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Cooling Expert
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Discussion Starter #1
Ok here we go with the usual question.

Getrag 5 Speed Manual Transmission (No LSD) - 2005 Model is supposed to have MTF-LT-3.

Anyone tried MTF94 (from the older Midland boxes) in one?

Otherwise it could be an expensive trip to the Stealership, who just relieved me of £324 for a drive shaft to replace one that snapped (that's another story) and hence the reason for my question.
 

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Cooling Expert
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Discussion Starter #2
Ok, having scoured the web for the last hour and a half, I have found the following info:-

Both oils are SAE 75W / 80W Gear Oils

MTF94 - Meets API GL-4 (texacobaltic.eu/en/products/cars/mtf-94.html)

MTF-LT-3 - Meets API GL-5 (fuchslubricants.com/index.php?calling=products&sub=pgear&pcategory=category_42&prod=product_42_5)

Ok time to find out what the difference in the Spec.s of the API GL tests are.
 

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Cooling Expert
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Discussion Starter #3
Having checked out the web, API GL-5 is a grade suitable for the higher torques and axes displacement from the gears than API GL-4

Sorry not allowed to post URLs to verify, check out Lubrizol & Wikipedia via Google to verify.

Having searched armed with this info, I can now find plenty of oils which are suitable and so may save a fortune.

First oil found is Texaco Multigear RN Premium 75W-80 which is an API GL-4 or API GL-5.

:smile::smile::smile::smile::smile:
 

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cristo
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2,787 Posts
Texaco MTF-94 has a viscosity of about 10.5 (at 100C) with a hearty detergent and ZDDP anti-wear additive package.
It's available in 20 liter cans.
It's used Midlands transmissions, early 1st gen with Getrag, and later Getrag with LSD.
Redline's MTL is quite similar and a good substitute.

BMW-MTF-LT-3 has a viscosity of about 6 with much less additives - it's actually more like an ATF (automatic transmission fluid)
and Redline says their D6 ATF is a good substitute for it. It's too thin for the LSD to perform correctly and is used in later
1st gen Getrags without LSD. You can get LT-3 in 5 liter cans.

Both are GL-4. The sulfur additives in GL-5 oils corrode yellow metal parts like brass synchro rings and bushings in
MINI transmissions.

You could probably use Texaco MTF-94 in a gen 1 MCS with Getrag without LSD, but it might shift a little harder and might cost you 1, maybe 2 mpg.

The gen 2 MINIs with Getrag use BMW-MTF-LT-4.
 

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cristo
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see attachment for TIS page on oem transmission fluids

specs on oem MTF-94 - http://www.kewengineering.co.uk/Auto_oils/ROVER MTF.pdf
Redline MTL - Red Line Synthetic Oil - Gear Oil for Manual Transmissions - MTL 70W80 GL-4 Gear Oil
Analysis of BMW MTF-LT-3 - VOA: BMW MTF-LT-3 - Bob Is The Oil Guy
Redline D6 - Red Line Synthetic Oil - Automatic Transmission Fluids - D6 ATF

From what I could tell the Fuchs Sintofluid 75W80 has a viscosity of 9.4 - much closer to MTF-94 than to LT-3, but they seem to be saying it's a replacement for either.
I'm not sure I buy that. They list BMW application reccomendations but not MINI specific ones.
http://www.opieoils.co.uk/p-981-fuchs-titan-sintofluid-sae-75w-80-synthetic-manual-transmission-fluid.aspx

Amsoil has a gear oil with about the same viscosity (9.6) - they recommend it to replace MTF-94 but not LT-3.

http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/mtf.aspx
 

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I recently changed my gearbox oil ('05 MCS - LSD) that was suffering with the low speed cornering rumble/rubbing.
Bought MTF-94 from local Land Rover garage £30 for 5 ltr worked a treat.

MIB
 

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Before I had the transmission fluid changed by an independent shop I called the MINI dealer with the VIN and they verified the OEM fluid to use. Eliminated any doubt.
 

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cristo
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2,787 Posts
Before I had the transmission fluid changed by an independent shop I called the MINI dealer with the VIN and they verified the OEM fluid to use. Eliminated any doubt.
When my leaking right output seal was replaced and my independent shop refilled the transmission fluid,
they gave the MINI dealer my VIN and they verified the OEM fluid to use (MTF-94 for me), then they sent the
WRONG fluid (LT-3 instead of MTF-94) in an unlabeled container*.
I noticed a different feel in the shifter and 1-2 better mpg and had the fluid analyzed, which showed
it to be the wrong fluid. About 1,000 miles later, after discovering this, I had them change it again,
and sent an aliquot of the fluid they used for analysis again. This time, it was the right fluid.
Turns out it takes a bit of effort to eliminate any doubt.

* The dealer gets MTF-94 in 20 liter containers and LT-3 in 5 liter containers, so when they send
some out to a shop or customer, it goes in a blank unlabeled quart container. You have to trust
they give you the right stuff, and that everybody keeps track of what fluid is what, and apparently, sometimes, they don't.
 

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Cooper S transmission fluid

I've got a 53 reg Cooper S with a 6 speed box with a JCW mod. I want to change the transmission fluid (I've changed everything else) so I've been reading this thread and other information on the web.

I would have thought that my car has an early getrag gearbox so should use MTF94 fluid. I phoned the stealers to confirm this and after a lengthy discussion with the guy in the parts department (regarding the "lifetime" characteristics of the fluid) I eventually got the oil specification from him (after he spoke to the service department). He said that I should use MTF-LT-3 in my gearbox - he quoted £100 for 5 litres. I said I thought that was a ridiculous price and thanked him for his time.

I now have conflicting information regarding the specification of the Manual Transmission Fluid, does anyone know how to get a definitive specification? :confused:

Thanks,
Paul
 

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cristo
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2,787 Posts
Look at the document in the attachment of post # 5. This comes from the BMW MINI TIS issued 12/2007.
It calls for MTF-94 in a 2003 MCS. It's possible that MINI has changed their recommendation since then,
(maybe they're now recommending LT-3 for better mileage and cold shifting, but I've not seen that officially
published anywhere), or that your car has had a newer transmission installed to replace a failed one if you're
not the original owner.
 

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Sticker

Yes, the document states that I should use MFT-94 in the transmission of a 2003 MCS but there's obviously a discrepancy between the document and what the dealer says is the correct fluid. :puzzled:

I've read another post saying there's a sticker on the underside of the box that states the oil that should be used but there's only a bar-code sticker on mine stating 0061566BKD 2300:1504295-07. :(

http://www.mini2.com/forum/maintenance-mini-care/188643-55-plate-cooper-s-6-speed-getrag-lsd-oil.html

I've done a google search for the numbers but the results do not refer to anything related to gearboxes.
 

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Hi, Im looking to change my gearbox oil, but getting garage to do it and not sure can trust them to put the right stuff in. So I want to buy the oil for them first. Its a mini cooper first gen, 51 reg, 5 speed, midlands poop box. So I was thinking of getting the redline MTL, but have no idea how much or where to get it? Anyone get any links online and how many litres to get? I was looking at this: Red Line MTL Gearbox & Diff Oil 946ml - FREE P+P | eBay but not sure if thats just a little tiny amount?
 

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cristo
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Yes, the document states that I should use MFT-94 in the transmission of a 2003 MCS but there's obviously a discrepancy between the document and what the dealer says is the correct fluid. :puzzled:

I've read another post saying there's a sticker on the underside of the box that states the oil that should be used but there's only a bar-code sticker on mine stating 0061566BKD 2300:1504295-07. :(

http://www.mini2.com/forum/maintenance-mini-care/188643-55-plate-cooper-s-6-speed-getrag-lsd-oil.html

I've done a google search for the numbers but the results do not refer to anything related to gearboxes.
Call a couple more dealers and tell them the build date and VIN of you car and ask them
what spec transmission fluid is correct. Or even call the first dealer and talk to a different person.
I'll bet they don't all give the same answer (I think a magic 8 ball is involved when you ask
as service rep).

Here's some links for Redline distributors in the UK.
http://www.redlineoil-europe.com/info/redlineoildealers.asp?country=United Kingdom
http://www.redlineoil.com/distributors_international.aspx

Two liters should do, would get three so you can flush more of the old fluid out.
 

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Has anyone tried, or know of a reason not to use ELF NFP 75W-80 transmission oil?

When I changed the transmission oil in my Renault Laguna 1.9dci I first used Tripple QX 75w-80 and it was noticably worse than before despite being fresh oil. Then I used the recommedned ELF NFP and it was not a subtle improvement - gear shifts were so much smoother!

ELF NFP sais it meets GL4+ spec and has the right viscocity so..?
 

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Has anyone tried, or know of a reason not to use ELF NFP 75W-80 transmission oil?

When I changed the transmission oil in my Renault Laguna 1.9dci I first used Tripple QX 75w-80 and it was noticably worse than before despite being fresh oil. Then I used the recommedned ELF NFP and it was not a subtle improvement - gear shifts were so much smoother!

ELF NFP sais it meets GL4+ spec and has the right viscocity so..?
Red line mtl is the recommended oil and it improves shifts.

Sent from my GT-N7100 using Tapatalk
 

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Thanks. It is rather expensive though!

Looking at the specs it seems that apart from the 75w-80 rating the importiant aspects of this Redline oil are:

1) It is not corrosive to the syncro bushings
2) It has a very even coefficient of friction across rotational speeds.

Both these factors are also the case for the ELF NFP oil, so I might give it a go. Warm temp (100c) viscosity is very similar as the Redline while cooler temp (40C) viscosity is lower, which tends to be a good thing aiding cold start performance. Basically the NFP viscocity varies less from cold to hot.
 

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Thanks. It is rather expensive though!

Looking at the specs it seems that apart from the 75w-80 viscosity the importiant aspects of this oil are 1) It is not corrosive to the syncro bushings and 2) It has a very even coefficient of friction across rotational speeds. This is also the case for the ELF NFP oil, so I might give it a go. Warm temp (100c) viscosity is very similar as the Redline while cooler temp (40C) viscosity is lower, which tends to be a good thing aiding cold start performance. Basically the NFP viscocity varies less from cold to hot.
The transmission in your laguna is vastly different from the one in the Mini.

Me and all the other owners haven't used elf oil so we can't say whether it'll be better or worse the best thing to do is try it out..

FYI these trannys are very pickey if she doesn't like the oil she will let you know

If I we u though I would stick with redline.

Sent from my GT-N7100 using Tapatalk
 

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Redline or MTF 94. I've got 3 Modern minis to maintain and keep on the road so I use MTF 94 as per manufacturers spec and oil changes are done every 30,000 miles minimum.
 
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