I've got a problem with my MCS at the moment, which sounds alot like Popey's original problem which is why I'm asking about rejection at such an early stage.
I bought my car from Castle (York), but I work in Warrington during the week. I had David Holmes (Stockport) look at the car on the 19th, and they sent a "PUMA" to BMW. BMW came back with a suggested fix, which was done yesterday - and the car is still exactly the same. They are now sending another puma to BMW to see what is suggested.
I contacted Castle to find out where I would stand if I wanted to reject the car in the future, and (long story short) they said that any work carried out by David Holmes would have to be done again by them. I.e. they want to try and repair it themselves.
I can see both sides of the argument, but surely when the BMW service system is completely centralised it would be obvious that the car cannot be fixed.
The reason I am posting this, is that I don't want to spend the next month letting David Holmes try to fix the problem - then finally resign to the fact that I will have to reject the car, just for Castle to insist they get at least another three tries at repairing it.
Don't get me wrong, I don't want to reject the car just for the sake of it, but if I do get sick of waiting I don't want to have to let Castle mess with the car for another month.
You can reject a car without them even having one go at fixing the problem. The 3 trys is more of a guide line. If you feel they have had the car for such a period where the problem should of been fixed, a time when you should be out enjoing your brand new car then maybe you can/should ask for a new one.
I would see what they come back with and take it from there. How long have they had your car?
Did I not post something along the lines of you should let the supplying dealer fix it?
I know what you are saying but letting another dealer loose on the car has given the dealer a reason to put you off trying to reject it. Your contract is with the supplying dealer, not MINI.
However, the car is still faulty and should be replaced if not fixed. If I were you, I would give it back to the supplying dealer, telling them if they do not fix it now you are rejecting.
I've explained the situation to David Holmes, and told them I'm going to do exactly that. They said they will ring me when BMW come back to them, and I can decide what to do from there. The car is 6 weeks old now, but I reported the problem when it was about 3 weeks old.
The problem with this is that I work in Warrington and stay in Manchester Monday - Friday. I can take the car to them on a Saturday, but they will not let me have a courtesy car for a week.
David Holmes have just called me to say that BMW have requested that they install a new clutch and flywheel, booked in for next Tuesday.
I informed them of what Castle have said re: rejection, and they reckon that Castle cannot insist that the work is done with them as (as I said) all work is documented centrally and they are working on BMW UK orders anyway.
The new clutch/flywheel/trans didn't fix my car --- a new one is on the way for me.
I had other problems with it though and the dealer worked with both Mini and me.
Well, back in July they changed the clutch & flywheel - all was well and good until recently.
I rung them a couple of weeks ago to complain about the car becoming jerky if you let it slow to tickover in first, which was how it all started last time. Rather unsuprisingly, the noise came back last week - when I had a big guy that I work with in the car. Now, when I'm on my own in the car the noise isn't there, but when I have someone over about 16st in the passenger seat the noise is back (and presumably when 3 people are in).
I am coming up to six months from purchase, which as I understand it makes a fairly big difference re: rejection. I do not want them to change the clutch and flywheel again, just for the problem to come back in another 4 months. What are peoples suggestions here? The car is in with David Holmes on Friday.
I can see the first problem already - they will go out with 1 person in the car and the noise won't happen - but I'll cross that bridge when I come to it
I'm no Lawyer, but here's how mine was rejected with the minimum amount of stress. The following plan was stuck to with military precision
1. First and foremost, keep a diary of every fault, every time it happened, and the circumstances in which it did. Keep smiling, be polite, NEVER show your anger. ALWAYS show how hurt you are!
2. In your diary, keep an exact record of every conversation/email/letter with your dealer/dealers AND the finance company (if one was involved).
3. Let your dealer know that you have, and will continue to keep, an exact record of everything (all of the above). Conversationally something like, "I started recording everything from the start, because I thought it'll help you guys if you have to try for a refund from MINI - just ask if you want it to send to them, I'll help you all I can...." Smarmy as hell, but works.
4. Let your dealer know that you are unhappy BUT that you are happy to work to the best solution for you both - at the same time make sure they know that YOU know that this is between you and the dealer, NOT MINI!!!!!
Whilst you don't have to work to fix it with them, the idea is that they think you are extremely reasonable - but that you are well informed and very calm BUT, that you are completely determined ('nicely evil' is good), ALSO, it helps to have friendly conversations with the service manager (you need him onside) and preferably the sales manager too. They are the ones that will give MINI an ear bashing because they'll know you're determined. I used these conversations to drop hints like, "I'm surprised there's still a Puma out for this, this faults all over the Internet. Even Youtube. Haven't you seen it? Oh, well here's the link".
5. In all of your dealings, voice your disappointment with the buying and owning experience. This is extremely important - MINI sell the car on emotion very heavily, it's this that you're aiming at.
6. All of the above is your game plan for what you know you are going to do eventually SO, now you document all of the last few months crappola and serve it to them very politely. At this point I made it clear that I will be happy to have another MINI to the same value.
7. At the point you offically reject with the dealer (now in writing), ASK THEM if they would prefer to deal with you from now on - or your solicitor. They won't want to deal with your solicitor......
All of the above related to undisputed evidence (engine rattle recorded on disc, compared to normal start-up), so think about how you can 'keep evidence' on record. It would be really bad if these faults were really over Youtube like a rash wouldn't it?
Remember. Don't get mad, get even, and showing your anger will alienate the dealer - then it's harder work!
Oh, just so you're not surprised, they don't like the word 'reject'. I got used to saying I'd like the car 'substituted' or 'exchanged' for another with no faults.
Good luck Dan - I'm now the proud owner of a six month newer car, to a spec I much prefer. Hope you get it sorted.
"He fell for her like his heart was a mob informant, and she was the East River."
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No problem Dan, just remember - they are trained by experts to put you off. Resilience, patience and persistence will do their head in.
Why not try documenting everything as best you can and show it to your dealer, nicely say that now that you no longer have any faith in the car whatsoever. One thing does stand out though, it did become apparent that exposure on the 'net seems to lift their game a little, if you see what I mean. They do read this!
Need motivation? Go on the configurator and spec a new car with the hindsight from the first one - it really helps you focus. Hell, mine is twice the car than the first attempt, I might marry it
"He fell for her like his heart was a mob informant, and she was the East River."
Medilloni,
I have been using the "Rattles & Squeaks" thread, but my car is now in the the 4th time and she is only 7 weeks old! we did'ny keep a log of problems at the beginning, but have started now.
Can rejection of MCS apply to rattles and squeaks - driving me mad - is this classed as faulty or will they have a get out clause like " i can't hear anything"
any help, thanks
Same again Lou, keep a record of all of the rattles and squeakes, if possible try and get the video camera out and make the case, play on the experience of ownership thing and be cheerful, upbeat and determined. Rattlles and squeakes I guess will be harder, so why not make your theme the build quality, the association with BMW, not what you expected etc etc?
There's much said about the 3 attempts to fix, and whilst this isn't a serious defect (maybe), it's still exactly the same as buying sour milk from Sainsbury's. I think the reason why most fail is because they are not relentless. I made the dealer's life hell (nicely!) for three months.
We bought a Cooper and an 'S' within a month - the Cooper has been perfect in every way from day one, my first 'S' was a nightmare of rattling sunroof, trim, rattling engine etc so I just made it a mission to camp out in the sales deck on a Saturday morning.
My 9 year old son drank all their coffee, the salespeople were concerned that my conversations would be heard by new punters, and so on. You just have to make your mind up that it's not their right to make you feel bad because you bought a lemon. At least that's the way I see it, maybe simplistic, but we're talking thousands of your pounds, not a DVD bought on Ebay
And if anyone is wondering, I got all my training by buying a Honda Type R with a bigger list of faults than I've ever seen on this forum, for any typre of MINI
Rejection: It's simple, either they will give up, or you will. It really is that simple..........
Disclaimer: Written with the aid of a few pints of Theakstons Old Peculiar
"He fell for her like his heart was a mob informant, and she was the East River."
Thanks, Ken. But boy, do I feel rough now I think I'll be wearing all day!
@ Louj_MCS - as young as 7 weeks, I'd be tempted to list all the rattles (recorded on DVD if poss), make an appointment for a loan car whilst they fix it and on picking the car up, give them a letter stating that this is the last opportunity for them to permanently cure the faults otherwise you will consider exercising your rights under the Sale Of Goods Act - just to make them aware of your mindset. (That is of course, if you feel they've had enough attempts). Good luck........
"He fell for her like his heart was a mob informant, and she was the East River."
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Hope you get it sorted. 
I think I'll be wearing 
all day!
