a grain of salt is always required and I think we all know that.

However, what raises the stakes is when those numbers are stirred by those nasty marketing folk. We all clamour to hear their offerings as they are usually the first source of (kinda-real) info because though it's not gospel, it's closer to the truth than whatever AutoExpress printed 2 years prior when the first whisper of a possible model was heard and they somehow already have pictures, figures for the gear-ratios, and times around the Ring.... You have to hope that while the marketing department may stretch and skew the truth a bit, they will be at least be basing it on some concreteness as they are, after all, representing the makers of the product.

But...sometimes they do screw up big time. When campaigns are centered around specific figures and those don't hold up upon release, people get ****ed. Rightfully so if they have put money down on this unseen vehicle. If you haven't seen it or driven it, those released numbers are all you have to go on so there's a lot of trust there to be kept or violated. It's particularly unfortunate when that sourness spoils what is still a good product.

Case in point: Yamaha's recent gaff with the 06 R6. Everyone went mental about the 17,500 redline. That figure was on the cover of every bike mag and all over Yamaha's site. Most were sold before delivery and then some people finally dynoed the thing and found "wait a minute, it says it is revving at 17,500 but it's actually barely above 16,000....." Yamaha blames it on "tachometer error" and appologizes, offers to buy back the bikes. Very dirty. Sadly but quite understandably, this put a huge dark cloud over the release despite the fact that the bike remains outstanding and could have easily been sold on its true merits. Mazda offered much the same experience for first-round buyers of the RX-8 when bhp figures proved to be inflated by about 10 bhp.

So anyway, it's not a big deal if a car weights 2600 lbs or 2650 lbs but it is a big deal if it weighs 2650 lbs and had been claimed to weigh 2600. And if the difference in our case is, in fact, due to the original numbers not including a/c, I cry foul. That's not much different from altering the tachs to appear to keep false promises. I guess my question now is if it was actually Mini that provided the source for the original figures of 80-100 lbs less or if it was just the magazines and all of us. If it wasn't going to really be significantly lighter, fine, it still would be worth the buy but give me back the rear seats as their deletion now seems pointless.

[LMB]

Quote: Originally Posted by Jim Ray

NON REFUNDABLE $2000 deposit. I believe that I can sell it on ebay in September for less of a loss than giving MINI USA $2000 because I was stupid enough to trust a publicity hype.

This weekend, I have to deliver my perfectly good 2005 MCS with rear seat delete and 15" wheels to her new owner.

Much worst, I am going to have to go back to NAM and apologise to all the people that I yelled at for slagging the GP.

Now, my phone is ringing, I have to go buy some magazine subscriptions, penny stock, and silver certificates from a nice fireman helping out for charity.

Why the change of heart Jim? The manual only advises not taking the Mini through a Car Wash in case the Spoiler gets rip off. Which has happened with the Cooper S spolier I may add (do a search).

Folks need to take this car at face value. Ok so it's being heavily Marketed as some lighweight racer, but if you wade through the ********, you will see a car that is actually good value for money.

[Rakey]

Quote: Originally Posted by Goonery

Not really, the 0-60 times are very subjective and are dependent on a whole host of variable factors not least who is driving. I think 30-60 or 50-70 is more useful as that is where most people use it when overtaking safely . Who the hell does 0-60 sprints in everyday motoring anyway

Rakey need not answer this post

spoil sport

[Joogle]

I think the problem is not with the car but with the information (Or more importantly lack of) doing the rounds.

The rumor mill set in early on and everyones expectations were of a monster MINI radically different to the standard offerings - look at the comments on this thread for example. And that seems to be most peoples concern/complaint about what has been happening.

Everyone is going to have a different opinion of the car based upon what they have seen or heard. Your going to love it or hate it.

From my point of view I love the looks, the equipment level is about right for the money (Although Its getting a glovebox the moment it arrives....) The performance, well 240BHP would have been nice considering where the opposition are going, but what the hell 218BHP as long as its usable is not putting me off.

As long as it makes the commute to work a little bit more fun and it gets me through until the new S arrives then hey, guess what I will be happy.

[mikeythemini]

Well after agonising for ages, I have done it
I have cancelled my order

[LMB]

Quote: Originally Posted by mikeythemini

Well after agonising for ages, I have done it
I have cancelled my order

Keeping what you've got?

[Damo]

Quote: Originally Posted by mikeythemini

Well after agonising for ages, I have done it
I have cancelled my order

Sorry mate, but it makes sense

[macmini]

all of the 2000 gp's are built and right now they're being transported from bertone to munich!
a friend of mine took this picture yesterday in munich at a place where bmw is hosting new cars before they are being carried to local dealers and so on...

[zstkng]

Quote: Originally Posted by -Macmini-

...and still bmw says delivery week 29 or 30 of juli

how are mini processing these orders?
i'm number 520 and expeting delivery in week 2 of august and im in the u.k too and then numer 820 (i forget) gets delivered in germany in july?
strange IMO.
You'll have to let me know how it is seen as ur gettin urs first macmini

[zstkng]

whats the white tihng down the door of the 2nd mini gp on the photo and why are the back windows of the first gp lighter than the other. , this could be me just been tired .

and the wheels are different? i thought they were black?