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Discussion Starter #1
A Little has been said about the forth coming LSD in Jan 05 builds. I'm posting here to really air the disgruntlement of myself and countless other CURRENT owners of the 'refresh' 05 MCS's - we of course didn't have this option!!

I realize that there's a need for continuous improvement to product lines and that your always going to miss out on something. However this is no 'Windscreen Wash low level light' ....this is LSD !! - - - A major component that contributes to the handling of the MCS. This is the number one point to what the car is all about !

and....it seems the general opinion (though I personally have not read anything official) is that it will not be a retro fit option. Some of you have said that owners will not miss the lack of LSD... that it would only be of real use on the track. If this is the case what actually is BMW/MINIs strategy here then ? Yes I appreciate there are allot of you track guy's out there, but still, the majority of Jan05 MCS owners will not be going to the track. Of course this is not something BMW/Mini would endorse with the Stock MCS anyway.

Ultimately then it's a timing thing ! Why didn't mini, sync the introduction of LSD at the start of the 'refresh' build ? OR... Why was there not more concrete information regarding imminent refresh options, officially,... so that a customer opon time of order could make a more informed choice. When I ordered back in May, LSD was just rumor mill......but Mini knew !! :mad: :mad:
 

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So is this official that they will be lsd as std? Will it be an optional extra?
Is it a plate diff or torque biasing diff ? I dont think Granny Smith will like it darting all over the road. Great for us speed freaks but for Mr Average Im not so sure. Any more info would be welcome. Regards Roland Gt Tuning
 

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MINI2 No.1
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The power of MINI2...

In October 2003 I posted this was coming in Jan 2005: http://www.mini2.com/forum/showthread.php?t=42923

(We've got some good "mystical" connections I guess) ;)

It was also mentioned a few times since then, and recently confirmed:

http://www.mini2.com/news/news270.html

The MINI is evolving all the time, there's been "mid season" changes since the very start. The lesson here I'd say is that if you're really concerned about such things, do a shed load of research before you decide to buy. The LSD news has been pretty common knowledge here since at least this spring, after being reported by me above last Autumn).

The point I'm making is, whenever you've bough a MINI so far, you've probably "just missed out" on something you might have liked. At least residuals are good if you REALLY want the new stuff that badly.

(Indicator for washer fluid level, also confirmed on MINI2, in September: http://www.mini2.com/news/news270.html) but was posted by me earlier in the forums too. ;)
 

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Discussion Starter #5
mmmm.....just read your post Paul and I do take your points on board. Certainly about missing out on things due to the 'evolution' of the Mini. Duly acknowledged by the exert below;

"I realize that there's a need for continuous improvement to product lines and that your always going to miss out on something."

Concerning the LSD though, I'm sorry I dis-agree LSD was not common knowledge from spring. it was rumor and hear say, read every word of it myself and by example your link pointing to Oct 03 states this. Quite simply you cannot put an order down or for that matter postpone one on rumor. Do a shed load of research....you'll get yourself more rumor and hear say(that's with a factory visit).....take that to the dealer...pointless, their just as much in the dark as we are!

Not having a go Paul because your sources more often than not have proved reliable and the breaking news always tickles the imagination. There's only one word that counts though, and thats BMW/Mini and i still feel that BMW/Mini could of re-jigged a Major component like LSD with the 'Refresh Launch" By all means the Minor fluid indicator and the like can come, as they are ...Later
 

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I said "pretty common knowledge here" which means a lot of people on MINI2 were well aware it was coming, and that it was coming in Jan. I'm not saying that many people knew, not many people overall would have been aware (especially not the dealership networks) but I have very good sources, and I will share information with moderators too, so we can try and be as helpful as possible if certain questions come up.

The reason you wont know too much (officially) in advance is that MINI want to keep selling cars all the time, they don't want too many people waiting for new stuff when they've got cars to build and sell. It also helps with production if they phase in options and changes, as well as making the lines of "model years" less stark than with certain manufacturers, which can help with residuals.

Seriously though, if you REALLY want it, then I'm sure you could lose virtually nothing and trade in your current (new) car for another (newer) car.

If you feel your missing or needing a limited slip dif, then go for it now, if you're not sure, then wait and "suck it and see". I really cant see why people should complain about missing on options that were not available when you bought your car. I can see why people might question why options are phased in and not just all introduced in one fell swoop, but I cant see it's something to get too upset or disgruntled about.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I don't know what I'm going on about actually I don't track or anything so I don't think I need LSD.... (ahem)

.....nice to of had the option though...I would of had it for the £100 extra in the chilli pack

.......I'll shut up now...(walks off disgruntledly)
 

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I wonder if they suffer from torque steer, my last 2 Ford Rs's suffered badly because of the LSD, I personally enjoyed it, but these cars are a lot older so I suppose the designers would of got around this problem
 

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My S is arriving in March will I be able to put the lsd on the spec? Its not on the options list on mini.co.uk yet I also read in Auto Express it will be a £100 option. Mmmm seems a bit cheap to me.
Would love to know as I plan on doing a fair few trackdays and my last cars (an MX5) handling benifitted a lot from the ol slippy dif I reckon it would make more of a DIFFerence :) on an fwd car. Not that you can improve much on the Minis :D
 

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yellowliquid said:
My S is arriving in March will I be able to put the lsd on the spec? Its not on the options list on mini.co.uk yet I also read in Auto Express it will be a £100 option. Mmmm seems a bit cheap to me.
Would love to know as I plan on doing a fair few trackdays and my last cars (an MX5) handling benifitted a lot from the ol slippy dif I reckon it would make more of a DIFFerence :) on an fwd car. Not that you can improve much on the Minis :D
From what I can remember it comes with the chilli pack or is £100 as an extra if you dont have the chilli pack.
 

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I have an early September build 2005 MCS with a JCW kit installed and I can tell you first hand that with the new lower gearing of the 05's and with the extra power from the JCW, the car badly needs an LSD. If you turn off the DSC/ASC you can hardly drive the car with out it smoking the tires. You really have to control yourself on the take off and when shifting hard and fast between 1st and 2nd and 2nd and 3rd or else the wheels just start to spin. On the other hand, if you leave the DSC switched on, it simply kills all of the power to the car when you try to take off rapidly due to all of the wheel spin (as it should I imagine) and detracts from the driving experience. Thus, the 05 cars (especially with the JCW kit) really do need the LSD. I agree that MINI should have made them available from the get go with the lower gearing, but sometimes things take time to be phased in. I'm just hoping that the new LSD option will work well with the DSC and help resolve these drivability issues. I don't have much experience with driving an LSD equipped FWD car, but if it performs as folks say they do, then it will be a HUGE benefit to the MCS.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I could be wrong here.....but I think as a stand alone option it will be £500 but alternatively, can or will be in the chilli pack for an extra £100 over and above its current £1500 price tag!
 

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kezman50 said:
I could be wrong here.....but I think as a stand alone option it will be £500 but alternatively, can or will be in the chilli pack for an extra £100 over and above its current £1500 price tag!
From www.mini2.com/news...

MINI Press said:
MINI Cooper S and MINI Cooper S Convertible will also have the option of limited slip differential. Limited slip differential increases traction resulting in improved handling and increased stability. It also ensures that the threshold for Dynamic Stability Control (DSC) is increased benefiting enthusiastic drivers as they seek the wring the full performance out of their MINI. Limited slip difference is priced at £100 or is fitted as standard if a Chili Pack is specified. It is only offered in conjunction with a manual transmission.
 

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Hey :)

You should be able to add it to your spec now as my dealer called me up last week to let me know the changes as the price had gone up on a few things like the tinted glass and chilli pack etc and he told me about the addition of the LSD etc etc so I can't wait for my Mini to be delivered now :D It was originally due in March like yours but luckily somebody has canceled so I have moved up to January delivery :D :D :D :D

Jamie
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Apologies. Got confused over at motoringfile where they say stand alone LSD option for 500 DOLLARS not pounds. Chilli price is going up in Jan to £1600 though isn't it ?
 

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While we're talking about LSD's

While we're on the topic, how about some input from people with aftermarket LSD's...

I'm all for enhanced traction. It's a great idea. My question is how do they drive with an LSD? All of my cars have LSD's, but they are all rear wheel drive. How does an LSD affect the MINI's driving dynamics? I expect that it'll strongly reduce wheelspin on the inside font wheel on hard acceleration out of corners and during those circumstances I expect strong torque steer. How does it feel in fairly normal driving?

I really like the MINI and plan to order one, but I despise front wheel drive. REALLY DESPISE IT, except of course for the MINI. The MINI is the only FWD car I've ever encountered that "felt right". All of the ones I've test driven didn't have torque steer, and the steering wheel would come back to straight ahead after a turn. Had someone told me it was RWD I'd have believed it from the way it drove. Somebody FINALLY figured out how to do FWD right. It figures that it'd take BMW to do it.

Rawhyde

PS In case you're curious, the downside to LSD on a RWD car is that you need to be gentle on the throttle in the rain or other low traction situation. Too much gas, and it'll write Coca-Cola in the road and you'll wind up in the ditch. (None of my current cars have traction control aside from judicious use of the right foot)
 

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I don't know if this helps or not, but I ordered my MCS two days ago with LSD. :)
It's a $650CDN stand-alone option here in Canada.
My car will be one of the first to be built in Jan 05, and the expected delivery date is mid Feburary.
 

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LSD ON FWD CARS.
This tends to make the car understeer more (ie the front washs out under power) however it does have the benefit of actually moving the car forward! Better than a frenzy of fizzing as the inside front wheel lifts coming out of a corner under power. The bigest benefit is the novelty of being able to put the power down on exit ..
A plate type diff is probably quicker round the track than a torque biasing type such as the quaiffe. A plate diff on FWD with 300 bhp ,moulded slicks and 800kg (our R5 tarmac rally cars) will rip you 3 feet either side of your chosen straight line .The problem is not going round the corner ,its getting to the corner! The Focus RS I believe uses Quaiffe
Torque biasing type ,these are less vicious ,though JC struggles to drive even that !?
IMO test drive with LSD before ordering as may not be what you thought,though im sure will as 'least darty 'as can be achieved with LSD.Me? Yes I want one
Best Regards Roland Gt Tuning
 
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