LPG Conversion? MINI SAYS NO!!!!!

[carboncrazy]

I think it'll be alot of trouble. To buy what alot of people consider a "dream car" to reck it with LPG seems wrong suppose its just my opinion though.

Joe

[RVW]

The only experience of LPG I have had was with one of my works vans.
It was a Transit that had been converted. Whilst it ran smoother and quieter, there did not appear to be any power loss or gain( I know it's a transit )
The surprising thing was at the end of the day it was not a lot cheaper to run, and was a pain in the ass.
With the limitation of the tank size, it meant more frequent trips to fill up.
You got slightly over half the miles per ltr as you did on petrol.
So in the end the firm got rid of it as it was not saving any significant amount in the end.

All I can say is best of luck hope it works out.

[Union Jacks]

D-oh!

its sounding more and more like this is a bad idea - but its the only way i can have my "Dream Car" carboncrazy rightly says - but also use it as a Driving Instructor Car.

KILL TWO BIRDS WITH ONE STONE I SAY!!! well hopefully........................

[Tigger, Eeyore & Roo]

The reason I'd never consider it is that it will only be cheap as long as the government choose not to tax it heavily. If it ever becomes popular you just know that the tax "will be brought into line with petrol" or however else they choose to spin it. Personally, I wouldn't commit to this sort of conversion without some kind of commitment to tax levels on LPG for at least a 3 year period.

[Union Jacks]

Quote: Originally Posted by Tigger, Eeyore & Roo (original)

The reason I'd never consider it is that it will only be cheap as long as the government choose not to tax it heavily. If it ever becomes popular you just know that the tax "will be brought into line with petrol" or however else they choose to spin it. Personally, I wouldn't commit to this sort of conversion without some kind of commitment to tax levels on LPG for at least a 3 year period.

thats exactly what i was worrying about - you know the government will need extra cash to bail out Northern Rock - so lets put LPG tax up

but ive actually found this info about the 2008 budget and it looks like there is a commitment on keeping lpg cheaper:-----

The Government continued to demonstrate its long term commitment to LPG in the 2008 Budget when the Chancellor announced a continuation of the existing guarantee for low fuel duty for LPG through to 2011. The duty will rise by no more than 1p per litre per year more than petrol or diesel. The rates announced are:

• The fuel duty increases planned for the 1st April will now take place on 1st October 2008. At this time duty on LPG will increase only by .135p per litre more than petrol/diesel.
• As previously announced, on 1st April 2009 fuel duty on LPG will rise by .035p per litre more than petrol / diesel
• On 1st April 2010 all fuel duty rates will increase by .5p per litre plus inflation. As a result the specific duty rate will not be known until then.
• This means that the price of LPG at the pumps should continue at around half the price of petrol and diesel for the foreseeable future.

so hopefully this will be good news

[humph]

Having run three LPG cars, and knowing many people and companies that do to, I can safely say that you get what you pay for. Cheap conversions can be very problematic. Older classic cars work well, but modern cars with ECUs can be temperemental. My history to date.

1999 Ford Focus 1.8 - Company car - Conversion worked well. Only problem was that the EML light came on all the time due to low emissions. Should have had an inhibitor fitted.

1999 Vauxhall Omega 2.0 - Factory fitted - Car was bought with 50k on it. Never ran on LPG as it kept defaulting to petrol. Nothing but problems, car rejected.

2000 Rover 45 - Apart from my MINIs this was probably the best/most reliable car I have ever had. Conversion was official Rover and cost £2250, (minus 60% gov't grant). Had it's own ECU, which the others didn't. Clocked up 100k in 18 months before the head gasket went, common Rover fault. Stupidly sold it in 2004 with 150k on the clock, but it would have done at least 100k more. This car is still taxed and tested somewhere.

Things I have learned from LPG driving. You spend you're life filling up!! Could get 270 miles out of my Rovers donut tank. Was doing 1k a week at the time, and filling up every day almost. Your cars mpg will be much lower than those stated for petrol. For example my rover did 38 mpg on petrol, but only 32 mpg on LPG. If you want the car returning to stock make sure the conversion company don't cut any holes in bodywork Make sure there are plenty of LPG stations in the area were you drive, experience tells me that most run out frequently.

And a quick question. Where do they plan on putting the tank as MINIs don't have spare wheel wells. That means a cylinderical tank in the boot, which means no boot.

Would I choose LPG now? Only if I was buying a classic or an second hand car that I wanted to make economical. On a brand new car? No, the costs involved are too high, and in most cases a diesel model is a far more viable option.

*** Quick rant. As per usual this government taxes pollution, railroading us into buying a handful of 'green' cars. But it does not reward those of us who wish to be green, but buy a car we want to own. The LPG grants were scrapped years ago. All stick, but no carrot.

[MartinH32]

Just to add balance to this arguement. I have done 15k on LPG since conversion of my mini. It does nearly 40mpg on gas and to do 400 miles on around £23 of fuel has got to be a good deal.
Mini WILL service my car under the TLC I confirmed this when I purchased the car and also have it in an email from the dealer!!!

[Union Jacks]

Quote: Originally Posted by MartinH32 (original)

Just to add balance to this arguement. I have done 15k on LPG since conversion of my mini. It does nearly 40mpg on gas and to do 400 miles on around £23 of fuel has got to be a good deal.
Mini WILL service my car under the TLC I confirmed this when I purchased the car and also have it in an email from the dealer!!!

yes my Dealer has also stated that they will honour the TLC services and all Warranty has to be looked at under the MINI Dealer Agreement.

i will however be charged an hourly rate if the LPG gets in the way of any servicing.

so full steam ahead on 23rd June for my MCS LPG Conversion.

will post pictures before, during and after the process.

[Union Jacks]

Quote: Originally Posted by MartinH32 (original)

Just to add balance to this arguement. I have done 15k on LPG since conversion of my mini. It does nearly 40mpg on gas and to do 400 miles on around £23 of fuel has got to be a good deal.
Mini WILL service my car under the TLC I confirmed this when I purchased the car and also have it in an email from the dealer!!!

by the way Martin - wot height and length in cm is your tank and how many litres does it hold?

cheers

[MartinH32]

At the risk of negative replies here from complaints regarding boot space, the tank is 60 litre and it takes up the whole boot with just space at the side for the Mini toolkit. You can obviously get smaller tanks.

[MartinH32]

Quote: Originally Posted by Union Jacks (original)

yes my Dealer has also stated that they will honour the TLC services and all Warranty has to be looked at under the MINI Dealer Agreement.

i will however be charged an hourly rate if the LPG gets in the way of any servicing.

so full steam ahead on 23rd June for my MCS LPG Conversion.

will post pictures before, during and after the process.

By the way, who is your installer, and what kit are they using?

[awj]

I had my Mini One Convertible converted to LPG 2 years ago, and 70k miles later I have not had any issues whatsoever. Rather than losing boot space, I have a spare wheel shaped tank hung under the car on the nearside - where the space saver would go. You can see it below the line of the bumper, but I have never had issues with catching kerbs. I get around 220 miles from 35 litres (only a small tank), and spent £2700 on LPG in the last year. I have calculated that even allowing for 25% more MPG on petrol, I would have spent £4600 on petrol at 40MPG, and £3900 on diesel at 50MPG. I would highly recommend getting a Mini converted to LPG, but make sure you get it done by a reputable converter. If anyone is in the Midlands, LPG Conversions of Heanor, Derbyshire did a good job on mine and as I said before, the car has run faultlessly.

[awj]

Just had my 105k mile service this weekend, and had a chat to the garage about the number of conversions they were doing now the price of petrol has gone through the roof. He mentioned that direct injection engines are very difficult to convert due to the position of the injectors. If the engine runs without any fuel going through (ie when on LPG), the injectors are damaged. He did mention some conversions still squirt a tiny amount of petrol in to avoid this problem, but it may be worth checking as the converter may not realise the new Cooper S is direct injection?

[quantic]

This is just my opinion on the matter, feel free to disregard it. But I think that a MCS would be a terrible car for people to learn in. I mean its good in the sense that its quite difficult to stall etc and is a small car, but feel that it excels in higher revs and is not really the best car for pottering about in.

I think a mini cooper or mini one would be a better option, other then as a good marketing idea, in that people will quite likely want to learn in a MCS for the show off factor, I think this would be a bad move for practical reasons.

Also, the issues with LPG that you have already mentioned are a worry and with it being quite an expensive car bumps in it are likely to be more expensive then alternatives.

When I was looking for a driving instructor, I didn't even phone the people with posher cars, because I knew that I wouldn't get one myself and would be a let down. Also, I assumed that they would be more expensive.

[minicabrio]

On the flip side to quantic - I phoned around to try and find the most decent car I could when learning to drive

At that time though, there were no MINIs, and whereas now the car tuition companies are using larger cars like Focus', I settiled for a 1.3 16v Micra. It seemed it was either that or a 1.0 Corsa...

I drive an MCS now and it is very forgiving for pottering round town in, no more difficult than a 1.6 207 or similar.