MINI2

Paul · Mar 2nd, 2003, 06:06 PM

I know this has been said a few times, and people are all jittery and wondering who says what and when and how....

Well I have just had an email direct from MINI USA, head of communications, and he says:

Quote:

"The 200hp JCW 'S' is coming to the States through MINI dealers. The Cooper version will not be coming. We know that it's the Cooper S that you're all really looking for!"

Kanu · Mar 2nd, 2003, 06:09 PM

Any more details available?

Paul · Mar 2nd, 2003, 08:30 PM

I have sent another email off to MINI USA HQ, and I will keep you posted.

Tom F. · Mar 2nd, 2003, 08:45 PM

I think you are gonna need a whole new forum for this, Paul :-)

ARitz · Mar 2nd, 2003, 11:08 PM

What's the logic behind brining the 'S' conversion but not the Cooper conversion to the states? Expected sales?

I was looking forward to the cooper conversion

. Maybe they are using another company for the Cooper mods

.

-Andrew

Tom F. · Mar 3rd, 2003, 02:23 AM

I'll bet the cost of the MC Works package is too close to the additional cost of an MCS over an MC...just doesn't make economic sense for most people, and the few that would rather stick with an MC would not justify the effort to bring the kit in.

Just my take on it...

911ETR · Mar 3rd, 2003, 02:27 AM

There has been so much speculation about this.... I will believe it when they actually release it. They have said all kinds of stuff in the past year so take this all with a grain of salt.

Wynn · Mar 3rd, 2003, 04:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ARitz
What's the logic behind brining the 'S' conversion but not the Cooper conversion to the states?

In the US market, most of us had never heard of John Cooper before the new MINI came along... and even now, most people here just don't know about the Cooper legacy. So, that name doesn't add a lot of value to the car here, unfortunately, and it'd be really hard to sell a base-model Cooper with an expensive Works package, when you could just get a Cooper S instead for a similar price and better performance, and the other S upgraded features.

I think the bottom line is that the S is a better value, and performance is more important to most US buyers than the John Cooper name is.

(For the same reason, I think the Works upgrade for the S is doomed to fail here, if it's priced the way we expect. The John Cooper name isn't worth a thousand dollars to many people here, beyond some in-the-know enthusiasts, and anyone else will think it's nuts to pay $5000 for 37hp.)

BruceK · Mar 3rd, 2003, 04:28 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ARitz
What's the logic behind brining the 'S' conversion but not the Cooper conversion to the states? Expected sales?
...

My guess is three reasons:

1. In the US the Cooper S is priced just $3000 more then the Cooper -- less then the cost of the JCW Cooper conversion. By buying a Cooper S instead of coverting your standard Cooper, you end up with a whole lot more features and much more engine power in a full factory package.

2. In the UK there is a huge jump in insurance premiums by selecting a stock Cooper S over a stock standard Cooper. A JCW 'tuned' Cooper effectively splits the difference giving a more sporting car over the standard Cooper, but without all of the higher insurance of a Cooper S. In the US, there is no huge insurance difference between the two stock cars, so again the cost vs. performance advantage goes to the Cooper S.

3. In the US, people who want more power, have already chosen the Cooper S over the Cooper, and now they are ready for more.

kmickey · Mar 3rd, 2003, 04:32 AM

I just caught the last few seconds of Autoweek on the Speed Channel about the "Works" upgrade. They were showing under the hood (excuse me - bonnet) some of the upgrades, but I missed it! Dang!! I'm calling my Mini dealer first thing Monday.
Anybody catch what was said on Autoweek about the upgrade?

Mickey

Paul · Mar 3rd, 2003, 06:36 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by 911ETR
There has been so much speculation about this.... I will believe it when they actually release it. They have said all kinds of stuff in the past year so take this all with a grain of salt.

This is why I got this from the head of communications at Woodcliff Lake.

I know how you feel though, which is why I wanted to get it 'from the horses mouth'.

Paul

Paul · Mar 3rd, 2003, 06:42 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by kmickey
I just caught the last few seconds of Autoweek on the Speed Channel about the "Works" upgrade. They were showing under the hood (excuse me - bonnet) some of the upgrades, but I missed it! Dang!! I'm calling my Mini dealer first thing Monday.
Anybody catch what was said on Autoweek about the upgrade?

Mickey

You wont get much more information than I published last week in the following MINI2 news story:

http://www.mini2.com/news/news.php?id=157

911ETR · Mar 3rd, 2003, 07:37 AM

Woodcliff Lake whats that?

Paul · Mar 3rd, 2003, 07:51 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by 911ETR
Woodcliff Lake whats that?

Sorry, that's the place in New Jersey where MINI USA are based.

Paul · Mar 3rd, 2003, 01:13 PM

Regarding pricing etc.

There's no decision been made yet on pricing, availability of options such as the seat and wheels etc. made yet.

I will keep you posted.

Paul

MGB Boy · Mar 3rd, 2003, 10:00 PM

MINI COOPER S JOHN COOPER WORKS PACKAGE DEBUTS IN GENEVA
03/03/2003

Performance Accessory Package to be Available For U.S. Customers This Spring

Woodcliff Lake, NJ March 3, 2003.... At the 2003 Geneva Auto Show, MINI announced an exciting enhancement to the MINI Cooper S for the U.S. market - the John Cooper Works package. The exciting 200 hp. Cooper S package will be coming to our shores this spring.

Developed by the legendary John Cooper Works company, the unique warranted package will be sold exclusively through MINI dealers and will include a reconfigured cylinder head, uprated supercharger along with special engine electronics and a performance rear silencer. This enhancement takes the regular 163hp MINI Cooper S to over 200hp. Detailed U.S. specifications and pricing will be forthcoming.

John Cooper Works is no ordinary aftermarket company. Since the 1940s, the company has produced celebrated racing cars, notably the front-engine Cooper Bristol driven by Fangio and rear engine Coopers for Formula 1, driven by Jack Brabham, Bruce McLaren and Stirling Moss. Under John Cooper's direction, the Cooper Car Company won consecutive Formula 1 Constructors' World Championships in 1959 and 1960.

The Cooper name is forever entwined with MINI, originating with the 1961 MINI Cooper, which was developed by John Cooper. John recognized MINI's inherent motorsport potential and his team produced cars that took numerous race titles, and the MINI Cooper S became the stuff of legend with 3 Monte Carlo Rally wins between 1964 and 1967, driven by greats such as Paddy Hopkirk and Rauno Aaltonen. The Cooper company continues to produce aftermarket parts for the classic MINI and played an active part in the development of the new generation MINI Cooper . John Cooper passed away just as the new car came to market and the company is now run by his son. Michael.

Jack Pitney, general manager of MINI USA said: "We are thrilled to be bringing this exciting package to the U.S. Mini's regular specification cars are exhilarating to drive in themselves, but the addition of this unique package takes the MINI experience to a whole new level."

Note: The Cooper version of the John Cooper package will not be offered for sale in the U.S. market.

Paul · Mar 3rd, 2003, 10:50 PM

This is the same (basically) as the Canadian, UK, and other BMW Press releases, only with Jack Pitney's comments added, the fact the Cooper isn't coming is the same I posted earlier, which I had 'from the horses mouth' yesterday.

What I think you all want is.....

PRICES!?

I have been told I will be told as soon as there is news on price from MINI USA HQ Direct.

Paul

pbraun · Mar 4th, 2003, 01:13 AM

Right, then.

I'll take two, please.

Garfield · Mar 4th, 2003, 12:50 PM

Here you go folks. Will have real HP and Torque figures plus cost soon:

Already published Garfield, see post just a few above.

BigM · Mar 5th, 2003, 11:01 AM

After so much excitement over the JCW announcements I called my dealer, Mini of Nashville, and spoke to the parts guy, Bob, he said that they have had no word yet as to when they will begin selling and installing the JCW version. He also said that the Dinan upgrades are still in the works but will probably be "held back" until late summer. He is a big Dinan guy and thinks that Dinan wants to see where the JCW version is as far as performance vs price before they take their product to the market. I myself will go for the best bang for the buck.

Mar 2nd, 2003, 06:06 PM	#1
Paul Trained Monkey My Classifieds Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Bedfordshire Local Time: 09:37 AM Posts: 41,214 Offline	USA MINI Dealerships WILL offer John Cooper Works Conversion I know this has been said a few times, and people are all jittery and wondering who says what and when and how.... Well I have just had an email direct from MINI USA, head of communications, and he says: Quote: "The 200hp JCW 'S' is coming to the States through MINI dealers. The Cooper version will not be coming. We know that it's the Cooper S that you're all really looking for!" There aint no party like my nana's tea party

Mar 2nd, 2003, 06:09 PM	#2 (permalink)
Kanu MINI2 Newbie Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Hawaii Local Time: 10:37 PM Posts: 19 Offline	JCW Conversion Any more details available?

Mar 2nd, 2003, 08:30 PM	#3 (permalink)
Paul Trained Monkey My Classifieds Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Bedfordshire Local Time: 09:37 AM Posts: 41,214 Offline	I have sent another email off to MINI USA HQ, and I will keep you posted. There aint no party like my nana's tea party

Mar 2nd, 2003, 08:45 PM	#4 (permalink)
Tom F. MINI2 Regular Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Near Washington DC Local Time: 04:37 AM Posts: 315 Offline	I think you are gonna need a whole new forum for this, Paul :-) Tom F. EB/W "S" delivered Aug 30

Mar 3rd, 2003, 02:23 AM	#6 (permalink)
Tom F. MINI2 Regular Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Near Washington DC Local Time: 04:37 AM Posts: 315 Offline	I'll bet the cost of the MC Works package is too close to the additional cost of an MCS over an MC...just doesn't make economic sense for most people, and the few that would rather stick with an MC would not justify the effort to bring the kit in. Just my take on it... Tom F. EB/W "S" delivered Aug 30

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Mar 2nd, 2003, 11:08 PM	#5 (permalink)
ARitz MINI2 Regular Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Hudson,Ohio Local Time: 12:37 AM Posts: 193 Offline	What's the logic behind brining the 'S' conversion but not the Cooper conversion to the states? Expected sales? I was looking forward to the cooper conversion . Maybe they are using another company for the Cooper mods . -Andrew

Mar 3rd, 2003, 02:27 AM	#7 (permalink)
911ETR MINI2 Senior Join Date: Oct 2002 Local Time: 12:37 AM Posts: 609 Offline	There has been so much speculation about this.... I will believe it when they actually release it. They have said all kinds of stuff in the past year so take this all with a grain of salt.

Mar 3rd, 2003, 04:22 AM	#8 (permalink)
Wynn MINI2 Senior Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Houston, Texas Local Time: 02:37 AM Posts: 597 Offline	Quote: Originally posted by ARitz What's the logic behind brining the 'S' conversion but not the Cooper conversion to the states? In the US market, most of us had never heard of John Cooper before the new MINI came along... and even now, most people here just don't know about the Cooper legacy. So, that name doesn't add a lot of value to the car here, unfortunately, and it'd be really hard to sell a base-model Cooper with an expensive Works package, when you could just get a Cooper S instead for a similar price and better performance, and the other S upgraded features. I think the bottom line is that the S is a better value, and performance is more important to most US buyers than the John Cooper name is. (For the same reason, I think the Works upgrade for the S is doomed to fail here, if it's priced the way we expect. The John Cooper name isn't worth a thousand dollars to many people here, beyond some in-the-know enthusiasts, and anyone else will think it's nuts to pay $5000 for 37hp.)

Mar 3rd, 2003, 04:28 AM	#9 (permalink)
BruceK Moderator & Sponsor Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: San Antonio, Texas Local Time: 02:37 AM Posts: 3,759 Offline	Quote: Originally posted by ARitz What's the logic behind brining the 'S' conversion but not the Cooper conversion to the states? Expected sales? ... My guess is three reasons: 1. In the US the Cooper S is priced just $3000 more then the Cooper -- less then the cost of the JCW Cooper conversion. By buying a Cooper S instead of coverting your standard Cooper, you end up with a whole lot more features and much more engine power in a full factory package. 2. In the UK there is a huge jump in insurance premiums by selecting a stock Cooper S over a stock standard Cooper. A JCW 'tuned' Cooper effectively splits the difference giving a more sporting car over the standard Cooper, but without all of the higher insurance of a Cooper S. In the US, there is no huge insurance difference between the two stock cars, so again the cost vs. performance advantage goes to the Cooper S. 3. In the US, people who want more power, have already chosen the Cooper S over the Cooper, and now they are ready for more. + 2002 MINI Cooper S - Dark Silver / White roof, Sport, Premium, Lapis blue leather + 1965 Mini Traveller - Tartan Red / White roof, 1275, Cooper S discs, fully restored/renewed

Mar 3rd, 2003, 04:32 AM	#10 (permalink)
kmickey MINI2 Regular Join Date: Jan 2003 Local Time: 01:37 AM Posts: 66 Offline	Factory Installed, BMW warrantied John Cooper Upgrade I just caught the last few seconds of Autoweek on the Speed Channel about the "Works" upgrade. They were showing under the hood (excuse me - bonnet) some of the upgrades, but I missed it! Dang!! I'm calling my Mini dealer first thing Monday. Anybody catch what was said on Autoweek about the upgrade? Mickey IB/W MCS

Mar 3rd, 2003, 06:36 AM	#11 (permalink)
Paul Trained Monkey My Classifieds Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Bedfordshire Local Time: 09:37 AM Posts: 41,214 Offline	Quote: Originally posted by 911ETR There has been so much speculation about this.... I will believe it when they actually release it. They have said all kinds of stuff in the past year so take this all with a grain of salt. This is why I got this from the head of communications at Woodcliff Lake. I know how you feel though, which is why I wanted to get it 'from the horses mouth'. Paul There aint no party like my nana's tea party

Mar 3rd, 2003, 06:42 AM	#12 (permalink)
Paul Trained Monkey My Classifieds Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Bedfordshire Local Time: 09:37 AM Posts: 41,214 Offline	Re: Factory Installed, BMW warrantied John Cooper Upgrade Quote: Originally posted by kmickey I just caught the last few seconds of Autoweek on the Speed Channel about the "Works" upgrade. They were showing under the hood (excuse me - bonnet) some of the upgrades, but I missed it! Dang!! I'm calling my Mini dealer first thing Monday. Anybody catch what was said on Autoweek about the upgrade? Mickey You wont get much more information than I published last week in the following MINI2 news story: http://www.mini2.com/news/news.php?id=157 There aint no party like my nana's tea party

Mar 3rd, 2003, 07:37 AM	#13 (permalink)
911ETR MINI2 Senior Join Date: Oct 2002 Local Time: 12:37 AM Posts: 609 Offline	Woodcliff Lake whats that?

Mar 3rd, 2003, 07:51 AM	#14 (permalink)
Paul Trained Monkey My Classifieds Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Bedfordshire Local Time: 09:37 AM Posts: 41,214 Offline	Quote: Originally posted by 911ETR Woodcliff Lake whats that? Sorry, that's the place in New Jersey where MINI USA are based. There aint no party like my nana's tea party

Mar 3rd, 2003, 01:13 PM	#15 (permalink)
Paul Trained Monkey My Classifieds Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Bedfordshire Local Time: 09:37 AM Posts: 41,214 Offline	Regarding pricing etc. There's no decision been made yet on pricing, availability of options such as the seat and wheels etc. made yet. I will keep you posted. Paul There aint no party like my nana's tea party

Mar 3rd, 2003, 10:00 PM	#16 (permalink)
MGB Boy heterochromic & loving it Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: at the rink Local Time: 04:37 AM Posts: 4,237 Offline	Official U.S. JCW Announcement MINI COOPER S JOHN COOPER WORKS PACKAGE DEBUTS IN GENEVA 03/03/2003 Performance Accessory Package to be Available For U.S. Customers This Spring Woodcliff Lake, NJ March 3, 2003.... At the 2003 Geneva Auto Show, MINI announced an exciting enhancement to the MINI Cooper S for the U.S. market - the John Cooper Works package. The exciting 200 hp. Cooper S package will be coming to our shores this spring. Developed by the legendary John Cooper Works company, the unique warranted package will be sold exclusively through MINI dealers and will include a reconfigured cylinder head, uprated supercharger along with special engine electronics and a performance rear silencer. This enhancement takes the regular 163hp MINI Cooper S to over 200hp. Detailed U.S. specifications and pricing will be forthcoming. John Cooper Works is no ordinary aftermarket company. Since the 1940s, the company has produced celebrated racing cars, notably the front-engine Cooper Bristol driven by Fangio and rear engine Coopers for Formula 1, driven by Jack Brabham, Bruce McLaren and Stirling Moss. Under John Cooper's direction, the Cooper Car Company won consecutive Formula 1 Constructors' World Championships in 1959 and 1960. The Cooper name is forever entwined with MINI, originating with the 1961 MINI Cooper, which was developed by John Cooper. John recognized MINI's inherent motorsport potential and his team produced cars that took numerous race titles, and the MINI Cooper S became the stuff of legend with 3 Monte Carlo Rally wins between 1964 and 1967, driven by greats such as Paddy Hopkirk and Rauno Aaltonen. The Cooper company continues to produce aftermarket parts for the classic MINI and played an active part in the development of the new generation MINI Cooper . John Cooper passed away just as the new car came to market and the company is now run by his son. Michael. Jack Pitney, general manager of MINI USA said: "We are thrilled to be bringing this exciting package to the U.S. Mini's regular specification cars are exhilarating to drive in themselves, but the addition of this unique package takes the MINI experience to a whole new level." Note: The Cooper version of the John Cooper package will not be offered for sale in the U.S. market. 06 MCS-W/77 MGB/69 MGB-GT "2 minutes by yourself and...you feel shame, you know...and then you get free"

Mar 3rd, 2003, 10:50 PM	#17 (permalink)
Paul Trained Monkey My Classifieds Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Bedfordshire Local Time: 09:37 AM Posts: 41,214 Offline	This is the same (basically) as the Canadian, UK, and other BMW Press releases, only with Jack Pitney's comments added, the fact the Cooper isn't coming is the same I posted earlier, which I had 'from the horses mouth' yesterday. What I think you all want is..... PRICES!? I have been told I will be told as soon as there is news on price from MINI USA HQ Direct. Paul There aint no party like my nana's tea party

Mar 4th, 2003, 01:13 AM	#18 (permalink)
pbraun Summer Splasher Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: in or near my MINI Local Time: 04:37 AM Posts: 665 Offline	Right, then. I'll take two, please. Ride on: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w4l65QGCGzY BLOG: http://peterbraunblog.wordpress.com

Mar 4th, 2003, 12:50 PM	#19 (permalink)
Garfield MINI2 Master Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Mt. Airy, MD USA Local Time: 03:37 AM Posts: 791 Offline	Here you go folks. Will have real HP and Torque figures plus cost soon: Already published Garfield, see post just a few above. - 2005 G Stock '05 MINI or it's back to a Miata in C Stock - 2004 G Stock 2nd place Pro Solo, 9th Place Solo II - 2003 STX 5th place Pro Solo, 6th Place Solo II - 2002 H Stock Pro Solo National Champion Last edited by Paul : Mar 4th, 2003 at 01:02 PM.

Mar 5th, 2003, 11:01 AM	#20 (permalink)
BigM MINI2 Regular Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: murfreesboro Tn Local Time: 02:37 AM Posts: 132 Offline	Dinan or JCW? After so much excitement over the JCW announcements I called my dealer, Mini of Nashville, and spoke to the parts guy, Bob, he said that they have had no word yet as to when they will begin selling and installing the JCW version. He also said that the Dinan upgrades are still in the works but will probably be "held back" until late summer. He is a big Dinan guy and thinks that Dinan wants to see where the JCW version is as far as performance vs price before they take their product to the market. I myself will go for the best bang for the buck.

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