[Nic D]

Thats very true. I'd only be happy if i could do before and after runs on the same rolling road and if i wasn't happy to have my money back, £600 is half way to a tested 200bhp GGR conversion after all I'll keep checking this thread anyway.

[jmusicman]

sounds great 75% of the works power for 15% of the price...

But will it blow the engine apart??

J

[Fullupo]

hmm, i dont like the way they are charging extra for the warrenty and it isnt offered as standard, and also the fact that its only a year. is this normal? Also can these superchips be detected? as in will it invalidate your warrenty and have to tell mr insurance man?

[jmusicman]

yeah, the warranty thing is odd... and if it was easy to get so much hp from a chip upgrade, why are there no other chips claiming such a boost?? I don't think this engine is quite like the Audi/VW 1.8T which goes from 150->180 without any question whether the engine can take it...

Maybe there is a disclaimer on the users guide that you must use jet fuel(100+ octane) for the optimizations to work...

[legoverse]

Just an observation...

Why, on the RICA website, does it say under "Specifications" that the Engine Type is a Turbo Intercooler?

It makes me leery of sites when basic information is incorrect.

-- Terry K --

[MrWhoa]

Legoverse,
Agreed. And it's shady that they want to charge for coverage on the engine they THEY are modding....

[RaDeN]

Quote:

Originally posted by jmusicman
[b]yeah, the warranty thing is odd... and if it was easy to get so much hp from a chip upgrade, why are there no other chips claiming such a boost?? I don't think this engine is quite like the Audi/VW 1.8T which goes from 150->180 without any question whether the engine can take it.../B]

i was thinking the same thing. the funny thing is theres even chips now that can take the 1.8t engine from 150hp to 215hp on 93 octane gas !! a chip with that much of a boost would be great

[antnich]

heres the dyno sheet from rica

also this is what they said in the email it was sent with
"Hi,

As promised, here is the dyno chart for the Mini Cooper S. This particular Mini got over 200 bhp, but we normally under-quote at 190 bhp to be on the conservative side. The chart was made by our ECU software development team in Holland, hence the reason why some of the words are in dutch! But it's the power curve you are after. Hope this helps.

Regards,
Adam."

[antnich]

As I have had to shrink the chart down to post it on the forum I have also uploaded the full size dyno chart into my gallery.

[QQQ]

Quote:

Originally posted by Max
Yeah I can believe this. 190 bhp on the MCS is easily achieved by most tuners with just a chip.

True, and a big part of the gain is found by increasing the rev limiter with 500-600 rpm, which isn't really what I would want to be done with my MCS. More important with most of the chip tuners you see an impressive gain in BHP (as said most of it top end) but no or hardly any gain in torque which is what we realy are looking for. I therefor tend to believe their claim of the increased power, but seriously question their claimed increase in torque, for which you need more boost, hence the smaller pulley most of the tuners use

[supercoopers]

hmmm, i would be very interested if this was for real, but as already mentioned, i would be dubious of a company who thinks that the MCS has an intercooled turbo?

Henry

[Brushy]

Quote:

Originally posted by QQQ
True, and a big part of the gain is found by increasing the rev limiter with 500-600 rpm, which isn't really what I would want to be done with my MCS. More important with most of the chip tuners you see an impressive gain in BHP (as said most of it top end) but no or hardly any gain in torque which is what we realy are looking for. I therefor tend to believe their claim of the increased power, but seriously question their claimed increase in torque, for which you need more boost, hence the smaller pulley most of the tuners use

That is absolutly correct, power is nothing without torque. I suspect all you will end up with is a screaming motor with no low rev pull. If 190 was so easy to achieve it would come standard from BMW.

[antnich]

Saying BMW would tune it to 190 hp if it was possible is a incorrect statement. The car is mass produced and is delivered to many countries around the world where unleaded petrol is not as good as it is here. For example in the states unleaded is only 88 ron compared to the 93 ron here. due to this BMW have to make allowances in their programming of the ecu much to the detriment of us in the uk however companies like rica superchips and van aaken to name a few are able to reprogramme the ecu to allow for our better quality of fuel. This enables the release of the extra power. As for bmw policy on tuning their engines the majority of BMW engines can be remapped and gain around 15hp or more. They tune the engines to allow for the renowned reliability so they can clock up huge mileage without a squirm from the engine. In the long run reliability might be affected but we are talking at over 100 000 miles.

Now for torque. I know how important torque is. But if you increase hp accross the entire rev range torque also improves as hp is calculated from torque. However im not sure of the exact formula although I have seen it on a forum in here somewhere.

OK finished now

If nobody wants this group buy thats upto you lot if people do it will save some mony as a 10 % discount has been offered I will almost definately be having my car chipped anyway I am just trying to do myself and you guys a favour by saving a bit of cash.

Is anyone seriously interested or should i just go get it done myself.

[djkarp]

i'm am very interested and after speaking with adam today from rica i'm sold. the problem is i'm in the states!?! is there anyway you can help me get in on your group upgrade, i'd even be willing to send my ecu to the uk if need be or try to coordinate something in the new york area.

any ideas??

[antnich]

I'll have a word with adam and see what he says

[QQQ]

Quote:

Originally posted by antnich
Now for torque. I know how important torque is. But if you increase hp accross the entire rev range torque also improves as hp is calculated from torque. However im not sure of the exact formula although I have seen it on a forum in here somewhere.

I have to correct you here, because the other variable here are the revs of the crank. In formula:

Torque = Power/((7.28)* crank revs)

The problem with chip tuning is that you'll find most of the power gains in the upper revs which decreases the torque. In short, you need to find power gains at as low revs as possible, that gives you torque. That's exactly what diesel engines do, they don't have sky high bhp figures but max power comes at very low revs, hence the high torque figures of those engines. I advise you to drive a chip tuned MCS and thereafter an MCS with ECU mod and pulley and feel the difference.

[antnich]

true a chip does gain the majority of its power in the higher rev ranges but it does improve power through the entire rev range also.

A pulley upgrade does the same it increases power all the way through the rev range but as you know the supercharger doesnt reach full boost till the engine reaches full speed. Both a pulley upgrade and an ecu upgrade together provide outstanding results but if you are to do only one it is better to do the ecu. As otherwise if you do the pulley without the ecu the ecu will be cutting fuel down to keep emissions at the correct level essentially starving your engine of fuel. This is done through the lamda sensor on the catalytic convertor. I appreciate you do know a fair bit about cars and in the ideal world i would be driving a combination of the digitec schnitzer and hartge kits on an mcs. Unfortunately im driving a mini one.

by the way peak power on the mcs from Rica is 6200 if im correct this isnt above the standard rev limiter???? therefore according to your formula torque must of increased as power = 206 at revs 6200

anyway im not a salesman to this company im just in it to save money

[QQQ]

They'd wish they had max power of 190 hp at 6200 rpm. The first diagram you posted indeed showed max power at 6200 rpm. That's why people asked for the dyno charts which you posted later. If you look at the dyno chart you'll see that max power comes in at about 6700 rpm. Which is about 700 rpms higher than the standard car. Also note that unfortunetly dyno charts don't say anything about gains if we don't have a dyno chart of the standards S on the same dyno and same conditions to compare.

Not trying to bash this ECU mod here, just want to say that chip tuning has its limits. There are a lot of companies out there advertising with high power outputs without mentioning their (minimal) torque gains. This company claims to give you a torque gain of 45 Nm. I tell you that's impossible, where all the other tuners (including well respected tuners like Hartge, AC Schnitzer, Hamann, JCG, etc) have torque gains in the range of 30-40 Nm using an ECU mod and smaller pulley.

I would try to arrange a test drive first before going into a group buy.

[supercoopers]

Antich,

Did you get your car chipped and Rolling Roaded by RICA in the end? If so, what was their service like?

Thanks,

Henry

[antnich]

I should be having it done in two weeks time. I have a mini one but i can let you know what my experiences have been when completed.