Cooper D tuning - P-Torque or Hamann?

[jbaly]

I'm getting frustrated by the rather flat feeling of the Cooper Diesel and want to add a bit of sparkle. Any views on which company offers the best option? I've heard p-torque mentioned but anyone tried Hamann?

Hamann:
MINI COOPER D Baiscs 110 hp / 81 kW
Performance tuning up to 136 hp / 100 kW at 4,000 rpm
Max. torque 300 Nm at 1,750 - 2,000 rpm

P-Torque:
134bhp, 290-310Nm

I don't want to end up with lots of black smoke! Any negative experiences?

[PeterBel]

Read this for P-Torque chip tuning (it is for Clubman, but for Cooper should be almost the same).

For Hamann - I'd be curious to hear something... Is it violation of warranty terms ?

[Performance_Torque]

Hi Guys

Don't take general figures as gospel, I had a Cooper D in the workshop last week, and it pulled 139bhp after the P-Torque remap.

We are offering this at £295.00 all in with dyno power run during December

[jbaly]

Update: I opted for the p-torque option, mainly due to all the positive threads plus the lack of information back from the Hamann agent.

The results are fantastic. The car is now far more enjoyable to drive. It's not massive power or 0-60 acceleration but it's now far better in the mid range. Overtaking is now fast and safe. On windy back roads 4th gear is great and on the motorway 6th now pulls more convincingly. I’d say the engine runs smoother too (possibly psychological). Certainly no smoke or ill effects.

I’d say that fuel economy has possibly increased slightly but that’s offset but my heavy right foot! 120mph from a 1.6 diesel is not bad…

If you have a Cooper Diesel, a remap should definitely be at the top of your shopping list!

PS Thanks Will.

[Performance_Torque]

Thanks for the great feedback

[Magic Carl]

Does this work effect the emissions and therefore the RFL payment?

[kevkbuk]

Quote: Originally Posted by Magic Carl (original)

Does this work effect the emissions and therefore the RFL payment?

For RFL the standard emission figures out of the factory are used, so you'd be fine.

[tryfan_mini]

Just ordered an 09 Clubman D for March. (can't wait) I've been following a couple of threads about the 'real fuel economy' figures. I drive conservatively most of the time apart from the occasional blast where traffic permits.... so my main motivation would be extra MPG - What is the real MPG gain likely to be for a p-torque upgrade ? Does this invalidate the warranty ?

Thanks,

Paul.

[rentagas]

Not sure it's worth getting the car tuned solely for mpg reasons. To save £300 of fuel you will need to do a lot of miles -surely the gains are no more than 2-3mpg (accepting diesel economy improves with age)
In theory you will invalidate your warranty, yes if the dealers looked for it they would find your car had been chipped but I'm not familiar with any case where a warranty has been declined because a car had been chipped (or even had a new pulley/air intake etc.). Most owners get away with it (but who knows in the new era of cash strapped MINI)
However you MUST tell your insurance company. It is one thing paying for a new turbo or head gasket and another paying for two write offs, personal injuries, road signs, garden fences etc. yourself (and of course prosecution for driving without insurance). A friend of mine wrote off an M3 and the first thing the insurance company did was examine the ECU

ps ptorque are you still offering all in for £295!

[popey]

The ecu is physically untouched, its all done via a simple plug in connection. I very much doubt that MINI or the insurance company could find out (still tell your insurance).

However if you don't tell you risk two things.

1) You have to pay your premium as if you have declared your mod
2) They can void your policy

However you cant be prosecuted for driving without insurance as you are fully insured until the insurers can prove you have an undeclared mod.

My advice is always declare everything, if your not sure make a call just so your covered.

[rentagas]

Quote: Originally Posted by popey (original)

The ecu is physically untouched, its all done via a simple plug in connection. I very much doubt that MINI or the insurance company could find out (still tell your insurance).

However if you don't tell you risk two things.

1) You have to pay your premium as if you have declared your mod
2) They can void your policy

However you cant be prosecuted for driving without insurance as you are fully insured until the insurers can prove you have an undeclared mod.

My advice is always declare everything, if your not sure make a call just so your covered.

I didn't mean they would "look at" the ECU. I meant they would examine it's contents all via the plug in connection that changed it's contents in the first place. I think they could and would find out. If they then found out that you had modified your car, you have voided your policy and therefore you can be prosecuted for driving without insurance in the same way if you did not declare convictions etc.Of course this would only happen if you had a significant accident.

I would always sound out the insurance company before you make the mods!
And mods do of course include putting a spoiler on, an aero kit,( even side skirts), putting different brakes on, changing the size of the wheels etc.

To give you a scenario you are stopped at lights and someone ploughs into the back of you. You claim on your insurance and the car behind's insurance won't pay because they have modified the car. So you have to go through the uninsured drivers claim process. They then risk being prosecuted for driving without insurance-and so they should!

[popey]

Yes but you are insured up till the point they find out about the modification or in reference to the experience I'm talking about un declared driving offenses (not myself). The insurance company can not back date voiding you insurance policy as they cant prove when the mod was installed.

I was also refereeing to the physical appearance as you used the word "chipped" rather than remap although many people use the term for both instances.

[kevkbuk]

Quote: Originally Posted by popey (original)

Yes but you are insured up till the point they find out about the modification. The insurance company can not back date voiding you insurance policy as they cant prove when the mod was installed.

They wouldn't need to prove when it was installed... they know you've had it done and you've not declared it, therefore if they found it your policy would be void. Check the small print on your policy..

If your not going to declare mods on your insurance you may as well not bother paying the premium at all.


As far as warranty etc Mini/BMW could very very easily determine if the car is running 'official' software. They know the contents of their own ECUs and could compare the two or simply construct some form of checksum from the contents. I work in IT and know that this is true...

However just because they can doesn't mean they would... you'd probably only run into trouble if you had significant problems you wanted sorted under warranty.

If your not happy with the thought of having no engine warranty should the worse happen you shouldn't get the remap.

[Performance_Torque]

Some dealers don't like the idea of a remap, others don't care.

All I know is that in 6 years, we have never had a customer with dealer or warranty issue.

[rentagas]

I'm not going to argue about insurers........................I would tell them
As for the dealers the worst thing I have heard about is them flashing the ECU with the latest code wiping the remap

And is it still £295? Just for info mind wouldn't dream of remapping my new car (a Clubman D)