MINI2

GTT 280 · Oct 6th, 2004, 12:41 PM

Hi,

Can anybody confirm the following...

JCW garage stated some time back that the airbox should not be replaced due to increased airflow and strain on the injectors.

Now the new JCW kit has a flap that opens - is this correct ?
Are the injectors modified to cope with the increased airflow ?

Thanks,
CSW.

phaedrus · Oct 6th, 2004, 01:36 PM

Yes, the flap opens at 4500 rpm -- where greater airflow is actually needed -- drawing air from under the left pollen bezel. But that's all the intake really is -- the stock intake with an added flap, actuator, and JCW logo. I'm assuming they chose this 'cost-effective' way in order to keep the JCW kit's price in check.

That's a good point about the strain on the injectors, though -- I've always wondered if there were any such issues with adding an after-market intake, as well as why JCW initially did not choose to modify theirs.

During some independent testing, an acquaintance with the previous JCW package installed found that the fuel mixture ran too rich at high throttle. This likely means that not enough air is mixing with the fuel for proper combustion. Naturally he opted for an after-market air intake and the problem quickly went away.

GTT 280 · Oct 6th, 2004, 01:41 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by phaedrus

Yes, the flap opens at 4500 rpm -- where greater airflow is actually needed -- drawing air from under the left pollen bezel. But that's all the intake really is -- the stock intake with an added flap, actuator, and JCW logo. I'm assuming they chose this 'cost-effective' way in order to keep the JCW kit's price in check.

That's a good point about the strain on the injectors, though -- I've always wondered if there were any such issues with adding an after-market intake, as well as why JCW initially did not choose to modify theirs.

During some independent testing, an acquaintance with the previous JCW package installed found that the fuel mixture ran too rich at high throttle. This likely means that not enough air is mixing with the fuel for proper combustion. Naturally he opted for an after-market air intake and the problem quickly went away.

Hi - interested how you determine that the fuel mixture if high or low. Do you connect your laptop to the car and run software that reads the output from the ECU ? You'd think a multi-billion pound business would get all this correct ???

obehave · Oct 6th, 2004, 02:47 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by phaedrus

Yes, the flap opens at 4500 rpm -- where greater airflow is actually needed -- drawing air from under the left pollen bezel. But that's all the intake really is -- the stock intake with an added flap, actuator, and JCW logo. I'm assuming they chose this 'cost-effective' way in order to keep the JCW kit's price in check.

That's a good point about the strain on the injectors, though -- I've always wondered if there were any such issues with adding an after-market intake, as well as why JCW initially did not choose to modify theirs.

During some independent testing, an acquaintance with the previous JCW package installed found that the fuel mixture ran too rich at high throttle. This likely means that not enough air is mixing with the fuel for proper combustion. Naturally he opted for an after-market air intake and the problem quickly went away.

That last bit is a little contrary to a lot of information that has been posted here.
The MINI runs rich, period.
Intake, exhaust, 15% pulley and throttle body on one and it'll still run rich. The rich mixture is intentional at full boost and is used to help cool the supercharger.
Just changing out an intake isn't really going to make much difference.

The stock injectors seem to be fine at 200 or so BHP.

GTT 280 · Oct 6th, 2004, 02:53 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by obehave

That last bit is a little contrary to a lot of information that has been posted here.
The MINI runs rich, period.
Intake, exhaust, 15% pulley and throttle body on one and it'll still run rich. The rich mixture is intentional at full boost and is used to help cool the supercharger.
Just changing out an intake isn't really going to make much difference.

The stock injectors seem to be fine at 200 or so BHP.

So increased airflow is fine then....
....and furthermore, how do people analyse all of this? - can i buy software for my laptop ?

obehave · Oct 6th, 2004, 03:08 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by Cooper S Works

So increased airflow is fine then....
....and furthermore, how do people analyse all of this? - can i buy software for my laptop ?

Increased airflow up to the usual mod level( what I listed above basically) is fine.
At a minimum a wideband O2 sensor and a good gauge will get you decent A/F ratio data.
There's many far more knowledgeable people than me here. Andy@Ross-Tech.com is very good and has posted a number of times about the wideband O2 sensor.

jwardell · Oct 6th, 2004, 04:24 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by obehave

The rich mixture is intentional at full boost and is used to help cool the supercharger.

For that to be true, the gas would have to be injected into the air stream before the S/C. Perhaps you meant engine. Many ECUs will richen the mixture when the engine starts to overheat to help cool it.

obehave · Oct 6th, 2004, 07:28 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by jwardell

For that to be true, the gas would have to be injected into the air stream before the S/C. Perhaps you meant engine. Many ECUs will richen the mixture when the engine starts to overheat to help cool it.

Ooops. Air charge

You're correct, the intent is to cool the air charge to help suppress any detonation tendencies.

Oct 6th, 2004, 12:41 PM	#1
GTT 280 The Power Cube My Classifieds Join Date: Jan 2002 Local Time: 06:14 AM Posts: 2,489 Offline	MCS Works Air intake Hi, Can anybody confirm the following... JCW garage stated some time back that the airbox should not be replaced due to increased airflow and strain on the injectors. Now the new JCW kit has a flap that opens - is this correct ? Are the injectors modified to cope with the increased airflow ? Thanks, CSW.

Oct 6th, 2004, 01:36 PM	#2 (permalink)
phaedrus MINI2 Irregular Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Toronto Local Time: 01:14 AM Posts: 48 Offline	JCW air intake Yes, the flap opens at 4500 rpm -- where greater airflow is actually needed -- drawing air from under the left pollen bezel. But that's all the intake really is -- the stock intake with an added flap, actuator, and JCW logo. I'm assuming they chose this 'cost-effective' way in order to keep the JCW kit's price in check. That's a good point about the strain on the injectors, though -- I've always wondered if there were any such issues with adding an after-market intake, as well as why JCW initially did not choose to modify theirs. During some independent testing, an acquaintance with the previous JCW package installed found that the fuel mixture ran too rich at high throttle. This likely means that not enough air is mixing with the fuel for proper combustion. Naturally he opted for an after-market air intake and the problem quickly went away.

Oct 6th, 2004, 04:24 PM	#7 (permalink)
jwardell MINI2 Master Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Newton, MA Local Time: 01:14 AM Posts: 5,430 Online	Quote: Originally Posted by obehave The rich mixture is intentional at full boost and is used to help cool the supercharger. For that to be true, the gas would have to be injected into the air stream before the S/C. Perhaps you meant engine. Many ECUs will richen the mixture when the engine starts to overheat to help cool it. http://www.jwardell.com/mini/

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Oct 6th, 2004, 01:41 PM	#3 (permalink)
GTT 280 The Power Cube My Classifieds Join Date: Jan 2002 Local Time: 06:14 AM Posts: 2,489 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by phaedrus Yes, the flap opens at 4500 rpm -- where greater airflow is actually needed -- drawing air from under the left pollen bezel. But that's all the intake really is -- the stock intake with an added flap, actuator, and JCW logo. I'm assuming they chose this 'cost-effective' way in order to keep the JCW kit's price in check. That's a good point about the strain on the injectors, though -- I've always wondered if there were any such issues with adding an after-market intake, as well as why JCW initially did not choose to modify theirs. During some independent testing, an acquaintance with the previous JCW package installed found that the fuel mixture ran too rich at high throttle. This likely means that not enough air is mixing with the fuel for proper combustion. Naturally he opted for an after-market air intake and the problem quickly went away. Hi - interested how you determine that the fuel mixture if high or low. Do you connect your laptop to the car and run software that reads the output from the ECU ? You'd think a multi-billion pound business would get all this correct ???

Oct 6th, 2004, 02:47 PM	#4 (permalink)
obehave Mini Mod Join Date: Sep 2002 Local Time: 01:14 AM Posts: 9,388 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by phaedrus Yes, the flap opens at 4500 rpm -- where greater airflow is actually needed -- drawing air from under the left pollen bezel. But that's all the intake really is -- the stock intake with an added flap, actuator, and JCW logo. I'm assuming they chose this 'cost-effective' way in order to keep the JCW kit's price in check. That's a good point about the strain on the injectors, though -- I've always wondered if there were any such issues with adding an after-market intake, as well as why JCW initially did not choose to modify theirs. During some independent testing, an acquaintance with the previous JCW package installed found that the fuel mixture ran too rich at high throttle. This likely means that not enough air is mixing with the fuel for proper combustion. Naturally he opted for an after-market air intake and the problem quickly went away. That last bit is a little contrary to a lot of information that has been posted here. The MINI runs rich, period. Intake, exhaust, 15% pulley and throttle body on one and it'll still run rich. The rich mixture is intentional at full boost and is used to help cool the supercharger. Just changing out an intake isn't really going to make much difference. The stock injectors seem to be fine at 200 or so BHP.

Oct 6th, 2004, 02:53 PM	#5 (permalink)
GTT 280 The Power Cube My Classifieds Join Date: Jan 2002 Local Time: 06:14 AM Posts: 2,489 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by obehave That last bit is a little contrary to a lot of information that has been posted here. The MINI runs rich, period. Intake, exhaust, 15% pulley and throttle body on one and it'll still run rich. The rich mixture is intentional at full boost and is used to help cool the supercharger. Just changing out an intake isn't really going to make much difference. The stock injectors seem to be fine at 200 or so BHP. So increased airflow is fine then.... ....and furthermore, how do people analyse all of this? - can i buy software for my laptop ?

Oct 6th, 2004, 03:08 PM	#6 (permalink)
obehave Mini Mod Join Date: Sep 2002 Local Time: 01:14 AM Posts: 9,388 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by Cooper S Works So increased airflow is fine then.... ....and furthermore, how do people analyse all of this? - can i buy software for my laptop ? Increased airflow up to the usual mod level( what I listed above basically) is fine. At a minimum a wideband O2 sensor and a good gauge will get you decent A/F ratio data. There's many far more knowledgeable people than me here. Andy@Ross-Tech.com is very good and has posted a number of times about the wideband O2 sensor.

Oct 6th, 2004, 07:28 PM	#8 (permalink)
obehave Mini Mod Join Date: Sep 2002 Local Time: 01:14 AM Posts: 9,388 Offline	Quote: Originally Posted by jwardell For that to be true, the gas would have to be injected into the air stream before the S/C. Perhaps you meant engine. Many ECUs will richen the mixture when the engine starts to overheat to help cool it. Ooops. Air charge You're correct, the intent is to cool the air charge to help suppress any detonation tendencies.

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