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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So I'm having more of this endless fun with my mini. R56 Cooper S N18 2010, has started blowing white smoke with a blue tinge out the exhaust when I rev it after it has sat idling for a few minutes, smells like burning oil more than sweet I think. Coolant level seems to be stable and uncontaminated all though I have noticed a few black specs in it, appear to be solid. Oil was changed recently but it was smoking before that and also appears uncontaminated, currently has 5w40 in it and I added a can of stop smoke a few days ago to see if that made any difference to the smoke but it hasn't changed anything.

I stopped at Halfords to a grab a can of the stop smoke and when I opened the oil fill cap quite a bit of white smoke came out and continued to do so for a few minutes. It's the same if I open the oil cap when the engine is running but I've only done this a couple times just to see if it would smoke like when the engine is off.

There is no oil in the turbo inlet or the pressurised exit to the intercooler, just a very light misting which I understand to be pretty normal. The intercooler pipe to the left of the engine bay post intercooler that heads to the throttle body is also relatively clean as well, nothing worrying.

I'm between valve stem seals which mini said it would cost £1000 to do or it could be turbo seals leaking oil out the back of the turbo into the exhaust and also back into the pcv system? Not exactly sure, might take the car to mini and get it diagnosed but I like to have a crack at things myself first. If anyone has any ideas or experience I would appreciate it, I have read other posts and searched endlessly And it does point towards valve stem seals but seems to be other causes like the turbo etc that could be likely. Could it be a valve cover gasket? I cleaned the pcv diaphragm which was untorn but quite dirty, made no difference. Since the stop smoke did nothing could this be a sign it is more turbo related since the oil would continue to leak out the back into the exhaust anyway?

Thanks in advance.
 

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could be the turbo I suppose, but first thought is 11 year old Prince engine at what mileage?
 

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10 year old prince engine stem seals, 10 years oil plastic oil control rings, rubber and plastic dont do well in a engine that my design runs hot,, would suspect the turbo cheap way around that one and easy job is replace the cartridge only around £150 for a good one, most likely is valve stem seals and exhaust valves have carbon built up engine off job and while head off only a plum would not put better piston rings in and hone the bores etc ,, and new timing chain etc relap valves
below rings i use in all of them 3 piece better than the plastic flexi crap ones
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
10 year old prince engine stem seals, 10 years oil plastic oil control rings, rubber and plastic dont do well in a engine that my design runs hot,, would suspect the turbo cheap way around that one and easy job is replace the cartridge only around £150 for a good one, most likely is valve stem seals and exhaust valves have carbon built up engine off job and while head off only a plum would not put better piston rings in and hone the bores etc ,, and new timing chain etc relap valves
below rings i use in all of them 3 piece better than the plastic flexi crap ones
Can you do the paper and oil check from disconnecting at the Flexi pipe or does the down pipe have to come off to see if it spits oil
 

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i always pull cat away from turbo enough to drop a piece of card between while car running must do at running temps,, i also pull the compressor side pipe off turbo see what creeps out of that side, if smoke is more blue tens to be more compressor side as oil gets burnt,, if more white tends to be exhaust stem seals and or turbo seals to exhaust side, also would check how much crankcase breathing when engine is nice and hot pull cap off if have lots of steamy gas looking like a steam train then rings most likely,, will say this i have lost count the amount of these engines i have rebuilt at these miles and age very very common , tend to be a sign of 20k oil services or bad oil level control over its life as others can get up over 100k before showing these signs
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
i always pull cat away from turbo enough to drop a piece of card between while car running must do at running temps,, i also pull the compressor side pipe off turbo see what creeps out of that side, if smoke is more blue tens to be more compressor side as oil gets burnt,, if more white tends to be exhaust stem seals and or turbo seals to exhaust side, also would check how much crankcase breathing when engine is nice and hot pull cap off if have lots of steamy gas looking like a steam train then rings most likely,, will say this i have lost count the amount of these engines i have rebuilt at these miles and age very very common , tend to be a sign of 20k oil services or bad oil level control over its life as others can get up over 100k before showing these signs
Yeah I do have a fair bit of steam/smoke that comes out the oil fill cap. Nightmare... It's got a full service history with a few services that were left a bit long but overall not bad. The intake side of the turbo is clean and the pcv pipe also appears to be very clean aswell, I was wondering if there could be a pcv issue but maybe not. Will maybe try that rear side turbo test with paper. Sounding like rings or valve stem seals though, difficult to tell. There's a fairly foul smell to the smoke too from the exhaust, and can get a Burnt oil smell if you give the car a decent pull
 

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heads up no point doing the just stem seals on these engines as pit the valve seats, as the hard crud on exhaust valves needs to be cleaned off head off valves out , while head off re-ring it with better ring set,, is only correct way forward on these engines, ie just doing stem seals in a lipstick on a pig kind of thing
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
heads up no point doing the just stem seals on these engines as pit the valve seats, as the hard crud on exhaust valves needs to be cleaned off head off valves out , while head off re-ring it with better ring set,, is only correct way forward on these engines, ie just doing stem seals in a lipstick on a pig kind of thing
What's the sort of cost to get all the work you recommend done?
 

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maybe avoid the cheap option of in situ seal swaps imo, cheap might have great appeal but with oil use comes pitted exhaust valve seats and potential for hot spots etc, not that one reads of such related problems but it occurs, guide wear reduces seal life too, that can't easily be assessed during in situ work,

true it can be rings affecting it, so for some it can be a two stage repair,

imo take the head off, strip, clean, re-lap, new seals, and go again, or take the plunge and just refresh the whole lump,

clean imo is: Dishware Tableware Plate Cuisine Badge Automotive tire Motor vehicle Alloy wheel Rim Automotive exterior Tableware Drinkware Barware Automotive tire Floor Water Tree Automotive tire Plant Art with old oil forced/washed out of lifters and them checked for freedom of movement and rollers looked at and rotation felt etc. Trivial perhaps but one is in there and it's accessible.

fwiw for the above head off work done as said I'd expect 1200, guides + 200 or so,

people use different quality stuff of course which can change cost, many won't clean stuff like above and cost can be a bit less, if not cleaning then one probably isn't looking very closely at things, normal for some just fitting new parts, 'the basic job' etc. One gets to see what others have done sometimes ;O) (or not).

best swap the chain while in there imo, maybe not Peter having just done it, pull the sump too and clear any debris from the oil pick up and swap the pump chain that many actually ignore altogether.... if this wasn't done with a chain then one may as well now as the top is disconnected again.

only my2p ;O)
 

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depends on whether genuine parts used or aftermarket,
aftermarket using elring, febi or fai chain kit brands , new piston rings, new stretch bolts on conrods crank shaft bolt head bolts camshafts bolts, new big end bearings/not mains. timing chain kit without vanos sprockets, new head gasket kit with elring stem seams , so basic refresh as most will do without any problems as long as never been oil starved damage to the the engine, £1200 was last one i done on a refresh level, have been finding prices for parts have been creeping up since the issues at uk and EU docs and ordering parts etc, also you should think about what damage the oil burning has caused to other stuff like the cat and 02 sensors also the turbo would be a extra unknown , new cart is around £150 new turbo is £800 and £350 for a refurb unit, the oil feed pipe further £80,
genuine parts add another £500 to that bill, on the petrol prince engines febi and FAI good gear,, would never use anything else put genuine parts on bmw n47 diesels,
if engine oil damaged its so much more gets hurt , hence why should always check oil pressure when engine is hot to gauge what what is in there etc, ie might find oil pump and crankshaft is screwed and even camshafts and head in worst cases, then its thousands possibly,
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
depends on whether genuine parts used or aftermarket,
aftermarket using elring, febi or fai chain kit brands , new piston rings, new stretch bolts on conrods crank shaft bolt head bolts camshafts bolts, new big end bearings/not mains. timing chain kit without vanos sprockets, new head gasket kit with elring stem seams , so basic refresh as most will do without any problems as long as never been oil starved damage to the the engine, £1200 was last one i done on a refresh level, have been finding prices for parts have been creeping up since the issues at uk and EU docs and ordering parts etc, also you should think about what damage the oil burning has caused to other stuff like the cat and 02 sensors also the turbo would be a extra unknown , new cart is around £150 new turbo is £800 and £350 for a refurb unit, the oil feed pipe further £80,
genuine parts add another £500 to that bill, on the petrol prince engines febi and FAI good gear,, would never use anything else put genuine parts on bmw n47 diesels,
if engine oil damaged its so much more gets hurt , hence why should always check oil pressure when engine is hot to gauge what what is in there etc, ie might find oil pump and crankshaft is screwed and even camshafts and head in worst cases, then its thousands possibly,
Sounds like I should of bought a Honda 😂
 

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i wish id of kept the 200K freelander (no problems at all) and bought my parents a replacement car when theres blew up ,instead of giving the freelander to them and buying the mini,would of been cheaper
 

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Sounds like I should of bought a Honda 😂
yep honda civic type R that said they do have their problems with the oil fed v-tec and inlet air regulator valve and pipe work, but most of that caused by lack of service , trouble is people think that because they bought a prestige bmw product it will be as good as new with 80k and or 7 years plus age on it, nothing is true bullet proof , i dont just do these things i do many other brands with many same sort of issues only way to avoid it is buy new or on pcp , or with a good warranty that dont use the clause wear and tear as being the reason not to honour the claims,
 

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i wish id of kept the 200K freelander (no problems at all) and bought my parents a replacement car when theres blew up ,instead of giving the freelander to them and buying the mini,would of been cheaper
different animals back then, ie freelander was bought up by bmw back then bmw put their 2.0 diesel engine in it and 4 cylinder version of the best diesel engine ever made in my book the M51 that went in the 325tds and 525td E36 cars all i very owned back in the late 1980s to 2002 ish one i have done 280k same chain same drive line and had a hard life, would not touch a land rover these days now its owned by tata see a lot of so expensive issues and engine blow ups, see endless cars on ebay with engine failure due to dpf filter and oil thinning due to failed regens etc, my theory is all car makers agreed to make just as bad as each other cars so customer gets screwed no matter where they spend their money ,, and then they just blame emissions laws etc,
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
yep honda civic type R that said they do have their problems with the oil fed v-tec and inlet air regulator valve and pipe work, but most of that caused by lack of service , trouble is people think that because they bought a prestige bmw product it will be as good as new with 80k and or 7 years plus age on it, nothing is true bullet proof , i dont just do these things i do many other brands with many same sort of issues only way to avoid it is buy new or on pcp , or with a good warranty that dont use the clause wear and tear as being the reason not to honour the claims,
Would you say doing the valve stem seals yourself is a particularly difficult job? Specific tools needed? I'm handy with a set of tools but never been inside an engine
 

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Would you say doing the valve stem seals yourself is a particularly difficult job? Specific tools needed? I'm handy with a set of tools but never been inside an engine
will say this as someone else on this has also pointed out, on these engines with north of 70k and 8 years plus old it will be more than just the seals ,, seals are done also due to seals being done the valves will be in really bad state link below for a couple i done last years and put up on here for ref to help people understand whats involved,, if these were diesel engines then yes just doing stems seals a option without head off ,, but these hurt the valve seats and stems and carbon crud is silly just false economy,,
complicated engine and timing them back up need correct locking tools and other stuff, that said its just a engine at end of day and if get stuck like many others do just ask the question if that makes sense,,
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
will say this as someone else on this has also pointed out, on these engines with north of 70k and 8 years plus old it will be more than just the seals ,, seals are done also due to seals being done the valves will be in really bad state link below for a couple i done last years and put up on here for ref to help people understand whats involved,, if these were diesel engines then yes just doing stems seals a option without head off ,, but these hurt the valve seats and stems and carbon crud is silly just false economy,,
complicated engine and timing them back up need correct locking tools and other stuff, that said its just a engine at end of day and if get stuck like many others do just ask the question if that makes sense,,
will say this as someone else on this has also pointed out, on these engines with north of 70k and 8 years plus old it will be more than just the seals ,, seals are done also due to seals being done the valves will be in really bad state link below for a couple i done last years and put up on here for ref to help people understand whats involved,, if these were diesel engines then yes just doing stems seals a option without head off ,, but these hurt the valve seats and stems and carbon crud is silly just false economy,,
complicated engine and timing them back up need correct locking tools and other stuff, that said its just a engine at end of day and if get stuck like many others do just ask the question if that makes sense,,
Hi Mike so I did the paper test and there was no oil splatter from back of turbo while idling, gave it a couple revs and it just sort of burned the paper. However there was smoke that appeared the same as it did from the exhaust once it had been idling for a bit but this time it just came out the back of the turbo obviously. I have a video but can't post it here. Do you have any idea of what that could point to? Seal inside the turbo? Or just smoke from the cylinders because the valve stems are leaking into the cylinder and causing the smoke to come out the exhaust? After I turned it off it continued to smoke lightly for a couple of minutes
will say this as someone else on this has also pointed out, on these engines with north of 70k and 8 years plus old it will be more than just the seals ,, seals are done also due to seals being done the valves will be in really bad state link below for a couple i done last years and put up on here for ref to help people understand whats involved,, if these were diesel engines then yes just doing stems seals a option without head off ,, but these hurt the valve seats and stems and carbon crud is silly just false economy,,
complicated engine and timing them back up need correct locking tools and other stuff, that said its just a engine at end of day and if get stuck like many others do just ask the question if that makes sense,,
Also, I just pulled plug 3 (3rd from right when facing front of car) and the tip was black and sooty but dry, after that I pulled number 2 ( second from right) and this plug has oil on it, the tip is dry with the same carbon but the threads have a fair bit of oil on them. The tip of this one almost looks like it has little tiny spikey bits coming off it. Potentially valve cover gasket leaking oil past plug into cylinder?
 
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