[oasist]

This saddens me greatly to make this post, to the point where I nearly feel like I have lost a wonderful friend.

In opening, I would like to say how wonderful Mini USA has been to me over the past 3 seasons with their support at Mini USA with contingency through their Motor Sports division as well as the wonderful service at Baron Mini here in the KC area. If it had not been for the support by Mini USA through their Motor Sports contingency division, I would not have been able to travel across the country competing at National Tours and Prosolo's in my 2004, 2005 and 2006 Mini Cooper S's as well as numerous other competitors 2005 and 2006 Mini Cooper S's. During these three seasons, I have had great success competing in Mini's with 15 National Tour/Prosolo wins, something like 25 podium finishes at NT's and Prosolo's with one National Championship and a 2nd place at Nationals in 2007.

So, for 2007, I decided I would purchase a new 2007 Turbo Mini Cooper S. I actually signed the paperwork on the purchase at the end of September thinking I would probably keep this one for quite a while since I enjoyed the R56 so much.

Anyway, when I took my Mini in for the oil change a couple weeks ago to Baron Mini, I mentioned to them that I had a very annoying squeak in the clutch mechanism when the cabin was warm from the heater. To my horror, when Baron called me to let me know that my car was finished, here was the basic scope of the message that my service advisor had left for me......

Hi Craig, this is XXXXX from Baron, your car is all set to go here with its service, we replaced the oil, the micro filter and the other first scheduled service.... ....."But, on the other item with the clutch, we can't do any work on that item, (the list says)not warrantable due to racing, not warrantable due to racing, warranty voided by Jeff White, its on the vehicle history, the dealer communication History, saying vehicle used at racing competition events, repairs or defects not covered by BMW warranty, date posted 11/7/07"

Amazed that this is now January and I had never been notified that my warranty was cancelled, I hopped on the phone for a quick call to the dealer, but, I was thinking to myself that surely there is a mis-conception to what I have been doing over the past several seasons, I remember thinking, "these guys think that I have raced my Mini on a track or something". I was concerned, but, figured with one phone call we could get things worked out. So, I decided to just call the dealership and talk to the service manager about it thinking we could get things cleared up easily enough. This was on a Friday afternoon, and, the service manager said he would call this Jeff White and see if he could get this cleared up, but, that this was something initiated by Mini USA, not the dealership, but, anything non-mechanical would still be covered(so, when I say warranty voided, I am referring to engine, tranny, suspension, anything moving). I decided to also call the head of the Mini USA Motorsports guy, Vincent K, and speak to him about this since the previous Mini USA Motorsports guy Jeff S said my warranty would never be canceled due to autocrossing since I had expressed my concern over this during one of our conversations that we had last year. I was delighted to find that Vincent fully supported me and actually knew my name from the several contingency submissions I had made throughout the past season in various Mini's that I had competed in, none of which were my own besides the National Championship where I placed 2nd this season in GS. He actually seemed very upset that this Jeff White was messing with me. He also said that there was noone who had access to my contingency submissions, so, it wasn't something that came from the contingency submissions, it must have came from somewhere else. So, I called the dealer back and requested that they let me know why they thought I had "raced" my car, since first off, I didn't consider autocross racing. The dealer didn't know where Jeff White got the idea that I raced, but, there was one note that indicated that the proof was from Nationals Results. I still was convinced that they were thinking I was racing my Mini on a track. I received a call back from Vincent and he mentioned to me that he was going to speak with Jeff Whites boss on the following Monday to see if he could get this sorted out and he also mentioned that this started at the dealership level and it didn't come from Mini USA, he promised to get back to me the following day though. Unfortunately, thats the last time I have spoken with Vincent and I still have yet to hear from Jeff White and it has been nearly 2 weeks. This is what takes the cake though, my dealer calls me today and starts reading off contingency submissions emailed to him from Vincent K from Mini USA Motorsports division as proof that I raced my vehicle which they are now using to void my warranty on anything other than non-mechanical items. He also received an email from the Jeff White guy that initially got this thing rolling, he said they stood by their stance. I was able to convince my dealer to replace the clutch mechanism last week luckily though since he believed the fact that an autocross event wasn't the cause of the pedal to squeak, but, he is worried that he possibly won't get paid for the repair and probably won't since Mini USA has taken this aggressive stance to void my warranty on my brand new Mini.

Bottom line is, I have gone out there across the country and have supported MiniUSA in a partnership to the best of my ability and I feel I have been stabbed in the back. Why would they void my warranty on a brand new Mini with someone who has promoted Mini USA by doing what they advertise you can do when you purchase a Mini? I autocrossed one event, Nationals, since I signed the paperwork. And, they are using this as grounds to void my warranty on anything other than non-mechanical items? This is just flat WRONG!!!

All I can say is, Mini owners BEWARE! Think twice before buying a Mini, and, if you autocross it, make sure you don't submit contingency on it if you want to keep your warranty! I never thought I would ever be in this position with Mini. I love their product but am now being forced to hate their aggressive, careless actions towards me with voiding my warranty on my BRAND NEW MINI! I have refrained from making this public until now, I have simply exhausted all avenues of communication with Mini USA representatives since they only care to communicate now through my dealer than directly with me for unknown reasons. And, I am told that one of the top guys at Mini supports voiding my warranty. The dealer now says maybe it was initiated by them due to it being their responsibility, regardless, I am sickened by the actions of Baron as well as MiniUSA regardless. Wow is all I can say...

Once again, nothing saddens me more than making this post, I have had a wonderful past 3 seasons running Mini's, I almost shed a tear that they decided to burn the bridge with me for unknown reasons. Why would Mini jack with me of all people? Heck, there were Mini USA representatives at Nationals to help support us, why now burn the bridge? Mini loaned us 5 different Mini's at various autocross events this season including Nats. Why void my warranty over one event in my new Mini? Mini took pics of the winning Mini, used my name in various publications, why void my warranty on my brand new Mini? We instructed several BMW club members at our local autocross school this past summer, including SEVERAL Baron BMW employee's, why void my warranty on my BRAND FREAKIN NEW MINI?

I now shed a tear with the ended relationship with Mini USA, I feel stabbed in the back by MINIUSA as well as Baron Mini and still confused as to why I was attacked by MiniUSA and not backed a bit more by BARON with a pretty much voided warranty.....

Craig Wilcox

2007 Mini Cooper S (on the way to Carmax as soon as possible)
2008 Mazda Mini MSR package? on the way in... ;-)

[DaFlake]

Promotions aside, if you have not tracked that car then what proof do they have? If you have tracked that car then they do have the right to void your warranty, especially if you do not have a contract with them for the racing and promotion part.

[oasist]

The car has never been tracked, I'm getting the shaft here for sure.

[DaFlake]

Then I agree. I would ask them to show you the proof that it has been tracked. I would think that the burden of proof is on them, not you and I am willing to bet that a judge would agree. Just because you have raced in the past does not mean that you race every car you own...

Any mods on that car?

[Richard Crofts]

I agree with DaFlake, if you have not autocrossed/raced that particular vehicle then they have to prove that you have. The warrantee is a legal right when you purchase the vehicle. However if you have done even one event then MINIUSA have every right, and TBH if I were them I too would void your warrantee on mechanical parts.

[MarkW]

That sucks that they can go back on what, you say, has been a succesful deal for both parties

I'm curious though you say that Barons stated the date of the statement from mini removing warrantly as the 11/7/07 yet you say you signed paper work in sept. To me that reads that the warranty was removed before you had the car? or have I misunderstood.

I see that MINI have used name and pics for what I assume is a commercial use, if you didn't give em permission you could use that as leverage maybe?

[AprilWhine]

Quote: Originally Posted by MarkXR (original)

That sucks that they can go back on what, you say, has been a succesful deal for both parties

I'm curious though you say that Barons stated the date of the statement from mini removing warrantly as the 11/7/07 yet you say you signed paper work in sept. To me that reads that the warranty was removed before you had the car? or have I misunderstood.

I see that MINI have used name and pics for what I assume is a commercial use, if you didn't give em permission you could use that as leverage maybe?

11/7/07 is November 7th in US dating style.

[MarkW]

your quite right, me being thick then it all makes sense

[Martin F]

I am not sure I follow. Are you saying that MINI USA voided the warranty because you had autocrossed the car but not raced it?

If so the issue would appear to be whether they are justified in voiding the warranty in such circumstances. I don't know enough about autocross to form a view on this.

[DaFlake]

Craig has another MINI (I believe) that he does race. The one that they voided the warranty on was his daily driver which, according to him, has never been raced or on a track.

At least that is what I got out of it. He posted the same story on NAM.

[alski]

have you original, wheels and tyres, if in good nick could be used as proof as fair usage?
also engineers report of how clutch has expired?
lots of uk minis go to driving schools and will be much harder on a clutch than you would be for one race
good luck

[Martin F]

Quote: Originally Posted by oasist (original)

Jeff S said my warranty would never be canceled due to autocrossing ......................., since first off, I didn't consider autocross racing. ......................................... I was able to convince my dealer to replace the clutch mechanism last week luckily though since he believed the fact that an autocross event wasn't the cause of the pedal to squeak, but, ................

I autocrossed one event, Nationals, since I signed the paperwork. And, they are using this as grounds to void my warranty on anything other than non-mechanical items? This is just flat WRONG!!!

Why void my warranty over one event in my new Mini? Mini took pics of the winning Mini, used my name in various publications, why void my warranty on my brand new Mini? We instructed several BMW club members at our local autocross school this past summer, including SEVERAL Baron BMW employee's, why void my warranty on my BRAND FREAKIN NEW MINI?

This is why on my reading I think the issue is about whether autocross voids the warranty.

[mikbmini]

So if you take a MINI on track, ie, a track day, in the UK is the warranty also voided?

[Martin F]

My understanding of Autocross, which is very limited, is that it is competitive. Track days are not so that may make a difference.

But you make a good point. I would like to understand this issue a bit better. Maybe oasist could help.

[Bilbo Baggins]

In a nut shell this is what Autocross is about. An Auto-X is usually done in 1st or 2nd gear and lasts anywhere from 25 seconds to 60 seconds, depending upon the layout of the course. The same course is driven 5 times and your lowest time is your best time. Hit cones add 2 seconds, per cone, to your total time.

Not a whole lot of shifting involved. Tough to see why MINI USA would decide now, after supporting oasist in the past, to pull their support and to take away his warranty. Sounds like a dirty deal to me.

Do "high performance driver education" days also cancel your warranty?

[pbraun]

I just don't get it, but it sounds like you're talking to the right people. I bet it all works out in favor of you, the MINI competitor.

[rellik666]

Sounds like your getting a raw deal to me and MINI USA are just playing you. I think that you are rightly justified in your dissappointment.

Unfortunatly it sounds like another case of MINI's consistant behaviour of incosistancy!

[oasist]

Actually, I received a response from Vince(mini USA Motorsports guy) this afternoon through email actually. While Vince was a bit upset with me for going public with this, he said he's working on this issue and has been. The reason I went public on this is because Vince told me 10 or so days ago he was meeting with one of the higher up MiniUSA guys in regards to this issue and he was going to call me the next day after he met with this guy. Well, I didn't hear anything from him. In addition to not hearing anything from him, my dealer received 2 more negative emails in regards to my warranty from Jeff White, then, the 3rd email with my autocross contingency submissions yesterday from Vince as proof that I autocrossed my Mini. That one took the cake, my dealer continued to state that MiniUSA was not going to cover anything that could be tagged as abuse. Sure, Mini would warranty a door handle and a headlight, but, nothing that could be written off as abused. Sure, if I were to slip the clutch and burn the clutch out on a hill, I'm not going to expect it to be covered, thats common sense. But, if I had legit issues not related to abuse, the stance MiniUSA is currently taking, I'm not covered, which, is completely not what I was told by Jeff S when I called and spoke with him on this issue.

So, hopefully this issue will be resolved in a positive manner for current/future Mini owners, but, this is not a pleasant situation for me and I don't enjoy going through it one bit. I know it never should have been an issue in the first place.

[TimCrighton]

BMW exclude the new John Cooper Works Challenge car from any warranty at all, even if it is never used on the track as its developed for competition purposes.

I believe that theoretically the use of your MINI on a track day or in any form of Motorsport event will void the warranty - can anyone clarify? The onous is still on the dealer to prove that the car has been used and abused however.

Autocross as the Americans call it is what we Brits call Autotrials... Autocross in the UK is a bit like Rallycross and frankly if you'd used a road car for rally cross then I'm not suprised they baulked the warranty!!!!

I'm sure that you'll get it sorted but you can understand that frankly the use of a road going vehicle in any competitive event would limit the liability of the warranty surely? I would have thought the clutch was deemed a consumable item anyway unless either faulty assembley or parts could be proven?

[dukesantos]

It is a sad mess. Porsche takes a similar stance and will even check for over-rev events stored in the car's computer. The companies need to be up front and consistent about what they will and won't cover.