[mayek]

Hello!

I'm seriously thinking of getting a Cooper and sticking with the 15" wheels. I'm not bothered about what it looks like, just the driving really. Do 16"'s actually help you go around corners any better?

If anyone has gone for a modestly-wheeled Cooper I'ld be interested to know your thoughts.

Thanks!

[Bonjour]

I'm staying with the 15's on my Cooper, which should be arriving in about 4 weeks. I like the retro look of the 15's, plus the car should actually go faster with the smaller wheels.

[TheBlackKnight]

There is some difference between the 16s and the 15s (suprisingly more than I expected to find) in terms of road-holding and grip, but it's whether you want to pay the extra money. I've ridden on the 8-spoke 15s for the last 18 months now, and they've done really well - I'm moving up to the 16s soon and fitting some lowering springs, to improve the handling, but that's personal taste more than anything else.

Personally, I would say that if you're on a budget, stick with the 15s. The designs for that size wheel are great as well!

[mayek]

Thanks for the feedback. Sounds like you tried both?

I guess I was also curious about the style of the handling. I mean when grip does run out are the 15's any more progressive when they let go?

[Moogy]

Maybe folks could add what suspension setup they have too? I'm waiting for my Cooper with 7-Hole Imolas and SS+. In my case it's not whether I want to pay the extra money - I'm just flat out not allowed anything other than standard 15" wheels on my car (company car restrictions)...

I've only driven Coopers with the 16" wheels so far, and am really hoping I'm not in for a let-down when I get mine, although when I asked about it here a while back people seemed to think I shouldn't worry. Anybody able to add anything? BlackKnight just how different did you find them? Can you expand on your experience?

[stephen_cy_wong]

I find the 15" tires to narrow, i think they are 175mm compared to 195mm on 16".

I also think the 15" tires will start understeering earlier than the 16", unless you put bigger rubber on the 15" wheels

[scooterboy]

Can anyone comment on the difference in ride harshness between the 15" radials and the 16" run-flats?

Don't the 15s have a much softer ride (over bumps, etc)?

I'm getting ready to order one and my plan is to stick with the 15s because this will be my commuting car and I value comfort over racing maneuverability. But if the difference in ride quality is minimal, I might go for the 16s because they do look better.

Yes, I know handling is what the MINI is known for, but I just want one as a commuting car.

Thanks!

[daanesh]

it depends on what's more important to you

if you want more grip and the direct feel the stiffer sizdewalls give, the 16s are the way to go.

i prefer the 15s for the following reasons:

*better steering feel/tracking
*the lower limits are more accessible
*they are not run flat so tires are lighter (all else being equal)
*steering not as lifeless at low speeds
*there is grip aplenty
*the 15's swallow impacts with a muted thud, not a sharper whack (although the 16s are quite livable compared to the 17s)
*they make the sport + suspension more livable - i'd rather have the handling balance of the + suspension than the grip of the 16s (and find both together to lack BMW level refinment).
*its more gratifying to outhandle heavier cars on 'lowly' 15s
*the reduced rotational inertia does quicken responses
*most of all, there is none of the jitteriness you get with the 16" run-flats

one things for sure, driving will do more for you than asking : )

[scooterboy]

Thanks daanesh,

More info I should have mentioned:

I'm test-driving this weekend.
My plan is to NOT get the SS+ (again, for the softer ride)

Another question: If I don't get SS+ and stick with 15s and the ride is still to harsh for me, is there such a thing as aftermarket shocks/springs that will soften the ride even more?

I know I sound like a wuss, but some of us want MINIS for the style and features, not to take corners at 50mph.

[rogerswt]

I have the MCS which came with the 17" wheels and Dunlop 9000 run flats. I took delivery in October, drove the car for a couple of months, then switched to 15" with stock Continental Touring all seasons for the winter months. I just went back to the Dunlops and the 17's this weekend.

After driving both sets, I have to say that unless you are autocrossing, you're not going to notice much of a difference. The 15's handled fine during even the most aggressive city driving, and allowed me to navigate the snow and ice this winter in St Louis. The 17's are heavier (see previous posts on this topic) but I'll be damned if I could really feel it this weekend after I put them back on the car. The 17's I have tend to tramline a bit more than the 15's, but in a car this light, you're going to tramline with ANY tire.

Bottom line, unless you're racing, go with what you think looks best on the car and/or can afford and enjoy it! The car's a kick either way!

[edlfrey]

Quote:

Originally posted by scooterboy
Another question: If I don't get SS+ and stick with 15s and the ride is still to harsh for me, is there such a thing as aftermarket shocks/springs that will soften the ride even more?

I know I sound like a wuss, but some of us want MINIS for the style and features, not to take corners at 50mph.

Taking corners at 50mph in "style" is a "feature" of the MINI.

I have the 15" standard suspension and it is not harsh in my opinion. Compared to a 1990 Toyota Celica that I once owned it is only slightly more so.

The short wheel base is going to give you a little harsher ride but adding spongy springs and shocks will kill the joy of driving the MINI. This is my opinion but I think many MINI owners will agree.

[scooterboy]

rogerswt: Not to discount your experience, but I've read many posts in these forums in which people talk about the degree of ride difference between the 15s, 16s, and then the 17s. My impression is that the differences are fairly noticable, especially when going from the radial 15s to the run-flats. The difference between the SS ans SS+ also figures in there. Whether the differences are slight or major, I'm still opting for the least harsh configuration.

edlfrey: I appreciate your description of the SS/15s combination. If my test-drive is as you describe, I'll be happy with that. I expect some harshness, and that's ok - I just don't my bones rattled when driving over a small bump. Also, I do look forward to cornering at 50mph, it's just not first on my priority list.

I'm sure I'll find it all satisfactory when I give it a go this weekend.

Thanks to all!

[rogerswt]

Scooterboy

Gotta agree with you - lots of posts about the differences between wheels out here - but I just can't tell the difference in daily driving. I'm sure that throwing the car around on the twisties or on the track brings out the differences, but around town, its nil.

Of course, I can't hear the difference's between audio specs like 0.01 and 0.001 THD either. Maybe my body is just not as in touch with the cosmic physics of wheel diameters as other MINI owners, but in city traffic, I just can't sense the difference between the wheels.

[MiniMayhem]

From test drives I felt that there was hardly any difference between the 15" and 16" wheels in terms of ride and perhaps handling (though the 16" test drive was a short one), though the ride is very slightly bouncier with the 16" run flats. I have decided to stick with the Pepper Pack with the 15" wheels after a protracted test drive since I love the ride/handling combination of this setup for general everyday use and it saves money

[Moogy]

I'd just like to say thanks to those who have taken the time to post their experience on this subject here

It's not always easy or possible to test drive all the available setups (and aren't we lucky there are so many to choose from!), so feedback like this is invaluable for those of us trying to hone our ideal spec.

Cheers everybody!

Moogy

9 weeks to go...

[TBDAugs]

Runflats (standard with the 16 inch wheels and sport suspension) have a much stiffer sidewall than the 15 inch stock tires do. So for sure the standard 15 inch wheels shod with the stock rubber make for a smoother ride. This is the set up on my wife's 2002 MC. Mine has the ss plus and 16 wheels with Yoko A520's (Hoosiers when I race on the R84 OEM xlite 16 wheel). The Yoko's have as stiff a sidewall construction as the Runflats do. A stiff sidewall aids cornering, but unless you are autocrossing or otherwise racing, most people won't notice the cornering difference since the stock suspension is great stuff to begin with.

Another thing to consider, the 15 inch wheels with the stock rubber actually are significantly lighter in unsprung weight than the stock 16 inch wheels, or even the R84 X lite OEM wheel (Which I use in autocrossing). So they will accelerate faster. What you loose with the 15 inch wheel is wider tires that ultimately help with cornering and applying power to the ground, particularly with power on out of slow corners, when the tires tend to spin.

My 2 cents

AXAugs

[Moogy]

So to echo a question I've posted in the wheels forum, will a 195/60 or 205/55 tyre fit on the stock 15x5.5 rims, or are they too narrow? And what would be the effect on handling? Grip would obviously be higher but what of turn-in, feel etc?

[scooterboy]

This is just the kind of info I was hoping to get. Thanks, everyone.

TBDAugs, can you or your wife offer any ride (not handling) comparisons between her config and other cars that either of you have driven in the past? Also, do you find that the suspension feels differently after a break-in period?

And great question, Moogy. I'd be interested to know that as well.

[ti92man]

You won't go any faster with smaller tires. On the contrary, you will in fact travel less distance per engine revolution as your tire size decreases. Look at it this way: if the engine rotates once per tire rotation (hypothetically), then at one rpm, on 15-inch tires you will travel roughly 47" per minute, 50" on 16's, and 53" on 17's. The tach and speedo will read higher speeds as your tire size decreases as well, so recalibration is necessary if you change sizes unless you are keen on the *illusion* of travelling faster. Hey, works for me.

I remember a review of the MINI in which the reviewer felt the big pitfall was the harshness of the ride with runflats. In my S, I pay it no mind since I don't really recall the test drive in a non-runflat MINI and remembering it will only detract from my current motoring experiences . I have the 17" runflats. I suppose sometime I will decide that high cost and relative lack of availability of these tires will outweigh the convenience and I may purchase new tires all around, saving free space in the boot for a spare!
But that's waaaay far down the road. Lots of great motoring time between now and then!

[goin440]

I have a MC with standard suspension and based 15s. IMO the ride is fine. A lot softer than the truck I had before.

Most of the "stiffer" ride is from the stiff sidewalls runflats require. I've heard rumors (friend-of-a-friend type thing who knows someone with a Coop..truth?) of option-loaded Coopers with dealer 17s and runflats busting windows. Also, upsized wheels usually have smaller tire sidewalls, making the tire stiffer.

I agree with the majority of the posts. Unless you are going to push the limits, you'll probably never see a difference. Ridewise, I dunno. I have 15s, but would like to go to lighter 17s. I've driven an MCS with 16s and SS+ and couldn't tell. Maybe more "thuds," but I was paying more attention to the charger pull.

If you like 16s, go with them. 15s are good too. As long as you have four of the same and all stay grounded, you should be fine. Its all personal tastes anyway.