[Paul]

Quote: Originally Posted by Monkeyhanger

Is there a definite date for the new engines yet? - Want a convertible but gonna wait for new engine.

Not that Ive got, nothing set in stone, and don't expect official news for a VERY long time!

[LMB]

I personally hope they keep the Supercharger - it's just gives this car so much character.

[Pritch]

Quote: Originally Posted by Paul Mullett

Not that Ive got, nothing set in stone, and don't expect official news for a VERY long time!

My 'list' is showing a start of production for the new Prince engines at the end of 2006 - which would mean car sales starting in early 2007 (roughly!)

But the same list also shows some of the new engines going into the old R50 model - which sounds strange if the new engine is supposed to sit lower in the engine bay...

[Paul]

Quote: Originally Posted by Pritch

My 'list' is showing a start of production for the new Prince engines at the end of 2006 - which would mean car sales starting in early 2007 (roughly!)

But the same list also shows some of the new engines going into the old R50 model - which sounds strange if the new engine is supposed to sit lower in the engine bay...

I'm not convinced that list is correct from quite recent discussions. It's not far off though. I'm wondering if a 1.9 version they're making (I hear) for the PSA group cars will just "drop in" to the MINI range. That would be handy!

[DaillestChoP]

Hi, i haven't posted here for a very long while but i would like to share my thoughts. I hear the current engine is admired by many, but in reality, as far as price is concerned and the MCS's competition, im sure BMW can do far better than the measly 165hp. The chassis obviously can handle well over 250hp. Dont beleive me? Check out the Top Gear review of the MCS Works ED. and other tuner models, especially the BBR275. Im am not proposing a 270+hp engine for the future model, but the potential is there as it shows it can handle that kind of power. What i am ultimatly gettin at is that i would like to see a twin-cam 1.6L w/ supercharger or turbo with at least 190-200hp, that would surely spice things up a bit and make those 25 or so thousand dollars seem a bit more rewardingly spent. If i were to spend the amount of money the MCS is worth, I would expect to crush the competition in its class (see Civic si, Mazdaspeed Protege, SRT-4, SVT Focus and Sentra Se-R Spec-V, just to name a few) rather than the other way around.

[Guanche]

I really think people fuzz too much over the engine: its a 1.6 non-turbo that delivers consistently 170+ hp on the dyno, an engine people abuse by installing shorter pulleys and remapping ECU's to make 200+ hp... and still an engine that doesnt (as far as I know ) break down, what else do we want?

[Paul]

The engine is indeed pretty bullet proof, cant argue with that!

[jazmini]

After going through all these posts, I'm pretty pumped about this new engine. Wow -- a BMW designed engine -- that's impressive. Built in house for quality control. Turbo -- with minimal turbo lag. Much lighter weight than current models. 140 hp on MC with 170 on MCS -- that's only 30 hp added for the turbo, so with that small a turbo, the lag should indeed by minimal, especially with BMW's new design with reduced lag. So, much higher hp is possible. People having driven prototypes and giving it a thumbs up. All this is good! I want one!

[badboyzbadboyz]

Quote: Originally Posted by jazmini

... with 170 on MCS -- that's only 30 hp added for the turbo, so with that small a turbo, the lag should indeed by minimal

I can't see how the new engine will only have 170 bhp with all this hype. Seen as MINI have now increased the bhp from 163-170 I would expect the new engine to give 185-195 bhp. At the moment the MCS is behind in the hatchback bhp war and BMW will be aware of this and will want the MCS to be right up there with the new engine ... I would have thought.

[usaminicooper]

May have been already in this thread: found this in BMW site this may be the source of the new engine Paul:


The decision to build a new engine plant in Hams Hall, England, was made by BMW at the end of 1996. The plant opened in February 2001.

Hams Hall is the BMW Group's motor competence centre responsible for manufacturing a newly developed generation of BMW 4-cylinder gasoline motors with VALVETRONIC technology. How does this patented process work? The principle behind VALVETRONIC is the variable valve stroke. It takes over the task of the throttle, rendering the latter obsolete. The result is an engine that breathes freely, saves fuel, and generates ca. 40 percent less emissions.

Hams Hall and its round 650 employees is the sole supplier of this engine type – which has a cubic capacity of between 1.6 and 2.0 litres – to other BMW plants.


Engine production

Hams Hall plant - success in 4-cylinders
(PDF, 2.3 MB).

www.bmw-plant-hamshall.com

Visit our website.

[Aniawn]

I'm getting worried about the new engine for the MINI. Not that it will be of the same or better quality over the current engine, rather I am worried about the lack in engine improvements in horsepower and what not. If there are aftermarket superchargers for the MCS that can greatly improve the horsepower of the MCS over the JCW while at the same time costing around the same amount (+/- 1k). Would it not seem to be in BMW best interest to give MCSs with the new engine a greater increase in horse power, say 190-200? I am aware that the new MCS will be turbo charged, but still, I'd expect a greater increase in overall horsepower in the MCS, not jut the MC, as seen in the production list for the new engines.

[carlosthe jackal]

A refresh for the diesel may well be needed by 2006 - are we to look to PSA again?

Lets hope so!

[Nev]

The PSA engines are much complimented in the press. There will be no problem with them in the Mini. BMW engines are also excellent, and have won the international engine award more than once in the past few years, and always have nominations for different catergories.

Every recent BM engined car I have driven has been very very impressive. Even the 1.8 petrol in the 3 series produces 150 bhp, (naturally aspirated) and with innovations like valvetronic, they beat other rival engines hands down. The M3 is truly amazing, and the 330 D is also brill, and that was the older one I drove, not the new one with over 200bhp.

I have yet to drive a new 535 d, but apparently it really is mega, 0-60 in 6.5, 160mph, or something silly like that, and this is the same twin stage turbocharging that will go into the mini. By the time it gets to the mini the tech will be even better and well refined.
I agree it will be a shame to lose the supercharger whine, but Mini wil think of something else for us to listen to.

Everyone was worried about how the mini was going to turn out, and it ended up great. I am sure the new one will be the same as well.

One more boring point. (Sorry Paul, please don't pull this!!) Merc are likely to drop superchargers and go for turbos for the next generation of engines....

Nev.

[badboyzbadboyz]

Quote: Originally Posted by Nev

The PSA engines are much complimented in the press. There will be no problem with them in the Mini. BMW engines are also excellent, and have won the international engine award more than once in the past few years, and always have nominations for different catergories.

Every recent BM engined car I have driven has been very very impressive. Even the 1.8 petrol in the 3 series produces 150 bhp, (naturally aspirated) and with innovations like valvetronic, they beat other rival engines hands down. The M3 is truly amazing, and the 330 D is also brill, and that was the older one I drove, not the new one with over 200bhp.

I have yet to drive a new 535 d, but apparently it really is mega, 0-60 in 6.5, 160mph, or something silly like that, and this is the same twin stage turbocharging that will go into the mini. By the time it gets to the mini the tech will be even better and well refined.
I agree it will be a shame to lose the supercharger whine, but Mini wil think of something else for us to listen to.

Everyone was worried about how the mini was going to turn out, and it ended up great. I am sure the new one will be the same as well.

But BMW aren't making the new engine ..... Peugeot are.

[Nev]

Yes, but plenty of the design will be done by BMW. Peugeot should be more than capable of making the engine. Component sharing, manufacturers making things for others happens all the time. I might be badly mistaken, but I am sure quite a few Porsche body panels are stamped out by BMW. Porsche did the design work though.

Nev.

[badboyzbadboyz]

Quote: Originally Posted by Nev

Yes, but plenty of the design will be done by BMW. Peugeot should be more than capable of making the engine. Component sharing, manufacturers making things for others happens all the time. I might be badly mistaken, but I am sure quite a few Porsche body panels are stamped out by BMW. Porsche did the design work though.

Nev.

But the engine itself is going to be designed and built by Peugeot. If BMW were making it then I think there would be some very happy MINI owners, because of the great engines they have already produced, but that isn't the case. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure Peugeot will do a good job and BMW will have some input on the engine but maybe we should be looking at what Peugeot have designed already to give us a good idea what to expect rather than looking at BMW powerplants.

[Nev]

Lets hope BM have plenty of input! The other thing to consider is that some of the PSA engines are are not exactly current generations, whereas hopefully the new one will be a bang up to date. Many of the current BM engines are new generation so hopefully this stuff will be incorperated in the design.

I agree with what you say about the hatch war though. Power just keeps getting higher and higher!

Nev.

[eltel]

Quote: Originally Posted by Nev

Yes, but plenty of the design will be done by BMW. Peugeot should be more than capable of making the engine. Component sharing, manufacturers making things for others happens all the time. I might be badly mistaken, but I am sure quite a few Porsche body panels are stamped out by BMW. Porsche did the design work though.

Nev.

I thought that some of the MINI panels were manufactured by Ford.

[Paul]

Quote: Originally Posted by badboyzbadboyz

But the engine itself is going to be designed and built by Peugeot. If BMW were making it then I think there would be some very happy MINI owners, because of the great engines they have already produced, but that isn't the case. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure Peugeot will do a good job and BMW will have some input on the engine but maybe we should be looking at what Peugeot have designed already to give us a good idea what to expect rather than looking at BMW powerplants.

The engines are being jointly developed by BMW and PSA, mostly by BMW. The engines for the MINI will be built at Hamms Hall, by BMW.

[Paul]

I forgot to add this to this post last night: http://www.mini2.com/news/news273.html