MINI2

Dutchy · Jun 2nd, 2004, 02:08 AM

I was reading a car report on the 'Cars Guide' web site here in Aus, and it was detailing the new Convertible. It then went on to report 'Upcoming variants'. Here is an excerpt:
"We could also see other variations of the car including an all-wheel drive model in the not too distant future."
What tha? I did a quick search, but didn't find anything here on MINI2. Does someone have more info on this? Paul?

Cheers

Dutchy.

nonsequitur · Jun 2nd, 2004, 02:35 AM

The new platform (2006/07) may offer all kinds of interesting future variants.

The history of the classic Mini, as well as success of the new MINI, is built around very effective front wheel drive (FWD). It may depend on what is eventually decided about MINI competition, and then what is needed to win. FWD may emerge in a competitive formula that can be used to prove the engineering in the car, which is what would then be done.

All wheel drive (AWD) works. As an "Audi guy", I'll say there is no question that the "Unfair Advantage" was real in the mid-80s when variants of the Quattro, Sport Quattro, and the over-the-top versions for Pikes Peak so dominated rally.

Dutchy · Jun 2nd, 2004, 02:43 AM

Personally I would love to see a Cooper S with AWD. This would definitely bring down the 0-100kms/hr times, although there would be added weight

A JCW MCS with AWD? Besides a lot of acronyms, it would be a potent package.

caminifan · Jun 2nd, 2004, 02:56 AM

Added weight would be minimal. The Haldex AWD system on S60 and S80 Volvo sedans adds only 170 lbs. The Haldex system is arguably the state of the art of AWD at the present time.

Ian Clark · Jun 2nd, 2004, 03:27 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by Dutchy

Personally I would love to see a Cooper S with AWD. This would definitely bring down the 0-100kms/hr times, although there would be added weight

A JCW MCS with AWD? Besides a lot of acronyms, it would be a potent package.

Heh imagine,

A BRG/W JCS AWD, DSC, ASC+T + MFSW

Dutchy · Jun 2nd, 2004, 04:23 AM

It's a nightmare just thinking about it - but one I would personally put money down for. Not to take anything away from my MCS, but if there was an AWD version, I would get it.

Mr_You · Jun 3rd, 2004, 04:12 AM

I'm not talking about doing a conversion...

but given the current size of the mini, is it even possible to add AWD to a car the size of the mini?

Will the next-gen platform require a longer wheel base? Given the rumors of a 5 door wagon, will they offer two wheel bases from the same platform or two platforms?

Questions, questions, any guess?

Mr_You · Jun 3rd, 2004, 04:22 AM

Also, I imagine if they go with the haldex system this will enable BMW/Mini to use a sequential gear box. With AWD distributed 40% Front 60% Rear, this would be a really fun car if they keep close to the current wheel base and the weight wasn't too bad. Definitely require more power: turbo.

Dutchy · Jun 3rd, 2004, 04:52 AM

I would expect quite a lot of body modifications needed to support AWD, and the rear suspension would need re-doing.
But if they build it, they will come! (and maybe buy

).
I'd tick the box for the BMW SMG

Dutchy.

caminifan · Jun 3rd, 2004, 06:26 AM

Haldex AWD could be integrated without changing the wheelbase. Check the VW R32 as an example (base Golf is transformed into an R32 with no change in wheelbase). There would be some modifications to the chassis to fit the AWD hardware; maybe that is part of the 2007 model changes.... As was previously posted, weight gain would be on the order of 170 lbs. for the Haldex AWD components

Mr_You · Jun 3rd, 2004, 06:15 PM

I can't find the exact numbers, but from what I can tell, the VW R32 has a longer wheel base than the current mini. So it doesn't really indicate to me that an AWD system would fit in a mini with the current wheel base. So my thinking is they will have to extend the wheel base a bit. The short wheel base is probably the number one attraction for me.

Dutchy · Jun 3rd, 2004, 10:00 PM

I'm not too sure why the wheelbase would have to be extended. Wouldn't the rear drive shaft just be shorter to accommodate the rear diff and IRS?
I guess one question I have: is the centre tunnel big enough to hold a drive shaft, with the exhaust being located elsewhere?

caminifan · Jun 3rd, 2004, 10:45 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by Dutchy

I'm not too sure why the wheelbase would have to be extended. Wouldn't the rear drive shaft just be shorter to accommodate the rear diff and IRS?

You have got it! If the wheelbase is shorter, you just shorten the drive shaft.

If the body needs modification to accommodate a rear drive shaft along with the exhaust, I would imagine that would be included in the 2007 model run.

Jun 3rd, 2004, 10:48 PM

I heard a rumor (can't say where from) that there is a possibility they may fit BMW X-drive to the MINI, in order to compete in WRC, etc. I have also heard there may be a 4 door vairant, and MINI pickup variant in the future...who knows when. AWD would be sweet though, I'm really missing it, as my last car (Stealth TT) was AWD.

Dutchy · Jun 4th, 2004, 12:21 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by CLiVE

I heard a rumor (can't say where from) that there is a possibility they may fit BMW X-drive to the MINI, in order to compete in WRC.......

CLiVE,
This would be a very interesting concept, one which I wouldn't say no to. A question though. Isn't the WRC a 2ltr engine class? Then this would mean the MINI would have to come with a new 2ltr engine when it upgrades the engine.
Once again - I wouldn't say no

Dutchy.

Jun 4th, 2004, 01:56 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by Dutchy

CLiVE,
This would be a very interesting concept, one which I wouldn't say no to. A question though. Isn't the WRC a 2ltr engine class? Then this would mean the MINI would have to come with a new 2ltr engine when it upgrades the engine.
Once again - I wouldn't say no

Dutchy.

Again just a rumor. Who know if it will ever hit production.
I wouldn't say no either, and would very happily upgrade to an AWD Mini. It would most likely mean a new 2ltr engine as well..

Dave&Stacy · Jun 4th, 2004, 12:46 PM

AWD Mini? Looks like Stacy and I might have to make the move to Open class in a few years. :-)

Boo · Jun 14th, 2004, 12:31 PM

I would put my money down now if they decided to bring out a nicely powered (say 200KW) AWD Mini... that would be soooooo sweet...

Grumbler · Jun 17th, 2004, 07:56 PM

hmm, i was just thinking this the other day.

i wouldnt want to see a system similar to the volvo system, audi style is far more effective...........they actually ran a comparison about 2+ ago on the two systems and although both were effective during slip conditions, the audi was able to handle faster and cleaner than the volvo.......

now as i understand it, and i could be seriously wrong here, the volvo ran fwd until it started to slip, then applied power to the rear. the audi ran power to all wheels all the time.

of course this is all a long time ago.

wouldnt mind seeing it, but is there any more room in the present mini for a larger engine????

caminifan · Jun 18th, 2004, 04:44 AM

If the Volvo AWD system that was reviewed was not the Haldex system, then the review was of an older version AWD. Haldex is currently the state of the art in AWD. Check out the following URL for info on Haldex: http://www.haldex-traction.com/default.htm

Jun 2nd, 2004, 02:08 AM	#1
Dutchy MINI2 Regular Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Nelson Bay N.S.W Local Time: 10:15 AM Posts: 334 Offline	All wheel drive MINI? I was reading a car report on the 'Cars Guide' web site here in Aus, and it was detailing the new Convertible. It then went on to report 'Upcoming variants'. Here is an excerpt: "We could also see other variations of the car including an all-wheel drive model in the not too distant future." What tha? I did a quick search, but didn't find anything here on MINI2. Does someone have more info on this? Paul? Cheers Dutchy. Sadly INIMINI is gone, but never forgotten.

Jun 2nd, 2004, 02:35 AM	#2 (permalink)
nonsequitur Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Seattle area, WA Local Time: 04:15 PM Posts: 1,466 Offline	The new platform (2006/07) may offer all kinds of interesting future variants. The history of the classic Mini, as well as success of the new MINI, is built around very effective front wheel drive (FWD). It may depend on what is eventually decided about MINI competition, and then what is needed to win. FWD may emerge in a competitive formula that can be used to prove the engineering in the car, which is what would then be done. All wheel drive (AWD) works. As an "Audi guy", I'll say there is no question that the "Unfair Advantage" was real in the mid-80s when variants of the Quattro, Sport Quattro, and the over-the-top versions for Pikes Peak so dominated rally. '02 MINI Cooper CVT (prod. date: 6/12/2002; Indi Blue/Black roof, R-81 7-hole 15x5.5" or NZO 16x6.5") '67 Austin Cooper S 1275 Mk1 (build date: 6/26/1967; Tartan Red/Black Roof, Minilite 10x4.5" or 10x6.0")

Jun 2nd, 2004, 02:43 AM	#3 (permalink)
Dutchy MINI2 Regular Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Nelson Bay N.S.W Local Time: 10:15 AM Posts: 334 Offline	Personally I would love to see a Cooper S with AWD. This would definitely bring down the 0-100kms/hr times, although there would be added weight A JCW MCS with AWD? Besides a lot of acronyms, it would be a potent package. Sadly INIMINI is gone, but never forgotten.

Jun 2nd, 2004, 04:23 AM	#6 (permalink)
Dutchy MINI2 Regular Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Nelson Bay N.S.W Local Time: 10:15 AM Posts: 334 Offline	It's a nightmare just thinking about it - but one I would personally put money down for. Not to take anything away from my MCS, but if there was an AWD version, I would get it. Sadly INIMINI is gone, but never forgotten.

Jun 3rd, 2004, 04:52 AM	#9 (permalink)
Dutchy MINI2 Regular Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Nelson Bay N.S.W Local Time: 10:15 AM Posts: 334 Offline	I would expect quite a lot of body modifications needed to support AWD, and the rear suspension would need re-doing. But if they build it, they will come! (and maybe buy ). I'd tick the box for the BMW SMG Dutchy. Sadly INIMINI is gone, but never forgotten.

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Jun 2nd, 2004, 02:56 AM	#4 (permalink)
caminifan MINI2 Regular Join Date: Mar 2004 Local Time: 03:15 PM Posts: 56 Offline	Added weight would be minimal. The Haldex AWD system on S60 and S80 Volvo sedans adds only 170 lbs. The Haldex system is arguably the state of the art of AWD at the present time.

Jun 2nd, 2004, 03:27 AM	#5 (permalink)
Ian Clark MINI2 Master Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Liverpool, UK Local Time: 12:15 AM Posts: 1,769 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by Dutchy Personally I would love to see a Cooper S with AWD. This would definitely bring down the 0-100kms/hr times, although there would be added weight A JCW MCS with AWD? Besides a lot of acronyms, it would be a potent package. Heh imagine, A BRG/W JCS AWD, DSC, ASC+T + MFSW

Jun 3rd, 2004, 04:12 AM	#7 (permalink)
Mr_You MINI2 Newbie Join Date: May 2004 Local Time: 07:15 PM Posts: 11 Offline	I'm not talking about doing a conversion... but given the current size of the mini, is it even possible to add AWD to a car the size of the mini? Will the next-gen platform require a longer wheel base? Given the rumors of a 5 door wagon, will they offer two wheel bases from the same platform or two platforms? Questions, questions, any guess?

Jun 3rd, 2004, 04:22 AM	#8 (permalink)
Mr_You MINI2 Newbie Join Date: May 2004 Local Time: 07:15 PM Posts: 11 Offline	Also, I imagine if they go with the haldex system this will enable BMW/Mini to use a sequential gear box. With AWD distributed 40% Front 60% Rear, this would be a really fun car if they keep close to the current wheel base and the weight wasn't too bad. Definitely require more power: turbo.

Jun 3rd, 2004, 06:26 AM	#10 (permalink)
caminifan MINI2 Regular Join Date: Mar 2004 Local Time: 03:15 PM Posts: 56 Offline	Haldex AWD could be integrated without changing the wheelbase. Check the VW R32 as an example (base Golf is transformed into an R32 with no change in wheelbase). There would be some modifications to the chassis to fit the AWD hardware; maybe that is part of the 2007 model changes.... As was previously posted, weight gain would be on the order of 170 lbs. for the Haldex AWD components

Jun 3rd, 2004, 06:15 PM	#11 (permalink)
Mr_You MINI2 Newbie Join Date: May 2004 Local Time: 07:15 PM Posts: 11 Offline	I can't find the exact numbers, but from what I can tell, the VW R32 has a longer wheel base than the current mini. So it doesn't really indicate to me that an AWD system would fit in a mini with the current wheel base. So my thinking is they will have to extend the wheel base a bit. The short wheel base is probably the number one attraction for me.

Jun 3rd, 2004, 10:00 PM	#12 (permalink)
Dutchy MINI2 Regular Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Nelson Bay N.S.W Local Time: 10:15 AM Posts: 334 Offline	I'm not too sure why the wheelbase would have to be extended. Wouldn't the rear drive shaft just be shorter to accommodate the rear diff and IRS? I guess one question I have: is the centre tunnel big enough to hold a drive shaft, with the exhaust being located elsewhere? Sadly INIMINI is gone, but never forgotten.

Jun 3rd, 2004, 10:45 PM	#13 (permalink)
caminifan MINI2 Regular Join Date: Mar 2004 Local Time: 03:15 PM Posts: 56 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by Dutchy I'm not too sure why the wheelbase would have to be extended. Wouldn't the rear drive shaft just be shorter to accommodate the rear diff and IRS? You have got it! If the wheelbase is shorter, you just shorten the drive shaft. If the body needs modification to accommodate a rear drive shaft along with the exhaust, I would imagine that would be included in the 2007 model run.

Jun 3rd, 2004, 10:48 PM	#14 (permalink)
CLiVE Posts: n/a	I heard a rumor (can't say where from) that there is a possibility they may fit BMW X-drive to the MINI, in order to compete in WRC, etc. I have also heard there may be a 4 door vairant, and MINI pickup variant in the future...who knows when. AWD would be sweet though, I'm really missing it, as my last car (Stealth TT) was AWD.

Jun 4th, 2004, 12:21 AM	#15 (permalink)
Dutchy MINI2 Regular Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Nelson Bay N.S.W Local Time: 10:15 AM Posts: 334 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by CLiVE I heard a rumor (can't say where from) that there is a possibility they may fit BMW X-drive to the MINI, in order to compete in WRC....... CLiVE, This would be a very interesting concept, one which I wouldn't say no to. A question though. Isn't the WRC a 2ltr engine class? Then this would mean the MINI would have to come with a new 2ltr engine when it upgrades the engine. Once again - I wouldn't say no Dutchy. Sadly INIMINI is gone, but never forgotten.

Jun 4th, 2004, 01:56 AM	#16 (permalink)
CLiVE Posts: n/a	Quote: Originally Posted by Dutchy CLiVE, This would be a very interesting concept, one which I wouldn't say no to. A question though. Isn't the WRC a 2ltr engine class? Then this would mean the MINI would have to come with a new 2ltr engine when it upgrades the engine. Once again - I wouldn't say no Dutchy. Again just a rumor. Who know if it will ever hit production. I wouldn't say no either, and would very happily upgrade to an AWD Mini. It would most likely mean a new 2ltr engine as well..

Jun 4th, 2004, 12:46 PM	#17 (permalink)
Dave&Stacy SCCA ClubRallyists Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: In the country... Local Time: 06:15 PM Posts: 216 Offline	AWD Mini? Looks like Stacy and I might have to make the move to Open class in a few years. :-) "Sideways at 80 mph through the woods. Is there a more intense rush?" - 2005 CR/W MCS, JCW Kit, Xenons, DSC, On-Board Comp., 3-spoke Multifunction, F/R Fogs, Extra 15" 7-hole Wheels for Rally Tires -

Jun 14th, 2004, 12:31 PM	#18 (permalink)
Boo Sponsor and Widget Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Nth Beaches, Sydney Local Time: 09:15 AM Posts: 1,752 Offline	I would put my money down now if they decided to bring out a nicely powered (say 200KW) AWD Mini... that would be soooooo sweet... The original SWORKS

Jun 17th, 2004, 07:56 PM	#19 (permalink)
Grumbler MINI2 Regular Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Kent Island Local Time: 07:15 PM Posts: 310 Offline	hmm, i was just thinking this the other day. i wouldnt want to see a system similar to the volvo system, audi style is far more effective...........they actually ran a comparison about 2+ ago on the two systems and although both were effective during slip conditions, the audi was able to handle faster and cleaner than the volvo....... now as i understand it, and i could be seriously wrong here, the volvo ran fwd until it started to slip, then applied power to the rear. the audi ran power to all wheels all the time. of course this is all a long time ago. wouldnt mind seeing it, but is there any more room in the present mini for a larger engine???? .......hey you kids, get off the road..............

Jun 18th, 2004, 04:44 AM	#20 (permalink)
caminifan MINI2 Regular Join Date: Mar 2004 Local Time: 03:15 PM Posts: 56 Offline	If the Volvo AWD system that was reviewed was not the Haldex system, then the review was of an older version AWD. Haldex is currently the state of the art in AWD. Check out the following URL for info on Haldex: http://www.haldex-traction.com/default.htm

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