[macncheese]

I keep searching for the affordable yet lightweight wheel... Im not sure Im getting anywhere. I dont know if any of these fit correctly but this is what I've found so far:

FOX Alloy (I think its imported under the name brand Sport Edition) - FOX 2 16x6.5 $105

TSW - Nexis - 16x65 $110

I dont have a weight or an offset or a centerbore so if anyone knows, let me know!


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Cheese

[toomanycarz]

Thanks, 2

[Blue Thunder]

For the last few years the wheels with 4x100 bolt circle were starting to disappear, since many of those cars manufacturers were going to 5 lug. A lot of the BMW customers that have older e30 models are struggling the find any kind of wheels.

I think you will see a huge selection after September/ November. This is when the industry trade shows will let us see and touch all of there new products.

Light and cheap may be hard to find.
Ultra light Forges Magnesium, not for a mini budget, maybe not even for a Ferrari budget!
Light, this means forged, aluminum. allowing much thinner wheel center sections and thinner rim cross sections. The problem is the tooling cost a fortune, and your stuck with one style for each tool. New style, new tool! A few companies forge a flat blank generic center section and then have a selection of a few CNC designs that they can cut into the center section. But that means Mill or Lathe time which means more money.
Spun aluminum outer rim halves; (like the typical 3 piece alloys.) These are made like pots & pans, a thin pieces of aluminum spun and forced into the shape of the rim half. Rim halves are very thin and light. But labor intensive. You must bolt the inner outer and center section together. But you have more flexibility in wheel widths.

Cheap: Sand cast wheels, These are the bulk of the wheels on the market. You make a tool that will appeal to the masses. Your design allows for enough material (heavy) to make it as stong as possible, This way you can opt. to machine it for almost every car on the street, from Mini To Suburban. As long as the center section can support the bolt pattern, and the offset has some extra material to machine off. These are every wheel manufacturers dream, the "fit all" wheels. and if you can run 500,000 wheels before the style goes away your in heaven.
They can make light cast wheels, they just have to engineer them with plans to only put them on the lighter cars, say 2500-2700 lb. If you want light, watch the european manufacturers they will typically design with light cars in mind. BBS, O.Z.
I'll watch for some, tell me what is thew lightest Cast wheels you've found, and I'll ask the suppliers as they offer us the wheels.
Our luck the worlds lights wheel will have some stupid looking Teddy Bear cast into the center hub, like the Ronals from a few years back!!

[macncheese]

Blue,
Woudn't machining a forging defeat the whole point of it being forged?


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Cheese

[Blue Thunder]

Not really! Rods, cranks, Pistons, etc. they are all forged & then machined. The forging process, compresses the metal molecules, making it denser and stronger. Then you can finish machine it. like a piston you take a forged piston slug, then you machine all the surfaces except for the hollow inside portion. The advantage is the piston is so much stronger than a cast one, you can machine it very thin and still be stronger than a cast piston.

On the wheels, some companies take a round disc forge it into a flatter round disc. Then machine a basket (BBS weave design, or long spokes) Its not as good as forging it into the desired final shape, because doing that your adding a grain to the metal also. But it's a lot better than just cast.

Quote:

Originally posted by macncheese
Blue,
Woudn't machining a forging defeat the whole point of it being forged?


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Cheese

[macncheese]

I'm by no means an expert on forging but I thought the major advantage of forging was the grain alignment? That wouldn't get disturbed when you finish machine a crank or rod as you're not changing the shape, just the dimension. Forging a disk and then hacking it up seems like craziness... especially since all that machining is causing stress risers which are notorious bad in aluminum. Am i wrong? It wouldnt be the first time.


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Cheese

[Blue Thunder]

Quote:

Originally posted by macncheese
I'm by no means an expert on forging but I thought the major advantage of forging was the grain alignment? That wouldn't get disturbed when you finish machine a crank or rod as you're not changing the shape, just the dimension. Forging a disk and then hacking it up seems like craziness... especially since all that machining is causing stress risers which are notorious bad in aluminum. Am i wrong? It wouldnt be the first time.


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Cheese

No your not wrong. What your explaining is the best way! However that brings us back to the limited choice high dollar tooling that everyone wants to avoid. O.Z. and BBS do the wheels the way your talking about, one tool one style, one bolt pattern. They build the best!! The wheel industry is very style driven. A wheel may only sell for 1 or 2 years. This is another alternative, better than cast. Remember we are trying to do "forged and cheap wheels". The last set of BBS 3 piece forged 9x16 wheels I bought over 15 years ago, cost me $1200.00 a copy.
The stress in machining is greatly reduces if the design has well radiused corners. And as long as they use a CNC Hacking machine it should be O.K.

[noahe]

Quote:

Originally posted by Blue Thunder
Our luck the worlds lights wheel will have some stupid looking Teddy Bear cast into the center hub, like the Ronals from a few years back!!

That is hilarious. Did anyone actually run these rims, being that they were light and cheap? I've seen these stupid things in the ads for Tire Rack in the US magazines. A daisy pattern one too. Thought they looked real dumb, and wondered if anyone buys them. Then one day I saw the daisy ones on a New Bettle. They looked about as silly as I thought they would. Ah, but teddy's on a racing car. That's got to be a sight!

[macncheese]

If the Ronal Bears are light and cheap, I'd race them. I have no problems with that at all! I'd even paint them with brown flocking But they are not light at all. 14x6 and it weights 18.3 lbs.

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Cheese

[Blue Thunder]

Quote:

Originally posted by macncheese
If the Ronal Bears are light and cheap, I'd race them. I have no problems with that at all! I'd even paint them with brown flocking But they are not light at all. 14x6 and it weights 18.3 lbs.

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Cheese

That gives me an Idea!! I'll have them do a custom Texas version for me. With a Dallas Cowboy Cheerleader in the center! They would look like there doing cart wheels!!

Should we go forged or just sand cast??

[macncheese]

Quote:

Originally posted by Blue Thunder


That gives me an Idea!! I'll have them do a custom Texas version for me. With a Dallas Cowboy Cheerleader in the center! They would look like there doing cart wheels!!

Should we go forged or just sand cast??

Make mine look like a pizza. Pepperoni and Sausage. Forged please. You could even offer a service to machine the pepperonis into sardines or peppers if thats your thing. I think we're onto something.


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Cheese

[olddad]

The real problem with getting an 11 lb or less wheel seems to be the 6.5" width. The good solution would be for MINI to homologate a 7" wide 16" wheel. In the meantime, Garfield said he was investigating a possible group buy with Kodiaks. Datsun used to homologate parts quickly for SCCA racers as the standard parts proved inadequate. These were the parts that SCCA would not allow aftermarket solutions. Maybe MINI should become involved with supporting the needs of the many privateers campaigning their marque.

[Blue Thunder]

If all you racers had a choice, what size and approx. what weight would make you happy???? Please no 1 lb. wheels, unless your O.K. with forged styrofoam.

[kb_solo2]

I autocross, like Garfield, in stock class. So until MINI homologates a 16x7 I would want a 16x6.5, 42mm offset, standard centerbore. Obviously the lighter the better. under 15# like the Enkei RPO1, about 12# is probably the most realistic without haveing to pay a small fortune.

The Sport Edition wheels by Fox (at TireRack) have 40mm offset with a 76mm centerbore.

Thanks
Keith, shopping for wheels right now

[Garfield]

16x6.5, 4x100, 56mm ctr bore, 44mm offset, 11/16ths caliper clearance, around 10-11lbs, black/white/silver, less than $275/each.

GO!

[Coati1]

If nobody has done so already, contact Rota. They have been VERY responsive to the Subaru community, coming up with a variety of choices in different sizes, styles and weights.
Thanks to Rota, it's possible to get light 17x7.5" rims (Subzeros) for $550 for a set of four rims ... shipped. Note that Gary Sheehan (WRX road/track racer who won his class in the Open Track Challenge, and other racing series) has been using Subzeros for over a year with no problems).

Rota just came out with a new 17x7.5" rim that's only 15.5 pounds and $600 for a set of four ... shipped.

If we could get the same sort of deals for the MINIs, we'd be set.

Rota Battles - 17x7.5; 18 lbs
Rota Attack - 17x7.5; 15.5 lbs
Rota Subzeros 17x7.5; 17 lbs

Surely we could get Rota to come up with a design for the MINI?

[toomanycarz]

and no response. I even sent them the MINI2 URL describing the limited wheel choices. I hope they decide to come up with something.

2

[Coati1]

Hmmm. Maybe if more of us do what you did, it might knock something loose at Rota.

[macncheese]

Enkei made the RPO1 in 16x6.5 and now they dont. They weigh 14.5 lbs each and they were about 120 bucks each (thats 480 for 4). The gentleman at Enkei said they've "sort of discontinued" that size but they'd bring it back if they get enough interest. So call Enkei with your interest if you genuinely want a light(er) and cheap(er) wheel!



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Cheese

[Blue Thunder]

Quote:

Originally posted by macncheese
Enkei made the RPO1 in 16x6.5 and now they dont. They weigh 14.5 lbs each and they were about 120 bucks each (thats 480 for 4). The gentleman at Enkei said they've "sort of discontinued" that size but they'd bring it back if they get enough interest. So call Enkei with your interest if you genuinely want a light(er) and cheap(er) wheel!



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Cheese

You guys should be patient. By the end of this year there will have been several major world automotive trade shows. At that time each of these wheel manufacturers will offer several choices of wheel designs and sizes. There will be no need to beg someone to bring back some old style. The shortage is only due to the 4x100 and the extreme 4?mm off set. Also I don't remember that any of those early wheel had such an extreme offset. It may be that those wheels won't fit the mini. Although the 4x100 is fairly common, the calipers are fairly large up front and they may hit the inner wheel spokes.
That was a problem years ago when people would use VW wheel on their BMW. Everything fit great, until the pads would wear past the 50% mark and the floating calipers would move in toward the wheel and start machining the inside of you new wheels for extra clearance (while you were driving).

On the mini the inside of the spoke design needs a deep cupped design to clear the calipers. The design would have to have a bulged out design on the outside. They are kind of unique.