[Moorsa2019]

Hi Guys,

I’m a newbie on this forum but I’m hoping some of your expertise may be able to help me resolve this issue.

My partners Mini One R56 1.4 had a terrible knocking and could see when I took the head cover off that the chain had play in it.

I went ahead and ordered a timing chain kit and locking kit and on dismantling the existing the chain the tensioner was removed in 2 parts.

I replaced the chain and tensioner put it back together and it was smooth for a few seconds and then had a rough idle after touching the accelerator and got the EML (P10012).

I’ve sinced stripped it down and found that the inlet camshaft had jumped out of timing. I have since replaced the VANOS sprockets and retimed with replacement stretch bolts (each time). When retiming I have left the the VANOS sprockets & crank bolt loose, fit the tensioner and torque the bolts to the correct torque.

The same thing happens and I find that once the inlet has jumped timing it allows the VANOS inlet sprocket to move independent of the camshaft.

I have read that I have to do a VANOS reset, which I have now learned how to do with INPA but have tried it after rebuilt yet.

Any advise would be appreciated.

 

[mike1967]

do a compression test on all cylinders before moving forward. as slipped teeth tend to mean bent valves,
as for timing up the engine you dont set the timing with the spring tensioner fitted must use the dummy tensioner that comes with lock tool kit and a very set way of setting it all up ie must be checked and re checked the timing as you go until the final part where the stretch bolts are stretched

 

[Moorsa2019]

Mike,

Thanks for your feedback.

I did a compression test across the cylinders and got 150 PSI across all 4.

I used the tensioning tool before but had seen on a video where the garage had contacted BMW for away round instead of purchasing m a torque wrench capable of 0.6NM (which wouldn’t get used again). That was the way BMW had suggested

 

[mike1967]

you can twist the dummy tensioner by hand to mimic the tension the spring tensioner gives and then double check the timing lock points with spring tensioner as the very last check before doing the stretch side of the bolts as such, i always do crankshaft bolt up first then do the sprockets and always use a 27mm spanner to hold the cams, i've seen time served techs before the first time ever do one of these engines get it wrong until the penny drops somewhere on here i done a fairly in depth write up on how to and what to look out for as i have lost count the amount i have done to date., even seen someone get 6nm as being the given preload hmmm sometimes the internet can torment with not right info, or secondhand info where someone has seen it written somewhere else but dont get all the info say or get the numbers wrong etc, everything i know about these engines is from working on them i have many times rebuilt rebored and etc prob do it in my sleep now, that all said the timing must be within a degree of where it should be, as for reset adaptions etc there is a hard reset when i learnt about it form a tech paper for psa they called it a power latch it resets the programmable micro chips that learn adaptation, and goes as per below also first pic is of the later longer reach chain adjusters ie longer,
How to reset all ecu's

this procedure is called a power latch

firstly turn on the ignition not engine running,
open bonnet remove battery positive lead and then turn off ignition.
then touch the positive lead to earth,this powers down all ecus and resets erasing intermittent faults in the process.then reconnect the battery lead.
if the vehicle doesnt start straight away leave the ignition on for 2-3 mins as it has gone into anti scanning mode.

IMPORTANT PLEASE READ CAREFULLY
upon starting the vehicle DO NOT TOUCH THE THROTTLE allow vehicle to idle until cooling fans cut in to allow the engine ecu to reset correctly and reprogramme the learning curve,then drive in all gears upto 4,000 rpm accellerating steadily.

as stated this resets all ecus so any electrical faults caused by conflict errors in programming will be erased and fixed.if the fault is still evident there is a problem that will need further diagnosis

 

[Moorsa2019]

Thanks Mike,

I totally agree with the second hand information.

I have been doing this using the Haynes Manual so I’ll take what you said onboard and give it ago tonight. So once’s timed if I take the crank and sprockets up to torque (stage 1) and rotate it around a few times by hand and recheck, if all is well then tighten the crank and sprockets to the stretch setting?

 

[mike1967]

yes what i do is to lock engine off, fit chain and sprockets lightly oil the camshaft bolts, then set the bolts on cams to 20nm and crankshaft to 40nm, then hard turn engine over a few times relock the cams and crank ie crankshaft first then cam locks, reason for this is the cam locks if correct should just drop in to place,, always and its important turn crankshaft clockwise never anti clockwise throughout all this, if locks fall on then remove the dummy tensioner and install spring tesioner and repeat this if all correct the locks will drop on with spring tensioner fitted, ie by doing this you double check what you have done before doing the stretch part of the bolts, ie you have already put 20nm on cams, the book says 20nm plus 180 degrees, i do it 20nm plus 90 plus 90 this just gives the bolt time to settle rather than going a full 180 degrees i have lost count the amount of have done like this never had one back until the next chain change or course ie every 60k ish. the crank bolt i do 40nm already done then plus 120 degrees or as tight as a 4ft breaker bar will let you,, i use a dewalt zr 1/2 drive impact gun and mark the degrees on the socket and engine case, ie this gives 1650nm of force so they dont undo easy lol.

 

[Moorsa2019]

Mike,

Great minds think alike

 

[mike1967]

yep thats my baby it only has a few outcomes when used, snap it off, remove it or round it off lol i've had snap on guns and that dewalt is epic mine is 3 years old now been used all the time never misses a beat

 

[Moorsa2019]

Update...

Last night I finished following this and started the engine and had a rough idle straight away which got more erratic until the EML came on.

This time it had P0012, P0300, P0301, P0303 and P0304.I know these are misfires on the cylinders.

I lost count of times I checked it this time. When I get back to today, I’ll rip the plugs out and do a compression test again

 

[mike1967]

A P0012 code refers to the VVT (variable valve timing) or VCT (variable camshaft timing) components and the car's PCM (powertrain control module) or ECM (engine control module). ... That consists of a few different components but the P0012 DTC specifically refers to the camshaft (cam) timing.

A misfire from one or more cylinders can be caused by many reasons from a faulty ignition system, fuel system or internal engine failure. ... Many times P0300 occurs when there are worn out spark plugs, spark plug wires, or a faulty ignition coil.
In order to figure out if the check engine light code P0301 (misfire on cylinder 1) is being caused by a fuel injector, you can (in most cases) just switch it with a differentcylinder. ... You can use it with spark plug wires, ignition coils (assuming you have a coil for each cylinder), spark plugs, etc.
i would check the timing again ie re lock it with locking tool,

 

[Moorsa2019]

Thanks Mike, I just don’t understand this time after the engine was rotated by hands countless times and was fine then once started it appears that the inlet VANOS sprocket moves out of sync with the camshaft

 

[mike1967]

maybe have a oil solenoid faulty for vanos or wiring issue with it or the oil control ring on end of camshaft is another place than can cause it, or maybe the vanos sprocket its self is faulty ie it should have a resistance to its bump stop, have you ran car a few times hot to cold and then reset codes, as i have always found them to be running on old stretch chain ecu learnings as such take a few cold to hot to cold runnings,

 

[Moorsa2019]

The VANOS sprockets have been replaced so only Solenoid and seals out the list.

The car was operational before the change just knocking....

I don’t have chance to allow it to get hot as the revs go erratic and stalls within a minute

 

[mike1967]

try this i do this all the time it is safe to do follow what is wrote to the letter, after doing it start it from cold let it idle this should hard reset the ecu clear it back to the beginning
How to reset all ecu's

this procedure is called a power latch

firstly turn on the ignition not engine running,
open bonnet remove battery positive lead and then turn off ignition.
then touch the positive lead to earth,this powers down all ecus and resets erasing intermittent faults in the process.then reconnect the battery lead.
if the vehicle doesnt start straight away leave the ignition on for 2-3 mins as it has gone into anti scanning mode.

IMPORTANT PLEASE READ CAREFULLY
upon starting the vehicle DO NOT TOUCH THE THROTTLE allow vehicle to idle until cooling fans cut in to allow the engine ecu to reset correctly and reprogramme the learning curve,then drive in all gears upto 4,000 rpm accellerating steadily.

as stated this resets all ecus so any electrical faults caused by conflict errors in programming will be erased and fixed.if the fault is still evident there is a problem that will need further diagnosis
if after this still throws up the faults them you still have a issue, one question has the knocking stopped did you compression test it before doing any thing to it,

 

[Moorsa2019]

I tried that before starting last night but it’s not possible to turn ignition off or remove the key as it’s latched in with no power.

I say knocking it was more of a tapping and on removal it was because the tensioner was in 2 half’s. I didn’t do a compression test before

 

[mike1967]

have you done a compression since new chain kit, did tensioner fall apart when unscrewing it, or was it in two parts before removing it, ie chain lashing around

 

[Moorsa2019]

I’m going to redo one shortly once I’ve retimed it. There was a bit of play in the chain and the would idle rough. It was only noticed when unscrewing

 

[mike1967]

i've spoken to so many people on here about timing chains etc so sorry if i ask what seems like the same questions, have you done a full kit replace including new bottom sprocket

 

[Moorsa2019]

Only top replacement. I have just checked and timing is still correct. I notice that the exhaust VANOS pump actuator moved rigid when turning by hand and even delayed them when I stop at certain point it will slowing jump forward. Checked it out the engine and turns smoothly

 

[Moorsa2019]

Sorry not a actuator m. I did notice a piece has broken off but seems like it’s existing looking into where it’s install and the oil marks