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my second passion, a tin!
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729 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Just got confirmation from the organisers of Targa Tasmania that JCW Kits are an illegal modification. Any cars that enter with JCW kits will not be accepted:mad: They have just rejected the Queensland Sherrin Team entry on this basis.

JCW is not 'showroom standard' and also does not comply with the requirements for 'limited modification standard' as the supercharger is changed.

They also confirmed that any other third party pulley reduction kit will also not be allowed. Which I was already resigned to anyway.

I'm pretty sure there will be some phone calls between the Targa organisers and BMW over the next few weeks on this one!!!:rolleyes:

Stu
 

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Twincharge???
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2,227 Posts
If that's the case then STi's shouldn't be allowed, technically those are factory modified cars albeit fitted at the factory whereas JCW is at the dealer. (I think there's some flaw with my argument but stuff it for the time being).
 

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Twincharge???
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2,227 Posts
Yeah the yellow one, it's a MC. Belongs to Craig Williams (is that right?) It even had 18" on..

Another thing, why are those modded GT-R's and Evo's are allowed to run but the JCW isn't?
 

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my second passion, a tin!
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729 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
Craig Williams has run a stock Cooper for the last few years. In its category he is a class winner.

the main issue comes down to factory and non-factory modifications. They are very strict on the EVO's, GTR's and STI's but as long as they are factory and production releases then OK. They disqualified the third place getter this year as their GTR was found post event to have modified boost and other illegal mods. Problem I think with JCW is that its dealer fitted not factory, but I know BMW have a different view on this.

Its an international event and the rules are very tight.

Stu
 

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Boy who made the wolf cry
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10,324 Posts
Craig Williams has a Cooper Works... one of the very early ones built by the garage and imported.

He had the first JCW car in the country...

It was in the first issue of speed from memory.. has a full cage etc... nice car, and it was on 18's last time I saw it as he is the owner of the magwheel warehouse or similar that imports MAK rims etc.

He also has a DS/(W?) MCS with a set of 19" Breyton rims on it... but they change them frequently...

Todd
 

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JCW No. 1459
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869 Posts
It's interesting how the different events have different interpretations of the same vehicle / modification :rolleyes:

From reading the Mt Buller sub regs it would seem that JCW 'might' be OK ... Section C 02-04-01 states '... superchargers ... unless they were fitted as standard, in which case they are free, provided that the replacement item is from the same period as the original item and fits the original manifolding. However, the remainderof the induction system must remain as original'.

My reading of this is that the JCW supercharger swap would be OK as long as the JCW kit was available in the build year of the car but any changes to airbox would not be allowed.

How close are the Tassie regs to this?
 

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my second passion, a tin!
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729 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
warped said:
It's interesting how the different events have different interpretations of the same vehicle / modification :rolleyes:

From reading the Mt Buller sub regs it would seem that JCW 'might' be OK ... Section C 02-04-01 states '... superchargers ... unless they were fitted as standard, in which case they are free, provided that the replacement item is from the same period as the original item and fits the original manifolding. However, the remainderof the induction system must remain as original'.

My reading of this is that the JCW supercharger swap would be OK as long as the JCW kit was available in the build year of the car but any changes to airbox would not be allowed.

How close are the Tassie regs to this?
Events like East Coast Targa, Mt Buller and even Rally Tas are run under local CAMS rules whilst Targa Tas being an international event is run under FIA regulations. Also they get a full field or even over subsribed so they can be choosey.

The regs for Mt Buller and East Coast Targa are almost identical and I expect the scrutineering to be as "formal". They are not in the business of making it difficult for entrants. In theory our CAI was illegal for East Coast but as it was likely to make lick all difference to the results they did not police it.
 

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my second passion, a tin!
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729 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
MickyD said:
take the badges off, change the intercooler cover, and no-one would be the wiser :)
Ahh thats a big risk. If they want to they have the power to impound your car, strip it down and measure all components and then give you the bill for the work!!!
 

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Track Addict
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2,622 Posts
MickyD said:
take the badges off, change the intercooler cover, and no-one would be the wiser :)
Hi,

Unfortunately, I don't think that is the case in Targa Tassie. Last year they were incredibly tough on scrutineering. A friend on mine turned up with the same car as he had used in previous years. He paid up his entry etc, but was failed due to a non-conforming air-box :eek:

Cheers

Robbo
 

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Track Addict
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2,622 Posts
dairyboy said:
Yeah the yellow one, it's a MC. Belongs to Craig Williams (is that right?) It even had 18" on..

Another thing, why are those modded GT-R's and Evo's are allowed to run but the JCW isn't?
Hi,

Due to the quirks of the regs, a JCW cooper might be fine, but an S could be failed. There are certain things that you are allowed to modify, depending on category. For instance in LMS (the highest level of mods) brakes are completely free, including ducts, you can de-cat the car, and do anything to the exhaust, but changing the supercharger is not allowed. A non turbo or supercharged 2WD is allowed the most latitude for mods, so that is how the cooper may get away with it.

Also, the amount of mods allowed varies to some degree on the age of the car. The regs are strictest for late moderns, ie post 98. That is why some early model GT-R's etc get away with more.

What is frustrating is that I don't want to win the comp, and never would even be competitive, despite mods. I just want to compete and have fun. However, in order to be accepted, I am resigned to the fact that I am going to have to put my pulley / air-box / headers and cat back to stock. This is annoying, but not really a big deal, and will take around 1-2 days work. I am sure we will still have a huge amount of fun with a stock pulley :D :D :D

Cheers

Robbo
 

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Gone Old School
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745 Posts
In my mind this BITES!!!!! but have come to expect this from the organisers... they are overly picky and have always favoured local content... hence why they allow certain mods to certain monaro's.. a few years back they didnt even allow Subaru (Primerily Possum Bourne (RIP)) but allowed toyota to run the GT4. this event although being Australias primary road event is a farce!! the regulations change from year to year and are not consistant!
 

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MINIstry of Fun
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1,561 Posts
Red&blackS said:
Craig Williams has a Cooper Works... one of the very early ones built by the garage and imported.

He had the first JCW car in the country...


Todd
I'm pretty sure that he has the first privately owned MINI ever to arrive in the country.

eltel
 

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168 Posts
StuJones said:
Just got confirmation from the organisers of Targa Tasmania that JCW Kits are an illegal modification. Any cars that enter with JCW kits will not be accepted:mad: They have just rejected the Queensland Sherrin Team entry on this basis.
Stu
TASMINIA accepts JCW Kits and any other kit you might like to use. :D
 

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Registered
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1,135 Posts
This is a load of $hit, someone please define “showroom” and “factory” for me?

Both these terms are very loose in there meaning. Eg BMW had to get ADR compliance on the JCW car before they can sell it. This means they can modify the vehicle (eg install the JCW kit) before it is registered for the first time in this country. If they did not have ADR’s BMW could not modify the vehicle before the registered/sold it (they would break the law and Feds might get upset with them).

Thus to me a JCW car is showroom car, as the it delivered with the JCW from the MFG.

Now for the factory, what is a factory? Is it the engine factory (Brazil), the assemble factory (Oxford), the import inspection center (Custom bond area), or the dealer workshop. With most cars being build by outsourcing the concept of a factory is gray. Also what about the 2005 MINI, will the LSD have to fitted in Brazil for it to be ok ?????
 

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Gadget man!
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7 Posts
I understand that in theory, a car built to FIA Group N specs should be able to compete. The permitted changes for Group N are very small compared to some of the cars that actually compete. However, unless they have changed their mind on this matter, no Group N car has ever actually competed. Neal Bates Cerlica GT4 wasa Group N car but I belive it was modified to suit the regs at the time. At least they now require some saftey equipment!
 

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my second passion, a tin!
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729 Posts
Discussion Starter #20
The aim of road Targa's is to showcase production vehicles both modern and classic, for that reason race cars (group N, etc) are not allowed. You cannot use a stripped shell track car to compete. Basically you are only allowed to remove interior components for fitting of safety gear, etc.

I think this will end up being a detailed discussion between BMW/MINI and Targa organisers Octagon!!!
 
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