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Old Oct 3rd, 2012, 07:48 PM
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URGENT - HELP/ADVICE NEEDED FOR R56 Mini Cooper S 2007

Hi

I recently purchased a 2007 Mini Cooper S (R56). I dont do high mileage as the car is a local run around and its an automatic.

Car has had two previous owners.

Since purchasing, I experienced a few weeks ago, a juddering after filling up the car as if it was struggling to start or conk out. The dealership that I purchased the car from mentioned to put in super unleaded every third fill up. This apparently is to stop the coking up that they said was a problem with cars they had sold on and were brought back.

I have filled the car up (never fully filled right up but always over half full).

On Monday, due to seeing a small oil leak on the drive, I contacted the garage (not the dealership that sold me the car) that sees to repairs or servicing my car and after discussion took the car to them. The garage told me that I was a little low on the oil (due to the leak) but topped up the engine. They told me the loss of oil is not major but quite minor and are monitoring the leak as they suspect the car may have two seals on the engine that need attention. They attended to a crankshaft seal replacement and rocker cover gasket seal replacement two weeks ago but apparently the seals they told me were suspect are on the engine but the engine needs to be removed (along with the gear box) to see to the seals. They advised me to monitor (with them) every hundred miles or so by checking the dipstick.


I did not have any problems starting the car and drove it 52 miles. On returning home (after driving a return 52 miles) I did not have any problems starting the car. I drove the car to its normal road speeds (no heavy acceleration or putting my foot down - I drive the car respectfully). However, when I got home, the turbo was extremely noisy and stayed on for quite a long time around 10 - 12 minutes or so. I felt it wasnt going to shut off! I felt the bonnet and it wasnt hot.

On Tuesday I didnt drive the car.

Today on starting the car, it began juddering and conked out. I re-started the car and it juddered and spluttered to a point of nearly conking out again. My Husband told me a little bit of black smoke was omitting from the exhaust. He told me to gently press the accelerator (while in neutral/park) and the car started.

I drove 3 miles and parked up for several hours. On starting the car to return home (3 miles) the car juddered and conked out. My Husband got in the car and I noticed black smoke was omitting from the exhaust. The car eventually started and the black smoke went. However, while he got out of the car and I got in (car was in park mode) I noted the car didnt seem to tick over quite so well.

On returning home (3 miles) the car bonnet wasnt hot or even warm. I drove the car to its normal road speed limit (30 mph) no heavy acceleration or putting my foot down (which I wouldnt do in any case) and yet the turbo on parking the car (turning the engine off) was extremely noisy and stayed on for around 5 minutes.

Can anyone advise or help out please?

I am contacting the garage tomorrow morning and getting the car back to them asap.

Many thanks
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Old Oct 3rd, 2012, 08:34 PM
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Sounds like one of the cooling fans is running not the turbo. Was there any warranty on the car from the dealer where you bought it? They should be addressing the oil leak.

My manual says to run super unleaded. nothing about every third tank. Most turbo charged cars require super.

The coking thing seems to be common but they de-coked mine and I still had a problem. After a couple of more trips to replace fuel injectors and spark plugs they replaced the high pressure fuel pump and I haven't had the problem since. Mine would start really rough & I could turn it off and on and it might do it again and it might not. It felt like all 4 cylinders were not firing. Apparently they were not getting the proper fuel.
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Old Oct 3rd, 2012, 08:41 PM
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Have you considered taking the car back to the dealer you bought it from? You also say the turbo is running, this isn't possible when the engine is off and it is the cooling fan or turbo water pump which can be heard for some time after the engine has stopped. Has the car had the recall for the turbo water pump?

With regard to the poor running and starting, this could be excessive coke build up meaning the engine won't function properly in terms of the way it takes in air and fuel and emits gas. How many miles has the car done? You could try using a fuel additive product called BG44k, some super unleaded and, if you can get the car running, a good blast with some revs. In my opinion, these engines need to be used and don't appreciate light use. I hope you are able to sort these issues but be prepared if the car is not under warranty as it could be costly.
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Old Oct 4th, 2012, 07:41 AM
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Question

Quote: Originally Posted by Jonnyfive (original)
Have you considered taking the car back to the dealer you bought it from? You also say the turbo is running, this isn't possible when the engine is off and it is the cooling fan or turbo water pump which can be heard for some time after the engine has stopped. Has the car had the recall for the turbo water pump?

With regard to the poor running and starting, this could be excessive coke build up meaning the engine won't function properly in terms of the way it takes in air and fuel and emits gas. How many miles has the car done? You could try using a fuel additive product called BG44k, some super unleaded and, if you can get the car running, a good blast with some revs. In my opinion, these engines need to be used and don't appreciate light use. I hope you are able to sort these issues but be prepared if the car is not under warranty as it could be costly.

Hi,

Many thanks for your reply. The car was purchased just under 48,000 miles. The car was taken back to the dealership Masterdriver Ltd in Buckinghamshire (Not BMW Mini Dealership but apparently a Mini Specialist Centre) on two occasions because of several issues and or faults which I addressed to the finance brokers because my Husband and I werent happy and in some ways still arent.

There is a note on the paperwork to say about a pump replacement and when the car was purchased, due to my concern about reading about and of 'the mini death rattle' the dealership put on a modification part.

The car's paperwork looks in order in regard of it being serviced by the last owner (at BMW Mini - Scotland). The car was purchased by Masterdriver Ltd and advertised and I purchased it at the end of July. Out of the issues and faults, I also mentioned this juddering when taking the car back to Masterdriver Ltd which the car experienced after filling up but started.

One of the dealers that run Masterdriver Ltd told me that the car needed to be run at least every third fill up on super unleaded and they had had several other purchasers come back with the same problem. My Husband and I continued to fill up with super unleaded from then (and not do a super unleaded fill up every third fill).

The car also had (amongst the issues and faults that we addressed Masterdriver Ltd) a crankshaft oil leak and rocker cover gasket seal needing replacing. On collecting the car, we took it to a garage we use for any repair and or servicing and found that things were not done hence addressing the finance broker and finance company.

I recently found an oil leak on the drive and a smell of 'burning rubber' omitting from the front driver outside area of the car. I took the car to the garage who suspect two further seals in the engine and who topped up the oil and with me are monitoring any further oil loss.

This week, the car began to judder and conk out (stall) and despite getting started by revving the engine, some black smoke coming out of the exhaust, the car started and the black smoke stopped. This happened on return (and short local journeys).

This morning, my Husband started the car and found the car juddering even worse and not starting at all. Black smoke still omitting from the exhaust. For the first time a light has come up on the dash saying 'service.'

Despite the fact I live in South Wales, the car was originally purchased, owned and taken to a BMW Scotland Dealership in regard of its servicing and or parts and I will contact them today to check on what the car has had and or has done.

If I manage to get the car started to get it to the garage, I just want to feel some assurance that I'm not causing any issue/damage to the car or is it best to get the car towed (which I will have to if it doesnt start in any case).

Many thanks.
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Old Oct 4th, 2012, 07:47 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Macguyvic (original)
Sounds like one of the cooling fans is running not the turbo. Was there any warranty on the car from the dealer where you bought it? They should be addressing the oil leak.

My manual says to run super unleaded. nothing about every third tank. Most turbo charged cars require super.

The coking thing seems to be common but they de-coked mine and I still had a problem. After a couple of more trips to replace fuel injectors and spark plugs they replaced the high pressure fuel pump and I haven't had the problem since. Mine would start really rough & I could turn it off and on and it might do it again and it might not. It felt like all 4 cylinders were not firing. Apparently they were not getting the proper fuel.

Hi there,

You and Johnny five gave a reply and some suggestions which my Husband and I have taken into account. I have answered quite extensively to Johnny five but thought to contact you as well as both of you (and with appreciation) have been very kind enough to reply.

Many thanks
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Old Oct 4th, 2012, 05:17 PM
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Don't mention it. I just hope the problems can be sorted. Mini Coopers aren't nearly as much fun parked. Let us know what you find out.
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Old Oct 4th, 2012, 06:57 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Macguyvic (original)
Don't mention it. I just hope the problems can be sorted. Mini Coopers aren't nearly as much fun parked. Let us know what you find out.

Hi....and though the mini isnt sorted its sort of good and a good feeling that having such as you feels supportive.

The car was started this morning (before my Husband left for work) and it struggled even more to try and start and died. Despite a few more attempts by my Husband and reving the car wouldnt start at all. Black smoke omitting in puffs and that was that.

I called the AA who took a look at the car and said that nothing was showing on their diagnostics. I discussed the oil leak that the garage who attends to the car told me was where the engine needs to be taken out along with gear box to attend to. This is not related to the issue with the mini at present yet the dipstick (and what a dreadful dipstick minis have!) was checked and the oil over half way - so despite the leak its not major.

Back to the next stage......the car was reved hard by the AA mechanic and every now and again there is a back fire and black smoke. There is a slight trembling of the car but he got the car started. I told him there was a light up on the dash to show service but that went and came and went and came and eventually went.

The service book checked along with the mileage and yet still no answer (nothing on the diagnostic showing AA wise). I was told the car should be ok to drive and if anything went amiss (ie broke down) call the AA again.

On driving today the car seemed fine but after 8 miles a bleep was heard and a message showing on the control panel. It said the engine was too hot and to drive the car moderately (which I do and no more than the usual 30 mph) and I was on a local run not a motorway.

The fan on the front of the car was really noisy like being in an aircraft hanger with propellers going and on leaving the car to cool the fan stayed on for over 15 minutes.

I got into the car half and hour later and on driving all seemed ok - no service light and yet after 2 miles, the message came back on the control panel about the engine being too hot and to drive moderately.

I parked the car and the fan was still its usual extreme noisy self and stayed on for around 15 minutes or so and yet the bonnet wasnt hot.

I felt on driving that my heart was in my mouth as I felt concerned that I would blow the engine. I have the car booked in next Tuesday for a full service and will be notified of any repair.

I'm wondering what have I bought!!!
I dont like the feeling of having bought .......perhaps nothing but trouble

Perhaps I need a mini shoulder to
try and co-op-er with! x
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Old Oct 4th, 2012, 10:29 PM
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Oddly enough no codes came up when mine was at the Mini dealer for the very hard start and rough idle. As you mentioned I felt like I had to keep giving it gas or it might die. Mine only acted up during a cold start.

The service rep said everything was coked up and needed to be cleaned up. I call it carbon billed up but whatever. They de-coked the car and I think the next day it did it again.

I took it back for the same thing and this time they say oh it's the fuel injectors and might as well replace the spark plugs while working on it. Needless to say I was skeptical but the way it was acting up I could see either possibly causing the problem. I said go for it.

On the 3rd visit for the same problem they finally figured out what to change, which was the high pressure fuel pump. Was it a lucky guess? A process of elimination? I don't know, but I haven't had the problem since. Where's some wood to knock on.

Unfortunately intermittent problems are hard to find. So it may be a good thing that your car isn't running right now. Hopefully it will be easier to pinpoint the problem. I am as well as others on this site are interested to know your outcome so let us know.
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Old Oct 5th, 2012, 12:14 AM
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Sorry, I'd put my money on it being coked up. This is becoming so common on the R56 MCS that it's turning into yet another R56 nightmare.
After decoke, most are fitting some sort of oil catch can in an attempt to stop it returning. Super unleaded doesn't seem to make a difference, mine was run on V-power from new but still coked up to such an extent that it scored the bores and required a new bottom end.
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Old Oct 5th, 2012, 01:59 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by S8RAH (original)
Sorry, I'd put my money on it being coked up. This is becoming so common on the R56 MCS that it's turning into yet another R56 nightmare.
After decoke, most are fitting some sort of oil catch can in an attempt to stop it returning. Super unleaded doesn't seem to make a difference, mine was run on V-power from new but still coked up to such an extent that it scored the bores and required a new bottom end.

Hi,

Having had this car such a relatively short time, and looking through the history paperwork of the last ownership (nothing on the first owner but mainly and little as such on the second owner), there is nothing about any coking. Not that I expected such as it may not have happened or did happen but paperwork not to hand or perhaps discarded.

If this is a coking problem, I will definately keep the paperwork as good or bad history, its relevant to the next possible owner (even if it doesnt happen again).

You say coking is becoming so common on the R56 MCS that it's turning into yet another R56 nightmare. Do you or other members reading my topic know if coking is a problem with all BMW minis (whatever the year, super charged or turbo charged and what causes coking, how often do minis coke up and what can you do to prevent?


You also mentioned in your reply message towards the end, after decoke, most are fitting some sort of oil catch can in an attempt to stop it returning and a new 'bottom end' (at the very end of your reply message), I would like to know about this 'sort of oil catch can' and 'bottom end' and wondered if you could explain further please?

Many thanks.
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Old Oct 5th, 2012, 10:00 PM
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I agree also about carbon build up being a potential problem here. The other head scratching issue is the cause of the fan cutting in and engine temp warning light. Have you checked the coolant level? Maybe its a sensor, but I'm more inclined to think it is mechanical.
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Old Oct 6th, 2012, 12:53 PM
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Hi,

The trusted garage my Husband and I tend to use do not have the diagnostics for the Mini Cooper S, so I contacted a company called Servicing Stop who have a network of garages that not only do servicing but repairs also. I had a long chat with them yesterday. They usually collect and deliver but I'm arranging for the car to be collected/loaded on Monday by the AA to take the car to Servicing Stop

They do have full diagnostics (same as BMW) but charge far less in their labour/parts/servicing/repairs etc to inc vat. No repairs are carried out until I am contacted and price(s) are given to me.

It's hard for me to have trust in any other garage apart from the regular one my Husband and I tend to use, but the car will need the diagnostics and BMW are expensive.

On speaking to the garage (one of Servicing Stops) they forewarned they may have the car for 1 - 2 days.

Will be back online as soon as I get to hear and know what is or are the issue(s) and or problem(s) with my car.

Speak soon
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Old Oct 6th, 2012, 01:07 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Jonnyfive (original)
I agree also about carbon build up being a potential problem here. The other head scratching issue is the cause of the fan cutting in and engine temp warning light. Have you checked the coolant level? Maybe its a sensor, but I'm more inclined to think it is mechanical.

Hi,

Servicing Stop (who are I have booked the car in with for this coming Monday) got me to run through a few under the bonnet things.

Checked the coolant level yesterday and its fine.
On removing the oil cap, this doesnt have any 'milky' colouring/areas on it or around it.

The oil leak I have (apparent on the drive) is minimal and on checking the dipstick (as this is being monitored also by the trusted garage my Husband and I use) this is fine too (not on the full but over half full). This will get topped up as levels fall.

The sparks were looked at by the AA who we called on Thursday. Seems these are in order. The AA ran their diagnostics but nothing showed. The service light that showed early Thursday morning 7am didnt show at 1pm when the AA arrived.

The large round dial on the mini dash area shows after starting the car (with great difficulty - much reving and repeated as the car judders and dies) and driving for around 2 miles on, that the engine is too hot, to drive moderately and to contact BMW.

The service light hasnt appeared since. There is still the misfire on attemting to start the car but not heard or apparent when driving.

Despite discussing coking, Servicing stop asked if I had a modification tensioner on the timing chain and this was put on by Masterdriver Ltd prior to purchasing the car and collecting it.



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Old Oct 6th, 2012, 10:00 PM
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Has anyone checked the fuel filter or HPFP on this car? This sounds to me like classic fuel starvation symptoms.

With black smoke being emitted, this could also be linked to air filter and/or the turbocharger. Is the car throwing any diagnostic codes? Seems to me nobody has done any basic checks on this car.

I would advise the following in order of simplicity:

1. Air filter
2. Remove intake pipe from turbocharger and check for play in the turbine shaft
3. Fuel filter
4. High pressure fuel pump (HPFP)

I think you are wasting a lot of time here running around. You need either the dealer or a competent garage to perform some basic checks on this car. I'm sure that your problems have a rather simple solution (perhaps expensive, I don't know) but you won't get a fix until somebody does a proper diagnostic.

Good luck!
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Old Oct 6th, 2012, 11:17 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by LadyUK (original)
Hi,

You say coking is becoming so common on the R56 MCS that it's turning into yet another R56 nightmare. Do you or other members reading my topic know if coking is a problem with all BMW minis (whatever the year, super charged or turbo charged and what causes coking, how often do minis coke up and what can you do to prevent?

Nope, just the R56 MCS (oh, and the Peugeot GTi with the same engine). There is something about PCV delete (though don't quote me on that cos I've no idea what it is) and oil catch cans to reduce the problem. Most of the ones I've heard of go at between 35k and 50k miles.
The high pressure fuel pumps were dodgy but most of those give up within 3 years and there's usually, though not always, a stink of petrol for a week or so before.
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