[JG02JSG]

At the time I was not tempted to change my MCS until a letter came throught the door saying come down and test drive the new mini. So like you do you go down and test drive it and u fall in love with it. the design the comfort and the new TUBO charged engine which i think gives it more of a edge than the super charger. Then you go away with your tail between your legs think about go back a couple of days latter then order it. Then you wait and wait wait wait till it gets made then delivered hopefully but not got my fingers crossed of the 2nd week in jan then i will be bale to run it in on one of the north west mini runs

[kevkbuk]

Nothing has really changed in the market since the original MCS for me. There maybe a bit more competition, but nothing really compares directly to the Mini IMHO. Sure it would be nice if it cost a little less, but if I didn't think it was worth it I wouldn't have purchased one.

You really need to forget about BHP and 0-60 times and just drive the cars and see what grabs you. Before ordering my R56 MCS I drove the Astra VXR and Focus ST, sure they had more power, but overall I think the MCS is the better car. My heart was set on the VXR at the start, but driving it just didn't live up to expectations. So I ended up buying a Mini which was the most expensive option, but hey you want what you want.

[Tone]

Quote: Originally Posted by inomis (original)

I don't think MINI wants the MCS to be The Hot Hatch(THH) and it isn't. THH is the car that won't be THH next model year. THH is a bit uncomfortable in ride and noise. THH fuel milage is not so good. Many can not afford to buy a car with the single purpose nature of THH. Most people really don't want THH.

This is it in a nutshell IMO. We are enthusiasts here. There is a huge market for the MCS, with the price/performance as it stands. BMW have done their research. They know what's what. For those of us that want something really extra, we'll just have to wait [for the factory JCW].

[Jonesy]

I had my first test drive of the new Mini MCS on Saturday. I was not sure that there would be any difference and to some extent its true. When you are able to floor it it starts picking up as normal and the accceration is pretty good but it does get much more frantic and the acceleration starts to give you a good pumelling right near the top of the power band. Currently it is pretty linear. I know the max torque band is MUCH bigger than before but there seems to be a real urge right at the top that comes out of nowhere.

Yes it is a turbo but I was assured that no lag would be noticeable!

The ride is very very similar at slower speeds but on motorways it does feel a bit more solid and the steering makes you a little more confident. It does have adaptive steering whch gets firmer the faster you go but it wasn't that noticable (althought the Mrs reckons she could tell).

The big no no for me though was the new centre console. Where there was no instruments there was just seas of dark grey plastic. Admittedly it was good quality but it was too much. It would have been better if the dash effect that you choose also filled these gaps.

Gear box was nice... light but not flimsy - it still has a slight notchy feel that I like in the original.

Overall good... pricing, bad! I put in leather, chilli, multifunction, piano black dash, DSC, metallic paint and ran face first into a £19.5k fist. My wallet actually started to perspire!!!

[Tonyt3]

Hmmm, yes, on paper, its a lot of money to spend on a car that has 'sub class standard' BHP, but i'm told the car out punches its posted figures....

However, a Focus ST 'ASBO' with £2k spent on aftermarket tuning has 300bhp.... serious power.... and a much more useful sized car.... even looks cool with viper stripes.....

[pubert]

I too was a little disappointed with 175bhp, but like tonyt said, and from what i've read, the car
does seem to outpunch its posted figures.

Read the Auto Express 24hr shoot out between the R56 S, Ford ASBO, Clio 197 and Golf
GTI, that should put the smile back on your face. It did for me anyway

pubert

[gcp]

If you want outright performance for the ££ then Clio 197 probably gets it, can be had new for under £14k

Would I still enjoy driving one day in day out, unlikely.

Would I be happy with the <50% retained value over 3 years, no.

Would I be happy when trim rattles and strange noises appear, no.

I am looking for refinement, build quality, residuals as well as driver appeal and performance, IMO only the Golf GTI comes close to Cooper S.

[matt21]

i personally fine by current S a more enjoyable drive due to the soundtrack and dont find the new one all that much quicker but boy that torque hits you hard low down

It feels as quick as a 200bhp Golf GTi I'd say easily and remember it has much less weight so BHP/tonne would beat it anyway.

As for the 197 I think this is a big step back over the 182. Reading the test in Evo mag the R56 S leaves the more powerful Renault for dead

[Restyle]

From all the reviews of the new MCS over the last few months, I was half expecting to put an order in straight after the test drive, but I was left feeling very disappointed with the Turbo performance compared to the existing Supercharger.

If this was the car I had test driven 5 years ago -Yes I`d have snapped it up straight away, no doubt extolling the Virtues of the twin turbo.
But had a Supercharged replacement been offered 5 years later, I`d have jumped straight in & be telling the World what an improvement it was on the old car, slightly less comfortable maybe, but more of a Drivers Sports Car.

[daro911]

FIN If you would have tested the goods first I don't think you would have posted your post.

I have had on loan to me the Clio 197 Ford ST and neither of these cars comes within an inch of the new MCS for the following unique to a MINI reasons in absolutely no particular order

Pride of Ownership
Low cost of ownership
Lowest depreciation in "ANY" class
Fun Factor in real world motoring conditions
MINI unique design features inside & out now better than ever
Character
Image
Handling
Power delivery with so few horses ...Too appreciate this you have to take a test drive and when you do check out that low rev bottom end pulling power so different to the previous model

"Our test figures bear it out. At the track, the 1,205kg Cooper S hit 60mph in 6.6 seconds and sprinted on to 100mph in 16.2 seconds. The Clio 197 managed 6.9 and 18.7 respectively. But that’s not all. In-gear flexibility is more significant than traffic light titillation. And here, the Cooper S turbo’s torque comes into its own. It muscles its way from 30-50mph in third in 2.9 secs and 50-70mph in fifth in 5.1 secs, against 4.3 and 7.3 respectively for the 1,240kg French charger."

[kevkbuk]

Quote: Originally Posted by Tonyt3 (original)

However, a Focus ST 'ASBO' with £2k spent on aftermarket tuning has 300bhp.... serious power.... and a much more useful sized car.... even looks cool with viper stripes.....

If the Astra VXR is anything to go by with 300bhp at front wheels it would be pretty much undrivable!

[daro911]

Quote: Originally Posted by Tonyt3 (original)

Hmmm, yes, on paper, its a lot of money to spend on a car that has 'sub class standard' BHP, but i'm told the car out punches its posted figures....

However, a Focus ST 'ASBO' with £2k spent on aftermarket tuning has 300bhp.... serious power.... and a much more useful sized car.... even looks cool with viper stripes.....

"In the real world" the car definitely out punches the figures posted

Focus ASBO with 2K spent on tuning would still be no where near as much fun as the MCS in the real world daily commute and come resell time I'd rather have what little money the chancellor allows me to keep tied up in a MCS over a ST with 300bhp

If you want more space & viper stripes then the ST will win the day but who buys a MCS for space!!

[Tonyt3]

Quote: Originally Posted by kevkbuk (original)

If the Astra VXR is anything to go by with 300bhp at front wheels it would be pretty much undrivable!

Ford have a clever system of automatically restricting the power in first and second gear, making the car much more drievable than the likes of the VXR.....

[Tonyt3]

Interesting to see, that after nearly 5 years at the top, EVO magazine have ditched the New Cooper S to 'also ran' in terms of best performance Hot hatch category, replacing it with the Golf GTi.

They say, that all things considered, the previous model was better....

[popey]

Quote: Originally Posted by Tonyt3 (original)

Interesting to see, that after nearly 5 years at the top, EVO magazine have ditched the New Cooper S to 'also ran' in terms of best performance Hot hatch category, replacing it with the Golf GTi.

They say, that all things considered, the previous model was better....

Got a good review from what I read, just about everyone sees it as an improvement. But like ive said before the MCS is not an out an out "Hot Hatch". IMHO

[Tone]

Quote: Originally Posted by daro911 (original)

FIN If you would have tested the goods first I don't think you would have posted your post.

I have had on loan to me the Clio 197 Ford ST and neither of these cars comes within an inch of the new MCS for the following unique to a MINI reasons in absolutely no particular order

Pride of Ownership
Low cost of ownership
Lowest depreciation in "ANY" class
Fun Factor in real world motoring conditions
MINI unique design features inside & out now better than ever
Character
Image
Handling
Power delivery with so few horses ...Too appreciate this you have to take a test drive and when you do check out that low rev bottom end pulling power so different to the previous model

Good summary IMO, though have yet to test drive. We mustn't forget the icon factor.

[daro911]

Quote: Originally Posted by Fin (original)

I have a feeling this post may cause a few heated responses, so first off let me explain what I mean.

Firstly, I have not driven the new Cooper S.

There are many new hot hatches out there these days to rival the beloved new Cooper S; Renault Clio 197, Peugeot 207 GTi (soon), Vauxhall Corsa VXR (soon, and rumoured to have 200BHp ).

Mini Cooper S v Renaultsport Clio 197

Some raw data from a recent test:-

Our test figures bear it out. At the track, the 1,205kg Cooper S hit 60mph in 6.6 seconds and sprinted on to 100mph in 16.2 seconds. The Clio 197 managed 6.9 and 18.7 respectively. But that’s not all. In-gear flexibility is more significant than traffic light titillation. And here, the Cooper S turbo’s torque comes into its own. It muscles its way from 30-50mph in third in 2.9 secs and 50-70mph in fifth in 5.1 secs, against 4.3 and 7.3 respectively for the 1,240kg French charger. Oh dear.

[Fin]

I'm certainly glad the Cooper S outperformed the Clio 197 in a test situation, as I suspected it would due to its higher torque output. And those 0-60 figures look very attractive compared to the official ones quoted by MINI. As I mentioned before, I neglected the Clio 197 on the basis of its lack of torque, so daro911 you are preaching to the converted. And I certainly agree with you with your other listed benefits to MCS ownership.

I merely wanted to open a discussion as to what people honestly think of the new MCS. You were right in saying if I had gone out and tested the goods I would not have started this post. If I drove a new MCS, I would most likely buy one. But then I wouldn't be able to honestly compare it to the other cars out there without bias.

Maybe I'm just being greedy, wanting more horsepower to generate that torque quicker. However, for the record, I just want to state that I have never titillated myself at a set of traffic lights. It's much better having someone else titillate you instead

[SNJ]

Whilst there are other similar cars with higher BHP (and will be in the near future) will they have the build quality, kudos, quirkiness, driveability, high residuals and fun factor of the MINI? Probably not all of these. The MINI is also pretty light in weight compared to other cars which helps equalise the fact that it has less BHP.

[Prowse]

Something to consider...

Fully Spec'd Clio 197 on their online configurator: £19,055

Fully Spec'd Cooper S on the MINI (UK) configurator: £24,500