[motaica]

In the last post about rear wheel drive conversion, when i was asking for the rear wheel drive conversion, i was actually heading in the 4 wheel drive direction, what i wanted to know is if it could be converted to 4 wheel drive, but since the car has no space for a driveshaft, then 4 wheel drive would be out of the question. Forget about the space for the longitudinally placed engine, i already have a solution for that, but if you could remove the muffler and all that piping, would there be space for a driveshaft?

A 4 wheel drive MINI would have really good handling, and connected to a good engine would be the best car to drive. I just want feedback if it can be done, and if it would be expensive.

thanks,
motaica

[GordonD]

Put another engine in the back seat - that's what they did last time.

On a more serious note it is a pain to get a 'crossways' engine to turn power through 90 degrees to drive a shaft to the rear wheels. Obviously not impossible but you would want to design it that way from day 1.

[goin440]

I imagine anything is possible if you got the cash flow. Not to denounce MINIs, but if you are going to spend that kind of cash, why not look into a Mitsu EVO or WRX STi? Heck, with what you could save on the latter, you could make a mean little car.

I agree with Gordon that it should have been designed from day 1. As for ideas, consider an example I read a while back: the Audi TT 4wd drive-train graphed into a Beetle w/ twin turbo vr6 GTI implant. Cost, if I recall, was upwards $200 thou. But the TT and Beetle use extremely similar chassis. The MINI has no such twin, so everything would be custom fabbed and very expensive. The back-seat engine idea is pretty good too. I've heard stories of V-dubs in europe with twin-engined GTIs. I do know there is a racing MINI in Europe with an M3 engine. Tube-framed and very custom.

Maybe eventually BMW will realize the Mini had a rally heritage and produce a WRC competitor. We could only be so lucky.... (please, please, please, please...)

[sniece]

Oh man, if Mini release a 4WD model, I would be in heaven. I've had two AWD Subaru's previous to my Mini. The Mini is the only car I would give up AWD for. My wife is the same way, she drives a Lada Niva...4WD. If they really wanted to resurrect the Mini as a world class Rally car, it would have to be 4WD. Mmmmm, imagine the handling like the Mini has now PLUS AWD?!?!?!

Steve

[skobylenski]

If Subaru can get AWD into the WRX and Honda can get it into the CR-V, the I should think Mini could do it as well. It might be a little tricky, but both other manufacturers use side mount engines and seem to get power to all 4 wheels with no problem. I think it's just a matter of time before we see this one. Personally I can't wait to see it, and I'll be all over it Autocrossing with an AWD Mini, now that's something I'd be in heaven with.

Scott

[sniece]

I dunno, the Subaru engines are all longitudinally mounted, I'm not sure about the CRV, but I would assume it's the same way...although they do make a FWD version, and Subaru's used to be available both ways...similarly for VW. Just strikes me that the gearing required to get the drive to the rear wheels based on the current configuration might be difficult...I would imagine you would have to drive the center diff from the front differential if you kept it transversely mounted.

Steve

[olerud400]

WRC is out of the question because the Mini is too small...

[jester]

They race 4WD and 4WS minis in the top class Ice raceing series, using a 400bhp, mid mounted V6. Now that tickeles my belly.

[smith]

How about a 4wd taking a page from the Honda Hybrid. Put a bigger battery in the boot with electric rear wheel drive giving the possibility of 4wd and electric rear wheel drive - battery charged when braking. In most cases you don't need 4wd but it would be there when you need it

[BruceK]

VW made special 4 wheel drive versions of the Golf in addition to the normal front wheel drive models. Some them were a little too "off road" for my tastes. Here's a '91 Golf Syncro:

[sniece]

Wow, that looks pretty cool! Kind of a predecesor to my old Subaru Outback Sport. It also reminds me of an older Jaguar Sovereign that someone here in Hamilton turned into a monster truck. They actually did a really good job of it too.

Steve

[Dark Silver S]

Go the NASCAR route. Get your favorite AWD chassis and drop a MINI-lookalike body over it.

I have seen photos of classic Minis with V8s in the back seat. I'm assuming that they used a different drivetrain as well as a different engine.

[sniece]

Check out the latest issue of Mini Magazine. There's a guy who took a '99 (?) Mini and dropped a JDM spec Type R engine and transmission into it. 240hp. Eat your heart out JCW owners!

Steve

[JonnyThong]

There is a guy rallying a new cooper in the british clubman series with a 4x4 setup, you wouldn't know from the outside. a picture of the car was in motorsports now! an RAC MSA publication...

[Harry@Piekarnia]

For the kind of cash you'd need to spend to get a 4x4 MINI on the road you could buy a Tiger z100wr. Twin engines, 4x4 and in road legal form it does 0-60mph in 41 metres (2.8 seconds is another way of looking at it!)

[sniece]

Part of the transverse engine bay/longitudinal engine requirement just got solved by Peugot. Their new 307 WRC car has just such a setup, IIRC, there's a bevel gear that heads out of the front dif to drive the rear wheels. Came across that on Crash.net in the WRC section, talking about the unveiling of the new car.

Steve

[996GT3]

Excuse me but... why a 4x4 Mini?
For a compact car like Mini the front traction is good, and then the power is not enough to wish more traction.
I hate 4x4, for me is the opposite of enjoy driving: too much grip is not fun!
I love rear traction instead, the only true for a sport and expensive car.
For example, a Porsche 911 Carrera4 or Turbo are not fun like a Carrera 2, GT3 or GT2 and a BMW 330i is more charming than 330iX.
I will not use ASC+T or DSC in my Mini because i like to control and drifting the car myself, differently you can buy a SUV.

For technical question, more 4x4 in Europe are made with transversal engine: Audi S3, Golf R32, old Lancia Delta Integrale, ecc.
But the best application if you want a 4x4 is the longitudinal engine like Impreza STI or Lancer EVO.

In my club many drivers with MIni, Peugeot 106 Rallie, Clio Williams or Rs, Saxò 16V, Integra or Civic Type R are often more fast in the street than STI, Escorth Cosworth and EVO VII. At least in dry and low speed street.

[midlife mini]

Quote: Originally Posted by olerud400

WRC is out of the question because the Mini is too small...

I would be interested for a Rule Quote to support the above Statement ( I've read Through Rules Section 2 and Appendix J). I am hearing rumours that WRC is being looked at with a 4x4 2.0 Turbo.

[rasp]

Quote: Originally Posted by midlife mini

I would be interested for a Rule Quote to support the above Statement ( I've read Through Rules Section 2 and Appendix J). I am hearing rumours that WRC is being looked at with a 4x4 2.0 Turbo.

Yeh! and my granny's got a V8 pacemaker

[midlife mini]

Quote: Originally Posted by rasp

Yeh! and my granny's got a V8 pacemaker

Sometimes Rasp if you have nothing constructive to say, it's best to say nothing