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Egr mystery

24K views 28 replies 7 participants last post by  Charliemuttley 
#1 ·
Hi all.

Hoping someone can help with this. Since buying my Dooper this year it's been suffering from a slight lack of power down low and an intermittent hesitation between 1500 and 1900. I decided to investigate yesterday and took the egr out. The car is just short of 50k.

It wasn't too dirty but definitely had some soot on it, but I was more concerned about the solenoid, it was pretty hard to turn and definitely didn't seem right. Anyway I cleaned it and put it back in, but I think the car went into limp mode. Very little power and just wasn't right.

I took it back out and closed the valve. I then put it back in the car but didn't plug it in. The car was driving like a dream! Plenty of grunt and no hesitation but of course the eml came on.

As the car was driving so well I presumed it must have been the egr creating the problem. I bought a new one today from ecp and fitted tonight. But even with the new one fitted the hesitation is still there! Does feel like there's still more power low down but the hesitation is still there.

So it must be somewhere in the egr line that's causing the hesitation but not the valve. Anyone any ideas what I can try?

Thanks
 
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#2 ·
Update from a wee test today. I was managing to replace the hesitation quite easily, for some reason it seems to be worst going round right hand bends!

So I completed 2 laps of a 2 mile circuit with the hesitation happening on every right hand turn. I stopped and unplugged the MAF, no more hesitation! The engine felt as it did with the egr blocked off.

I have a feeling the egr might have been a red herring, which is annoying, but I'm going to give the MAF a good clean and see if that helps.
 
#3 · (Edited)
We used to purposely block off the vacuum pipe on newly replaced EGR valves on the Mondeo TDCI engines. They'd be fine until they got all sooted up and would stick again. Nothing but trouble and their only purpose is to recirculate part of the exhaust gasses back to the combustion chamber to cut emissions slightly more at certain RPM. Make a good engine flat as a witches tit when they're stuck open!
 
#4 ·
Indeed! Ordered a blanking plate last night, seems the cheap option to sort my problem. I was wary about blanking it as the engine is obviously designed to run with the valve active, but I've yet to see anyone complain that an egr blank ruined their engine. Plenty of others only saying good things. I again tested the car with the connectors out and it's the first time I've managed to spin the wheels! As soon as I plugged it back in the hesitation was back.
 
#6 ·
Fitted the blank plate today and the hesitation is 90% cured I'd say. I went for the plate with the small hole in the middle to try and avoid the eml coming on, so think this is why it's not 100% fixed, but I'm happy with the trade off. Aren't even any codes logged via my obd reader, so hope it stays that way.

I'm aware the hole will probably get blocked eventually but it's not an issue to remove to clean every so often.
 
#7 ·
Ok needing more help after a long drive to work today. It's 30 miles each way.

Twice on the drive in and once on the way home the car suddenly lost power for approx 30s. It was the same as I had before when I put the original egr back in after cleaning.

It's hard to describe but there's just no power with full throttle. What I suspect limp mode to be. Funny thing is it only lasts about 30s then comes back to full power.

I still have the egr blank with the hole installed, I may try the full blank plate to see what happens then. But this is slightly concerning me now.
 
#9 ·
It does seem strange. Have you checked all the vacuum hoses and ran a diagnostic check on the ECU to see if any codes are present?

On a final note what engine is it? I know some Peugeot guys had this problem with the 1.6 Hdi and the PSA engine is basically an Hdi so it may be worth checking the Pug forums to see what they are saying about it?
 
#10 ·
No vacuum hoses on the egr. It's fully electronic

Unfortunately I don't have a laptop to run a full test on the new egr. My next step will probably be to take it to my garage to have them check it. Would the new egr need coding or adaptation?

It's the psa engine that I have, and yeah I've done a lot of searching on the various forums about egr problems. I've exhausted my knowledge on the matter and to be honest I'm at the point of giving up with the problem. I thought I had it sussed, but it's just really strange that it will lose power for maybe 20s then come back to normal.

I have noticed there is a lot of oil coming off of the crank breather valve, I'm wondering if that is affecting either the turbo or the airflow through the intercooler. But as I say that's beyond my knowledge level. I'm going to buy a new o ring for the connection from that breather valve to try and cut down the oil that's escaping, but I have a feeling there might be oil in the intercooler.
 
#11 ·
I'm going to buy a new o ring for the connection from that breather valve to try and cut down the oil that's escaping, but I have a feeling there might be oil in the intercooler.
Ive NEVER seen an intercooler that wasn't full of oil to some degree (unless it was brand spanking) Unless when you remove it you can pour about 500ml out the end, I wouldn't sweat it mate :) Can you make a little temp gasket (out of a coke can) and blank off the EGR completely to see if that makes any difference?
 
#14 ·
I've removed the blank for now as it was actually quite dangerous driving home from work today. It was losing power every 5 minutes or so. I don't have a can to cut to fit a full blank just now, so I just ordered one from the bay for £3.50. I'll fit and test that when it arrives. I'll just need to live with the hesitation for now.

One other point though, when I came home I immediately lifted the bonnet to remove the plate. I was working on the car for about 20 minutes, and for that full time the throttle body was making a whine. Is that normal? The whine went when I disconnected the 2 electrical plugs but came back when I put them back in.
 
#16 ·
Ok, blank plate or still out, hesitation and loss of power still evident.

I payed for a decent app on my phone to pull the codes (I don't have a laptop) and as soon as I had the loss of power today I checked the codes.

40D4 EGR actuator position valve too far open/negative deviation

40C4 unknown fault. Guessing it's EGR again.

4501 Control of exhaust gas recirculation, anomaly / exhaust redirection control /
Exhaust gas recirculation control, differential air mass deviation, while Kat heating /
Exhaust gas recirculation control, deviation

Anyone any ideas? Is my new EGR faulty or could this be the EGR valve within the throttle body?
 
#18 · (Edited)
Hi again.

This was with the blanking plate out. Today I spent some money to try and eliminate all other factors I could. New MAF, MAP and air temp sensor. The hesitation is still there and so is the loss of power. :-(

I have ordered a Valeo EGR today to fit and I'll see what happens with that

I used the Carly app. I just paid for 5 licenses which was £7. Seems like quite a good app, but I couldn't swallow the £38 price for the full app. I'm using a Bluetooth obd connector.
 
#20 ·
Thanks very much for the offer.

I've actually got it booked in at a specialist on Monday in Ayr. I know the guys there and trust them, so I'll let them have a look and see what they find. That's if I don't manage to sort it myself first! Wishful thinking!

Good to know you're not too far away though! :)
 
#24 ·
Quite new to minis so just finding my way around them, but from what i know from my previous experience with an Alfa 147 the hesitation could simply be a leaking egr gasket, mine had a hesitation at about 1500rpm gasket replaced and good seal made hesitation gone.
Also had the same loss of power and it was a combination of a sticking egr and an inlet manifold that was so choked up it had to be removed and cleaned, car was fine after that, i think the blockage was keeping the soot around the egr to long so adding to the problem.

Once it was all sorted i had the egr mapped out so its still there for all to see but the ecu never asks it to open so it will never stick and because its there and all plugged in no engine management light, my son bought car off me when i was done with it and 3 years later alls good.
 
#25 ·
Thanks again for the advice.

Touch wood I seem to have sorted the loss of power and the hesitation by fitting an oem Valeo EGR valve. Tested yesterday 60 miles to and from work and seems much better. No error codes flagging yo either. Obviously the EGR I bought from ECP wasn't working with the car correctly. I have returned it under warranty for a full refund.

I'm still having an ever so slight hesitation but I'll put that down to the rest of the EGR pipes which I haven't cleaned yet. I'll do that asap. I dare say it would go with the blanking plate, but I'll leave that out for now in case the problem returns.
 
#27 ·
Hi, newbie member here. Trying to find information on how to remove egr to clean out as having running problems diagnosed by main dealer as egr. They quoted to replace but I want to clean out first to check as this also happened with my old Alfa 159. (all stuck fast due to carbon build up). Is there a how to guide anywhere? I believe it Dow towards the back under the air filter box to the right of the engine, is this correct? Countryman Cooper d 1.6 2011 plate. Many thanks in advance for any help offered!
 
#28 ·
hiya

I realise this is an older post BUT im hoping u can shed light i have a 2011 SD and i want to remove the EGR so i can clean and blank cars been remapped with EGR delete but still having flutter issues 12-1600revs intermittently

Have a Haynes manual but its useless in explaining the removal of the EGR my engine is an N47

Can you help me i have googled until im blue in the face and there is NO videos anywhere showing this !

my EGR appears to be underneath to the rear left of the air intake valve

thanks

Jen
 
#29 ·
I know this is old but out of curiosity did it not go into limp mode every time? I clear my codes and it revs with turbo spinning for a mile then restricts to 3000rpm. Get maf and egr codes. Had egr off a couple of times and now ordered a new one but I was wondering why you were not constantly in limp mode...
 
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