[Paul]

Quote:

Originally posted by dinger
Hi,Having driven a cooper for nearly a year riding on 16" 5 star alloys and now a cooper S riding on 17" s spokes here's my two penneth worth.

16"s 5 star alloys

easier to clean as they have larger gaps between the spokes.
Tyres will be cheaper.
Turn in is more sure footed.
over really rough surfaces they handle this alot better.
Not as good looking as the 17" s spokes.

17" S spokes

Alot harder to clean behind the spokes as the gap is smaller.
Tyres are going to be alot more expensive.
Turn in is not as sure footed.
Ride is jittery over rough surfaces.
Its one of the best looking alloys I've seen and it matches the MINI perfectly.

Hope this is a help.

I'll pretty much second all of that.

*although I like the look of the 5-stars just as much.

[AidenL]

Quote:

Originally posted by tomorthway
can you order 16 s with a mcs??????

X lites are standard on the S here, Ive seen a few Ss with the 5 spokers too.....

[tomorthway]

does anyone know the diff in weight between the 16 5 star and the 17 s lite?? thanks

[Mini_me]

Some info I found by doing a net search and save to my computer (so can vouch for the acuracy, but it seems reasonable):


17.6 lbs. R84 X-lite (aka Monza or V-spoke)

25.1 lbs. R85 S-spoke (aka S-Lite or Lemans)

[Mini_me]

And from the same search :
This was in a forum thread somewhere and claimed to be info from Mini USA.

Style R83 (5-star) 6.5Jx16 - 1512348 & 1512349 = 9.1Kg Offset = 50mm (Cooper w/ performance runflat tires )

Style R84 (V-spoke) 6.5Jx16 - 1512350 & 1512351 = 8.0Kg Offset = 50mm (Cooper S w/ all season runflat tires)

Style R85 (S-lite) 7x17J - 1512352 & 6757859 = 11.4Kg Offset = 50mm (Cooper S w/ performance runflat tires or all season runflat tires )

I went through the same dilema, but have now asked my dealer for the X-lites (even though I ordered the Chilli package). Still not 100% certain I made the right choice but I still have time to change my mind if necessary.

[Skim]

Quote:

Originally posted by Mini_me
I have read many comment on the forums about this but am a little confused. 2 common opinions seems to contradict:

'16" handle better' versus '17" Grip better and have a sharper turn in'

can anyone who has driven both qualify these staemets at all?

Are we talking about 2 different road surfaces? Do the 16s handle better on the bunmps but the 17 grip better on a smooth road?

Handling is very much a subjective thing and is not all about grip. That's why the old mini, and cars like MX5, are such good fun. A modern VW golf GTI will far outgrip the old Mini (and maybe even an MX5) but if you've driven the latest Golf you'll know that it handles like a barge, a grippy one, but nevertheless a barge. A Mini is infinitely more fun and satisfying to corner in. In fact, even a barge is more satifying to corner in than the current Golf (my bro has a V6 Golf). But if you like barges (like my bro), then I take back what I've just said and the Golf is a great handling....thing..vehicle.

For me, 16"s feel better on the limit - the point where adhesion starts to go is smoother and, since I don't have Senna-like car control, for me this is better as I have more time to react to make any adjustments. Also 17"s tend to tramline under braking. The turn-in is a tad sharper on the 17", i.e when you turn into a corner it is more direct (best way I can explain) and, for me, this is better.

But, when you weigh up all the pros & cons (and they are only very small differences), the main handling characteristic that sways it for the 16"s is the better feel aspect - for me, that is.

Overall the Mini is a fantastic handling car - with any set of wheels.

Hope that helps.

PS: 17" are much easier to clean than 16".

[Jolly Jumper]

Quote:

Originally posted by Skim


Handling is very much a subjective thing and is not all about grip.

For me, 16"s feel better on the limit - the point where adhesion starts to go is smoother and, since I don't have Senna-like car control, for me this is better as I have more time to react to make any adjustments. Also 17"s tend to tramline under braking. The turn-in is a tad sharper on the 17", i.e when you turn into a corner it is more direct (best way I can explain) and, for me, this is better.

But, when you weigh up all the pros & cons (and they are only very small differences), the main handling characteristic that sways it for the 16"s is the better feel aspect - for me, that is.

Overall the Mini is a fantastic handling car - with any set of wheels.

Hope that helps.

PS: 17" are much easier to clean than 16".

Skim,
very interesting. You are right, handling is not the same as grip.
You say turn in more direct with 17". But what about steering feel with 17"? Is it compromised in any way? And I mean feel, not weight of the steering.

[Skim]

Quote:

Originally posted by Jolly Jumper


Skim,
very interesting. You are right, handling is not the same as grip.
You say turn in more direct with 17". But what about steering feel with 17"? Is it compromised in any way? And I mean feel, not weight of the steering.

Well, depending on what you mean by steering feel. For me, I could feel the limit on the 16"s happening better, whereas with the 17"s the feeling is there but it happens quicker. There's more warning and adjustability with the 16"s. Because of this I feel more confident about reaching the limit on 16" than the 17". However, I haven't played around with the tyre pressures (I hate getting brake dust on my fingers, sometimes it's difficult to wash off!).

So to answer your question, the steering feel from your perspective is as good in both - I know exactly what's under the tyre and what's happenning to the tyre in both - but it's more a tyre characteristic that gives the 16" better feel.

I must stress that the steering feel is excellent in both and the above points are only nitpicking ones. The main reason why I've got 17" was that it was standard on the Chilli pack.

[ducati]

I'm considering ordering a Cooper S, and unfortunately my dealer won't let anyone even drive them, let alone compare different configurations ( you'd think this was a Ferarri or something)..

I'm planning on tracking my Mini extensively each summer, probably mostly on racetracks like Mid Ohio but perhaps a few autox's here and there.. Which is the better tire for the track? Anyone with track experience here care to field a guess?

It sounds to me from the above posts that the 16's may be the perfect size for optimal performance.. I'm not concerened with looks, as the Cooper S would look good with any of the options, IMO

[Paul]

Don't mean to shout, but. PLEASE CHECK THE FAQ's!

http://www.mini2.com/forum/showthrea...&threadid=3494

And a lot more wheel/tyre information is there.


Enjoy!

[ducati]

Thanks, I've already perused the FAQ.

Anyone with track experience care to comment?

[tomorthway]

wheni order my mcs with sport setup can i change the 17 for 16 all season?......does it cost more...or less???

[GNDMini]

Thanks to all of you who posted their helpful comments and advice.

BUT the decision has been taken out of my hands! My dealer heard from BMW that if you have the Chilli pack then you have the 17" S-spoke! Also, as commented on other threads, you get the tyres that arrive with the wheels!

The other curious feature of the BMW ordering system (in the UK at least) is that your order becomes definite (and unchangeable) when BMW decides ... no asking the customer!

[RedMini]

Sounds like we were lucky to get Chili with 16" X-lite, aka Pepperoni pack!