| |
 |         |
 |  |  |
| |||||||
| General Discussion Use this forum to discuss MINI topics which are not related to other forums. Posts may be moved from here to alternative forums by the moderators without notice |
 |
| | LinkBack | Thread Tools | Rate Thread |
Oct 22nd, 2009, 12:34 PM
| ||||
| ||||
 With as much respect as is due to a comment like that... you're spouting elitist nonsense. It's the same sort of non-inclusiveness we're trying to stamp out here between Classic Mini, R50/53 MINI, and R56 MINI owners. It's narrow-minded and puerile. So, your response to what you perceive as an underhanded attack is to launch an underhanded attack of your own upon a community that wasn't even involved in this discussion? Grow up, M.O.S. Regards, Andrew. NeuroBeaker - Proud owner of Zeus (a 'modestly modified' 2004 MINI ONE). Helpful Links: [1st Gen. Power Steering Pump (PSP) Failure Guide] [1st Gen. PSP Repair] [Thread Titles] [Adverts Fix] Last edited by MINIAC; Oct 22nd, 2009 at 04:05 PM. Reason: Remove reply to deleted post  |
| Sponsored Links | ||
Advertisement | ||
|
Oct 22nd, 2009, 02:39 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Camp yes, boring yes, weedy yes, big nosed yes, skinny yes, gay bible basher (WTF !!) yes, but i've never had anyone call me petty before.... pretty maybe UPUBMNJOJ.DPN |
|
Oct 22nd, 2009, 03:15 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| F.A.O Mos .. "Or something with ridiculous wheel gap (cue r56)" you just cant help yourself can you?!?! :P  i fully agree with the post, if that person goes out and earns money why the hell do you care if they spend it on mods for the car? they obviously love their car and want to spend their earnings on it.and all this grief that youz have been giving adam is uncalled for, imo i think its because youz are ****ed off hes under half your age and has the same car :-] All comments and Jipp welcome because i don't give a **** what old men tell me :-] p.s. what would a guest to the forum think if they saw youz talking like that? imo i think they would click the wee red 'x' and not sign up in fear of getting abused by someone whos old enough to be their dad...grandad? 8-) |
| Thanks for this post from: | ||
|
Oct 22nd, 2009, 04:01 PM
| |||
| |||
| No, its not. The principle of a porsche is aircooled, flat 6 in the boot. In the same way a mini is a small car. Not smallest - the fiat 500 was smaller when the mini was new. There was nothing underhand about mine. It was straight to the point, direct and obvious. I was merely sticking up for a friend who was being persecuted by some miserable so and so for doing well in life. Nah can't help it  I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks its a tad unfair on Scandell! I personally take the approach they're my age/younger whatever and they've got a nicer car - good for them! Do I care? No! Why would it bother me?!I also agree with your comments on visitors! If I'd have seen this I'd never have signed up! However I have to say since about Juneish the site has got a lot better than it was!  The Original MINI One Seven Yorkshire MINI Register - PM for details Last edited by MINIAC; Oct 22nd, 2009 at 04:09 PM. Reason: Remove comment about other site |
| The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to M.O.S For This Useful Post: | ||
|
Nov 7th, 2009, 06:02 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Failing to evolve with the times is what brought down Rover. Porsche is not making the same mistake... and I say that from a family that has a 1997 Porsche 911 (993) Convertible in the garage - the last of the air-cooled 911 variants. The older cars have a more visceral driving experience, but that's something seen across all marques of car... if Porsche manufactured that car today, people would scratch their heads in wonder and lambaste the lack of both creature comforts and technology. The older Porsche 911s are better sports cars, but the new 911s are far better GT cars. That's just how it is. If you want a modern sports car from Porsche, you now look to the Cayman model. This is more in line with the original thinking of the original 911 - a fast sports car that doesn't cost the Earth and handles well - moving the engine forward of the rear axle improves the natural handling characteristics of the car. The newer 911s have evolved into more elite luxury/GT cars that while still eye-wateringly fast have become beyond the reach of many. Porsche today makes better cars than it ever has done. However, a modern car will always struggle to fit in with the nostalgic view of motoring in any automotive company's heritage. Log on to any Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini, etc... forum and you'll see those who own both modern and classic variants describe this phenomenon - and that's why they own an example of old and an example of new. I disagree on all those points. There's sticking up for someone, and there's retaliating with a persecution of your own. Attempting to right to a wrong with one of your own does not put you in the right - you have failed to grasp this important distinction. I agree in principle. However, too many young drivers take criticism of their car as criticism that they should not be driving it - rather than just a preference for different styles. If you ask someone "What do you think?" you must be prepared to hear something that isn't always favourable. It's not always about age. Regards, Andrew. NeuroBeaker - Proud owner of Zeus (a 'modestly modified' 2004 MINI ONE). Helpful Links: [1st Gen. Power Steering Pump (PSP) Failure Guide] [1st Gen. PSP Repair] [Thread Titles] [Adverts Fix] |
|
Nov 7th, 2009, 07:25 PM
| |||
| |||
| If you change the raw ingredients, you change the car. The new 911 is not a 911, its merely a car. Everyone and their wife seems to have one (yes I do know of a husband and wife who have a 911 each). They're not 'special' like the older 993 and previous models are/were. At the end of the day, if you want creature comforts buy a Jag! Simple really! Rover didn't fall due to failing to evolve with the times. This is where you are VERY wrong. Though Rovers never sold in great numbers, they did sell, and the MG models sold very well - the TF was one of the best, if not the best, selling car in its class every year from start to finish. The reason MG Rover failed is because of bad management. Spending millions on racing teams, parties, the SV-R (while a very nice car, and yes I'd love one, it wasn't what MGR needed). Bad management is what brought down Rover, that and BMW taking bits they wanted such as Land Rover and MINI. This didn't help, and when coupled with the directors (who bought the company for £10 each) taking MASSIVE pension funds out and bonuses, it was a recipe for failure. Then theres the fact that the British media were constantly slating rovers - clarkson and co. The Rover 75/MG ZT still ranks higher than both the e39 and e60/1 5 series for owner satisfaction. Infact last year or the year before it came 7th. And this is a car which hasn't been produced since 2004, and was roughly 2/3 the price of a 5 series. Don't get me onto rovers, I know a LOT more about this than you think. New porsche's aren't that great to be fair, they're certainly no better than the old ones. Ok you can drive them without being scared of dying, but they've lost the handling and characteristics of the old cars. Its like saying the R56 is better than the r50 - it isn't, but both are better in certain ways. Unlike this blkbrg whatever I am not persecuting an innocent person, rather I am retaliating. The person in question had a tiff with Scandell for no reason, I had a tiff with him based on making completely ridiculous and unfair comments - I didn't make any assumptions. He assumed all sorts - that Adam has a trust fund etc etc... Whether he does or not I don't know, I don't care and it certainly is none of my business. Just as evidence - I'm retaliating to this sort of comment: [quote-Blk/brg cooper s] Oh, be assured, they'll keep popping up until mummy & daddy cut the trust fund and he has to get a job in order to spend £50k on a £20k car that you can't actually drive (thus reducing the time available to start these pointless threads).[/quote] I have read the thread fully, and can't see how adam provoked this character, or made any unfair, unfounded assumptions. As far as I can see, this is an unfair way to treat someone when you don't know the full story. I merely had a tiff based on this, stating that it is completely unfair and he needs to sort himself out. I refer you to the above quote. Adam (from what I can see) retaliated to a post claiming he had a trust fund etc etc which in my eyes is fully deserved. This blkbrg (I'll use the word character) character made unfair assumptions on adam, basically saying he shouldn't have a nice car. And its all due to trust funds etc etc. I've said it before and I'll say it again, I do not know whether adam has a trust fund, i couldn't care less either way and it is none of my or anyone else's business. I don't take the softly softly approach to things. If I think there's something wrong, I say so. And I will defend those being persecuted. He is being unfairly persecuted, and funnily enough I'm not the only one who thinks its unfair. The Original MINI One Seven Yorkshire MINI Register - PM for details |
|
Nov 7th, 2009, 08:38 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Saying the current production 911 is not a 911 is just ludicrous. Have you ever been in one, before you criticise it as such? Overall, new Porsches are much better cars than the old ones, however there are many reasons why the cars weigh more and aren't as chuckable as Porsches of old. If what you value in a car is a very raw, visceral, driving experience then you won't find what you're looking for from a modern mainstream manufacturer anymore - you have to either buy Classic or go elsewhere: Ariel Atom, Cateram, Noble, Westfield, Radical, KTM X-Bow, etc. As for Rover, yes they failed because of bad management. The management choices in the past were not to invest sufficiently in technological development of their cars and people didn't buy them in sufficient volume for the company to make any money. Some of the MG designs were no more than re-badged Rovers once the company realised the 'Rover' badge was tarnishing. As for owner satisfaction, have you also considered that owners of higher-end cars expect more from them? Quite simply, they made perfectly usable boring cars that lacked innovation and didn't capture sufficient attention or desire from the buying public. I think you castigated a lot of innocent people in your haste to leap to Adam's defence.  I also took steps to correct what I perceived as an unjust assault upon those doing no wrong, when you chose to drag them unknowingly into the equation. You might have started with righteous intentions, but your methods were abhorrent and did as much bad as you did good. Regards, Andrew. NeuroBeaker - Proud owner of Zeus (a 'modestly modified' 2004 MINI ONE). Helpful Links: [1st Gen. Power Steering Pump (PSP) Failure Guide] [1st Gen. PSP Repair] [Thread Titles] [Adverts Fix] |
|
Nov 7th, 2009, 08:58 PM
| |||
| |||
| Yes, and I've driven one. I like the old porsches, with their reasonable interior, but very mechanical engine. I don't want very raw, but the older 911s are how they should be: fast, poised with a half decent interior. I wouldn't say I'd have to go away from mainstream - what about the Lotus Elise/exige - they're pretty mainstream. The MG ZR/ZS/ZT were rover bodies, but the chassis was completely different. If people weren't badge snobs, then they'd have sold a lot better. There were none that were "rebadged rovers" as you claim. I have considered that owners of what you call higher end cars expect more - but "Several owners of models other than the 1.8 have reported no issues" says to me they don't go wrong. Our BMW which cost a lot more than an MG Rover has gone wrong several times, and they aren't small faults. Likewise several mercedes have electrical troubles etc... I would believe ours is an odd one out, but it isn't. The Vanos is known to go at 60,000 miles on v8 models... And thats a bit more than £300 on a head gasket which was fixed at the end. To be fair I think you took it far too seriously, however what I said about you know where was, from experience, true. As you said earlier if you ask for thoughts you have to accept negatives... Maybe you should inform their moderators. It was a perfectly just 'assault'! Based on what they get up to - the in crowd thing etc... However this is not the place to list out the many, and growing, faults with the other side. The Original MINI One Seven Yorkshire MINI Register - PM for details |
|
Nov 7th, 2009, 09:51 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| If you like the Lotus Exige, you really should consider the Porsche Cayman. Also mid-engined, also very quick, also with a reasonable interior, and bought for the same sort of money.  The 911 is still rear-engined... so it's odd that you'd lament the loss of a rear-engined car by moving to a mid-engine alternative. The older Porsche 911s are extremely good and always an option, but I whole-heartedly disagree with your sweeping assessment that the new 911 isn't a real Porsche. You're hanging on pedantic details. Certain aspects were updated, but they were essentially Rovers - similar enough to say they were merely facelifts, disguised, or 'rebadged'. Are the MG Rovers driven with the same gusto of a BMW? And Mercedes certainly had a dip in quality: 2000-2004. My parents were on the receiving end of that when they bought a very high-spec CLK in 2000 and were bitterly disappointed... so much so they've sworn never to buy another Mercedes ever again - even after really being impressed by their previous two in the 1990's. Make up your mind! Did I take it far too seriously, or was it a perfectly just assault? I'm a founding member over there, as well as a privileged member here - and I've experienced being moderated on both sites. On both forums, this was done with dignity and discretion by the moderation teams. Regards, Andrew. NeuroBeaker - Proud owner of Zeus (a 'modestly modified' 2004 MINI ONE). Helpful Links: [1st Gen. Power Steering Pump (PSP) Failure Guide] [1st Gen. PSP Repair] [Thread Titles] [Adverts Fix] |
|
Nov 7th, 2009, 10:16 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Maybe that was just a Friday car they got and a shame that they stopped purchasing the brand on one bad experience. I've owned Mercedes for years and although the materials used to build them over the last decade or two have changed (more plastic/man-made textiles, etc), they are still superior in all aspects to most other manufacturers and the level of service from the dealer network is better than most main-stream brands. I like driving in my car, it's not quiet a Jaguar. |
|
Nov 7th, 2009, 10:24 PM
| |||
| |||
| The cayman, well lets just say change one letter of the name. I'd rather have a bus pass. Yes you can tune it to be faster than an imitation 911, but its just not right. It doesn't fulfill the requirements of a proper porsche and screams I couldn't afford a 911. The 911 is still rear engined, I wasn't making the point re the engine, the point was there are still mainstream cars that are what the 911 was. If it is air cooled, with a flat 6 in the boot and has left the factory in Stuttgart, then it is a proper porsche, anything else and it isn't. All the mgs had different chassis. OK the doors and basic shape was the same, however, thats it. Even the engines were differently tuned e.g. rover 25 1.4=85bhp, mg zr 1.4=105bhp...] I dare say so. Most BMWs are just sitting on motorways now, which doesn't create much strain on wearable components. I know of a fair few MG Rovers that are used as tow cars and/or driven hard and they're fine. Infact a friend had and still has a 2003 75 2.5v6 tourer, and the only parts that have gone wrong are those shared with BMW/MINI - door locking things etc... Yes our bmw is driven very hard, but as its got all the ///M parts on it, this shouldn't be a problem - motorsport derived parts should tolerate fast road. The last line was sarcastic. You took it far to seriously. I would have added 3 exclamation marks, but felt that there wasn't the need when talking to someone who is of above average intelligence I've had only one dealing with the mods on here, it was about pictures and instructions of how to attach as thumbnails, rather than using the picture button thing on the top of advanced reply which I was using. The moderator in question did this in a very friendly manner, providing me with easy to follow instructions. I find the mods on the other side very hit and miss. Some are rather snotty and a bit power crazed, whereas on here I actually only know of one moderator. They seem to keep their heads down. Over there I know you are a founding member and love the site, however, unless you're in the in crowd, they aren't interested and to be frank, though some are friendly e.g. Jon - he seems top notch, others aren't. Funny how differently some mods deal with you based on whether you're in the in crowd or not eh! The Original MINI One Seven Yorkshire MINI Register - PM for details |
|
Nov 7th, 2009, 10:27 PM
| |||
| |||
| To be fair, mercedes from that period, well even 1996-2003 e class, were notoriously shoddy and rusted very badly. I've seen 5 year old e class/s class with rust - got to make you think! The older mercs are great, the newer ones - well the jury is still out. The best indication though is taxis. You see several of the old box e class taxis still going, and also a fair few of the newer 2004-2009 e class taxis in europe, but VERY few of the 1996-2003 e class... That says a lot in my mind The Original MINI One Seven Yorkshire MINI Register - PM for details |
|
Nov 7th, 2009, 10:34 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| Mercedes are very innovative, most modern technology in cars can be attributed to them. I would be lost without half the things my Merc does. To name a few features that they have been innovative with, please continue: Parking sensors, auto-dim mirrors, specialist integrated audio (Harman Kardon et al), folding mirrors, indicator repeaters on mirrors, cruise control, follow-home lights, traffic speed sensor cruise control, auto-parking (although it went wrong on top gear!), white colour in the noughties with the new C-Class! (remember this year, white is the new black!)  I like driving in my car, it's not quiet a Jaguar. |
|
Nov 8th, 2009, 01:56 PM
| ||||
| ||||
| The problem with Mercedes was that there was a conscious management decision to cheapen the design and lower the build quality as they felt they were over-engineering their cars and profit margins were not high enough. This happened to coincide with us buying our third Mercedes. I can't remember all the problems we had, but from the top of my head:
But it wasn't just the problems with the car that were part of the bad experience. The dealership wasn't helpful either. Mercedes actually blamed the fact that the car had an AMG tune on it and AMG blamed Mercedes... yet the AMG tune was specified with the order to construct the car.  An alternate dealership was no further help and referred us back to the original one where we bought the car. There was a complete and total failure on the part of Mercedes to deliver a car that was anywhere near their old standards and their service network was pitiful in trying to resolve our problems. The rough idle and stalling when attempting maximum acceleration from stand-still were never solved in the 2½ years we owned the car.They may very well have sorted out these problems, but when you give a company £67k for a car, you expect the car to be much better than that and certainly you expect the service side of things to look after you if/when something goes wrong. What we found was that the warranty wasn't properly repairing components when they broke and most of the problems were chronic rather than an acute problem that was fixed. They were massively disappointed with the car (it may very well have been a lemon), but it was the terrible service across the network that convinced them Mercedes was no longer the company they enjoyed being customers of. They eventually got rid of the car for £24k with just under 40,000 miles on it. The reason they ended up getting the CLK over the M3 was simply because the M3 had a 6 month waiting list if you wanted it built to spec, while the Mercedes had only a 3 month waiting list. Throughout all of this, they were impressed by the service they received on their 5-series and while they had the CLK they often lamented that they should have bought another BMW instead. Since then, they're now on their 3rd new BMW purchase and are very happy with the cars and service. Well, I think that's just nonsense. I suppose you look at the 924, 944, and 928 and say "they couldn't afford a proper Porsche"? The problem is, with the car having the same shape and too similar styling, people weren't going to look for any subtle under-the-skin tweaks. And even though there were improvements, it was essentially just a facelift: many facelifted cars have changes like suspension geometry, engine retunes, new gearboxes, etc... but they're still the same basic car. As was the case here. Well, that's surprising. I've never known anyone who's had a bad experience with a modern BMW before. Sometimes it's very difficult to communicate/interpret sarcasm on a forum without vocal inflections or facial expressions.  I can't say I've ever experienced this or seen any evidence of it. Regards, Andrew. NeuroBeaker - Proud owner of Zeus (a 'modestly modified' 2004 MINI ONE). Helpful Links: [1st Gen. Power Steering Pump (PSP) Failure Guide] [1st Gen. PSP Repair] [Thread Titles] [Adverts Fix] |
| Sponsored Links | |
Advertisement | |
|
| Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests) | |
| Thread Tools | |
| Rate This Thread | |
| |
