Needs a clutch at 15,000 miles...

[Blue Scapegoat]

Ok, a long winded story:

I bought a 2011 MCS mid-year, 6 speed. I drive quite a bit.

I made sure I followed the break in procedure and took care of my car. During a day long drive on the highway to Virginia Beach the car started to develop a subdued constant-pitch vibrato squeal with the clutch engaged in any gear at anything above 1500 rpm or so. I thought it was odd, but it was also very quiet and I thought "well the car only has 10,000 miles on it, I've never had a turboed car before, maybe this is normal." If I apply just the tiniest bit of pressure on the pedal the sound goes away.

A month or so later I started noticing what seemed like a little shudder when I take off. After carefully driving around a parking lot and testing it out I kind of brushed it off as me being slightly paranoid. The problem seemed to go away.

15,000 miles comes up and I take my car to the dealership for it's first service. Oil change, and, according to the computer, brakes.

I explain to them the sound, and I drive around the parking lot with a technician. He can't hear the sound. We switch and he drives. The car shudders horribly when he takes off, and he notices it immediately. I hadn't even noticed that I had apparently altered my driving style to avoid this shudder. It was very obvious when he did it. After he shuts the car off, he lifts his foot off the clutch, and it creeks. I have never heard it do this before.

He says I need a whole new clutch assembly on the spot. We go back inside and the guy at the desk says it will be warrantied no problem. At this point the car still hasn't even been on a lift, let alone taken apart to see what is actually causing the issue. Now I'm driving a base Cooper loaner while they wait for the parts. Also, an odd bit- the computer says I need brakes, but they're perfectly fine.

I'm fairly young, in my early 20s. I've been driving manual vehicles since I was 16, most of them with over 130,000 miles on them. My mom taught me how to drive stick in her Geo Prizm in our yard when I was 12. I had a Celica I bought at 120,000 miles and put 50,000 more on it. I used to autocross it regularly. Never had clutch problems. My last vehicle was a 2006 Jeep Wrangler I lifted. 4 cylinder, 6 speed, oversize 33" tires with stock 3.73 gearing. I took it off road all the time. Pulled laden trailers. You can imagine the beating that clutch took. No problems. I even swapped out the transmission at one point and checked the clutch and it still looked beautiful.

So why would I have such problems on a car after a couple months and 15,000 miles? After break in I took it to a drag strip once to see what it could do. Got 3 runs in. I never launch it hard otherwise, it's got more than enough power, launching just results in pointless tire destruction. Occasionally I'll shift a hard 1-2 or 2-3 enough to chirp the tires into the next gear, but that's very infrequent. I downshift a lot and engine brake in the hills, but I heel-toe rev-match every one. When I'm casually driving I let the revs drop to catch the next gear when up shifting like you would in an old unsynchronized truck, to try to be easier on the synchros and clutch in the long run.

What seems even stranger still is that the technician didn't question my ability to drive a manual at all, or my driving habits. I would have expected some inquiry or skepticism given my age: I'm used to that crap.

Does this hint towards this being a common problem? Is anything about the clutch new with the 2011 model year? I was hoping that by now they had most of the 2nd gen kinks worked out, and according to third parties like Consumer Reports they had. I was hoping for a trouble free, fun car. Any body else have any similar problems?

I have this paranoid feeling like I have somehow caused this, but I can't think of any way that I possibly could have.








::edit::
And after driving this loaner...
Thank God I didn't buy an N/A with an automatic.

[Bmont82]

Sorry I can't offer any advice on the clutch issue BUT please please please get your oil changed more regularly. Mini says every 15000 miles which is crazy talk. Every 5,000 miles is the safest and best for engine health.

Cheers

[shiku84]

Well the clutch seems to go quiet easy on the mini cooper. I changed it at 75k and thats for me its still to early for clutch to go. I mean my BMW has got 110k and no problems with the clutch what so ever.

[MiniDeLux]

Quote: Originally Posted by Blue Scapegoat (original)

Ok, a long winded story:

I bought a 2011 MCS mid-year, 6 speed. I drive quite a bit.

I made sure I followed the break in procedure and took care of my car. During a day long drive on the highway to Virginia Beach the car started to develop a subdued constant-pitch vibrato squeal with the clutch engaged in any gear at anything above 1500 rpm or so. I thought it was odd, but it was also very quiet and I thought "well the car only has 10,000 miles on it, I've never had a turboed car before, maybe this is normal." If I apply just the tiniest bit of pressure on the pedal the sound goes away.

A month or so later I started noticing what seemed like a little shudder when I take off. After carefully driving around a parking lot and testing it out I kind of brushed it off as me being slightly paranoid. The problem seemed to go away.

15,000 miles comes up and I take my car to the dealership for it's first service. Oil change, and, according to the computer, brakes.

I explain to them the sound, and I drive around the parking lot with a technician. He can't hear the sound. We switch and he drives. The car shudders horribly when he takes off, and he notices it immediately. I hadn't even noticed that I had apparently altered my driving style to avoid this shudder. It was very obvious when he did it. After he shuts the car off, he lifts his foot off the clutch, and it creeks. I have never heard it do this before.

He says I need a whole new clutch assembly on the spot. We go back inside and the guy at the desk says it will be warrantied no problem. At this point the car still hasn't even been on a lift, let alone taken apart to see what is actually causing the issue. Now I'm driving a base Cooper loaner while they wait for the parts. Also, an odd bit- the computer says I need brakes, but they're perfectly fine.

I'm fairly young, in my early 20s. I've been driving manual vehicles since I was 16, most of them with over 130,000 miles on them. My mom taught me how to drive stick in her Geo Prizm in our yard when I was 12. I had a Celica I bought at 120,000 miles and put 50,000 more on it. I used to autocross it regularly. Never had clutch problems. My last vehicle was a 2006 Jeep Wrangler I lifted. 4 cylinder, 6 speed, oversize 33" tires with stock 3.73 gearing. I took it off road all the time. Pulled laden trailers. You can imagine the beating that clutch took. No problems. I even swapped out the transmission at one point and checked the clutch and it still looked beautiful.

So why would I have such problems on a car after a couple months and 15,000 miles? After break in I took it to a drag strip once to see what it could do. Got 3 runs in. I never launch it hard otherwise, it's got more than enough power, launching just results in pointless tire destruction. Occasionally I'll shift a hard 1-2 or 2-3 enough to chirp the tires into the next gear, but that's very infrequent. I downshift a lot and engine brake in the hills, but I heel-toe rev-match every one. When I'm casually driving I let the revs drop to catch the next gear when up shifting like you would in an old unsynchronized truck, to try to be easier on the synchros and clutch in the long run.

What seems even stranger still is that the technician didn't question my ability to drive a manual at all, or my driving habits. I would have expected some inquiry or skepticism given my age: I'm used to that crap.

Does this hint towards this being a common problem? Is anything about the clutch new with the 2011 model year? I was hoping that by now they had most of the 2nd gen kinks worked out, and according to third parties like Consumer Reports they had. I was hoping for a trouble free, fun car. Any body else have any similar problems?

I have this paranoid feeling like I have somehow caused this, but I can't think of any way that I possibly could have.








::edit::
And after driving this loaner...
Thank God I didn't buy an N/A with an automatic.

I've got similar issues - clutch and DMF are toast at 75,000km. I have posts in the Clubman forum about it.

[Nick007]

Quote: Originally Posted by Bmont82 (original)

Sorry I can't offer any advice on the clutch issue BUT please please please get your oil changed more regularly. Mini says every 15000 miles which is crazy talk. Every 5,000 miles is the safest and best for engine health.

Bit offtopic, but hey, I'll react. 15000 miles (24000 km) is indeed quite a lot, it should be changed every 10-15 thousand kilometers = 6-9 thousand miles or at least once in 2 years. From my experience, change every 15000 km (9000 miles) is perfectly okay. Every 5000 miles is bit unnecessary, after all, the oil has LL04 spec.

[Blue Scapegoat]

As an update, when I went to pick up my Cooper they informed me that the clutch was just "generally wore out" and that there were signs of heat damage from "constantly riding the clutch."

Hilarious. They said they would honor the warranty this time, but not next time.

Also, they found an oil leak at the belt tensioner and had to replace a seal.

Maybe buying this car was a mistake. Maybe I need to go back to my Toyotas... I hope my little Cooper can prove me wrong.

[MiniDeLux]

You got a much better result than I did. I needed new clutch kit and flywheel at 75,000km, car is 2&1/2 years old. Absolutely zero dollars pitched in from Mini, all at my cost.

I had the exact same line from the dealer: "wear and tear", "riding the clutch", "driver abuse". I have pictures of the heat damage on my flywheel and clutch over in the Clubman forum. Damage like that is consistent with heinous abuse. Unless someone has been stealing my car at night and joyriding, I don't know how I managed to demolish the clutch on this car before 100,000k. Furthermore, when I reported the problem the dealership told me they had no service appointments and told me to drive the car for another week or take their rental at €55 per day (times 7 days).

I'm currently in dispute over this as I believe some factory installed clutches/flywheels are poorly setup and/or aligned. New clutch comes from a different planet compared to stock.

It would be hilarious, except that the laugh cost me €2300

[Blue Scapegoat]

Quote: Originally Posted by MiniDeLux (original)

You got a much better result than I did. I needed new clutch kit and flywheel at 75,000km, car is 2&1/2 years old. Absolutely zero dollars pitched in from Mini, all at my cost.

I had the exact same line from the dealer: "wear and tear", "riding the clutch", "driver abuse". I have pictures of the heat damage on my flywheel and clutch over in the Clubman forum. Damage like that is consistent with heinous abuse. Unless someone has been stealing my car at night and joyriding, I don't know how I managed to demolish the clutch on this car before 100,000k. Furthermore, when I reported the problem the dealership told me they had no service appointments and told me to drive the car for another week or take their rental at €55 per day (times 7 days).

I'm currently in dispute over this as I believe some factory installed clutches/flywheels are poorly setup and/or aligned. New clutch comes from a different planet compared to stock.

It would be hilarious, except that the laugh cost me €2300

I have to say, after driving the car with the new clutch and giving it an extra long break in and driving it like it's made of glass, it really does seem to feel better than the original ever did.

[Lawrothegreat]

Your clutch assembly was probably defective from new, particularly if it feels better now than new.

You can actually wear out a clutch in less than an hour if you're determined to do so. MINI clutches don't tend to last the 100,000 miles that people expect, but I think this may have something to do with the fact people tend to drive them in a more spirited fashion than other cars they own.

I think carrying out oil changes every 5,000 miles is silly. It really is dependent on how you drive, where you drive, and how often. If you're driving 20,000 miles per year it could get very expensive. My R56 MCS had its first oil change at 21,000 miles; after 70,000 miles (when sold) the engine felt like new.

[Mike Edwards]

The shuddering suggests the friction/pressure plate has distorted which requires quite a bit of heat, and that squeal sounds like an problem with the release mechanism. The fault with the latter probably led to the former...